911 Debate on Coast to Coast Live 8-21

[Xylo]

I'll have to admit that I'm still undecided on the issue. There are a great many things that cannot be explained which occurred on that day, and events in that time period. Compile that with a hap-hazard shoddy investigation, elimination of the evidence and an unbelievable amount of coincidence...and you've got uncertainty. Which is exactly where I am.

 

[trainedobserver]

I'll have to admit that I'm still undecided on the issue. There are a great many things that cannot be explained which occurred on that day, and events in that time period. Compile that with a hap-hazard shoddy investigation, elimination of the evidence and an unbelievable amount of coincidence...and you've got uncertainty. Which is exactly where I am.

Me too. I don't know what exactly happened on 911 but I'm relatively sure that the 911 commission report is not the last word on it.

Hey, and you know what? They have given this generation what the Warren Commission didn't give us. A comic book version of the 911 Commission Report! Yeah ...ain't that great. I would have loved to see the comic book version of the Warren Commission Report with the magic bullet trajectory explained in four color detail for easy consumption.

 

[Sean Elifritz]

[video]http://www.southparkstudios.com/episodes/103775[/video]

 

[Kieran]

Wow you are so seriously misinformed as to what went on on 9/11 it really is making me weep. You really ought to listen to some truly informed people. People who have done some decent research into what went on on that terrible day. Check out the wingtv.net archives for instance. Victor Thorn and Lisa Guliani have done some stellar work into figuring out what went on with Flight 93 for instance. That is something that is not talked about a lot, and just reading or listening to their interviews will give you a totally new insight into what really went on.

Also check out Dave Macgowan's website. He was the first to question what went on on 9/11 on Sept. 12th 2001:

http://www.davesweb.cnchost.com/

Or listen to people like Alan Sabrowsky who used to work for the US Army War College, and kind of knows a few things about intelligence matters. He is no fruitcake. He knows that Israel and maybe the CIA did 9/11. In his mind there is no question about it. Oh, and for the record, he is of Jewish descent.

You might also like to read this article by a ... shock-horror ... Muslim about 9/11:

http://www.ascertainthetruth.com/at...e-evidences&catid=58:the-911-event&Itemid=115

Listen to and read the articles of Michael Collins Piper. He is the one of the most consistent people I know in the patriot/truth community ... and a truly fascinating guy. More of him here:

http://www.michaelcollinspiper.com

and http://www.americanfreepress.net/html/newbabylon_podcast_081710.html

Other things you might want to consider:

(1) The dancing ISRAELIS ... as mentioned in the above article
(2) Larry Silverstein (leaseholder of the WTC towers) was big friends with BENJAMIN NETANYAHU (the architect of the War on Terror. He wrote a book about it in 1986!!!).

Just those two pieces of FACTUAL information should give you pause for thought. Oh, and as I have mentioned before:

When the towers fell, a passport was found on TOP OF THE RUBBLE. A passport belonging to one of the supposed hijackers. I was informed on these forums that "this kind of thing happens" apparently. Well I call that total bull to tell you the truth.

There are so many more strange things that went on that day that I cannot for the life of me understand why that nearly 10 years after the event, people still think that a bunch of Arabs did this. I truly am baffled by this.

But I know whatever I will say will not be accepted by people who want to believe the opposite. You cannot tell people what to believe. So I will leave it here again and just say that one day, Kieran and whoever wants to believe what they believe wrongly about 9/11, you will come to the truth one day, and you will kick yourself ... a lot ... and maybe for a very long time indeed.

Oh and PS: check out the USS Liberty. Israel attacked a US ship in 1967 and tried to sink it. She attacked it with planes, napalm and torpedos. Why?? Because she want to drag the US into another war ... oh ... and to stop the US from finding out about the prisoners she was executing on a beach at the time. One of the survivors of this hideous attack, Phil Tourney (author of a book on the USS Liberty incident) was recently threatened by either an agent of Israel or Mossad-wannabee. Why?? Because he wrote a book that showed how psychopathic Israel can be. But ... I guess thats neither here nor there ...

As always,

paraschtick out ...

oh and pps: Why do people believe that the government are covering up the UFO thing but also believe that the government are telling the truth that a bunch of Arabs who couldn't fly for toffee did 9/11??? I would love to hear an explanation for this ... cos I see a real and very strange disconnect there ... is it because people are anti-islamic??? Hmmm ... I wonder .

Hoping to further your case by posting links to websites isn't going to help you!! My posting was based on real life data fact and evidence accumulated over 10 years from the 1993 attack in New York, to the 2001 attacks in New York. You'd have opinion, there was conspiracy which the United States government, had an involvement in correct.

I have studied and researched both sides of the Argument over the years. Anecdotal evidence from your side will never be taken seriously and that is why the case for 9/11 conspiracy, fails to impress or make an impact beyond the Internet. Your belief can only be supported when the case for it, is proven beyond all doubt.

People that wave your flag have claimed Bin Laden and his supporters were supported and funded by the CIA when the Soviet invasion failed. Well that is an attempt to re-write the history of Afghanistan, the United States in the nineties supported the "Northern Alliance" against Al Qaeda. They were supplied with money and weaponry and it often forgotten the United States twice in the late nineties tried to kill Bin laden in Afghanistan.

A Covert Military US operation to take out Bin laden in the early nineties was only hours away from taking place, but the armed compound were Bin Laden was staying at, had many women and Children inside, so It was called off to prevent an awful shit storm reaction.

President Clinton in the late nineties I believe ordered that Cruise missiles be fired at targets inside the countries of Sudan and Afghanistan. With the aim of taking out Al Qaeda training camps, the killing of Bin laden and his Followers. United States Intelligence sources later confirmed after 2001.The Intel was reliable.

Bin laden was at one of the targets hit, but he had sneaked away in the darkness, before the strike was scheduled to happen. What happened?

Information was leaked by the Pakistan security forces to his followers, and they informed Bin Laden just before the attack. Bin Laden would have perished that night from the impact of the Tomahawk Cruise missiles only that, the United States Government had to inform or notify the Pakistan Government of this action, since it was an ally, and the flight path of the tomahawks to the Afghan land would take them over Pakistan.

Bin Laden declared and vowed to strike the United States after this he was passionate and wanted revenge. Now from what I have just said do you still think Bin Laden is a CIA Trained operative?

A bunch of Arabs?

Men of Middle Eastern background have Hijacked commercial planes in the 70's and 80's, it not a new and unseen phenomenon.

Are you really suggesting it was impossible for 11 men to have booked flights, for that day, and then have hijacked those planes by using box cutters . Honestly, truly do you believe that?

What's so impossible about it, if you do?

All they had to do is show up at the checking desk hand over there language wait and then board. The planes they hijacked we're not military planes they were civilian aircraft carrying civilians who lived normal everyday routines.

Civilians are not heroes they were mostly likely very frightened and intimidated by the hijackers.

Think about it!! Airline Hijackings up to that time never involved planes crashing into buildings, it was unheard of. The passengers were probably thinking they would survive, once the demands were met, but unfortunately those hijackings was to get something from a demand, it was done to sent a message to the United States.

A passport belonging to a hijacker was found in the rubble. What are you trying to claim here?
Wouldn't that just prove a Hijacker was actually aboard the Airliner when it crashed into the tower? I read some information on this, and it Seems a number of Passports were found burned and damaged, so it becomes less of a conspiracy in that context. And according to some reports, the Passport in question was found a few blocks away from that area.

At the end of the day. Everyone saw a commercial plane hit the second tower. It hit and never came out which surprised me I would believed it would have kept on going out the other end, just like in the movies, reality seemly is very different.

Now we have a go to, we can compare this scene so to speak with the attack on the Pentagon.

Everyone pretty much agrees two planes hit the Twin Towers and both planes were captured on video one event was live on TV the other event was captured footage. Two planes hit straight on and nothing of the planes was left nothing came back out the other side. Same think happened at the Pentagon the plane hit the wall and just was engulfed and it blow up.

But the difference is with the Twin towers and the Pentagon. At the Pentagon there is physical evidence a plane hit the wall. The twin towers there is no evidence of planes hitting them, only for that it was captured on video.

Wreckage from a plane can be clearly seen in Photographs near the blast area right beside the fire-engine. The metal wreckage is marked with the colouring of an American Airlines plane , if wasn't, an attack by a plane then were did that metal come from, which by chance, had the colouring of an American Airlines plane?

I took a look at the Photographs again from that day, while putting together this post. There is no doubt in my mind what crashed there was one of the Hijacked planes. I spotted another Photograph which showed some rusty parts from an Aircraft engine, Those parts were pulled from the Pentagon impact collapsed wall.

Anyway, I'm not going to comment further on 9/11. The United States took there eye of the ball when it came to terrorism, and the failure of the FBI and the CIA to share information is what caused and enabled the attacks to occur, end of story.

 

[pixelsmith]

Anyway, I'm not going to comment further on 9/11. The United States took there eye of the ball when it came to terrorism, and the failure of the FBI and the CIA to share information is what caused and enabled the attacks to occur, end of story.

Typical hit and run reply. "I'm not going to comment further on 9/11..."

Things are rarely as they seem.


Why don't we arm our military with box cutters?!? Heck, a whole ammo belt full of box cutters even!!!

And the best demolition companies can now take down the tallest of buildings AND drop them into their own footprint with a book of matches and some office furniture!

 

[Christopher O'Brien]

And as you see it all mixes together with the same types: witness the Louis Jarvis ravings about the 9/11 topic. According to Christopher O'Brien, all of Jarvis' research is "meticulously documented".

Yeah Lance, Louis' files are beyond impressive. He likes hard copies and copies/saves all his research correspondence. And he has spread much if it around to the movers and shakers in politics, religion and spiritual lineages. The Paracast is headed down a "dark and silly path?" Maybe in your mind, but at least if he's right (which I doubt he is, btw) I'll be able to get him to tell us all "I told you so" as the world ends and you and many others check off to neverneverland...

 

[Xylo]

Everyone pretty much agrees two planes hit the Twin Towers and both planes were captured on video one event was live on TV the other event was captured footage. Two planes hit straight on and nothing of the planes was left nothing came back out the other side. Same think happened at the Pentagon the plane hit the wall and just was engulfed and it blow up.

Except for an almost pristine passport, don't forget.

This is why I remain uncertain. Both sides of the 9/11 argument make good points. But within a great deal of those points are little inconsistencies which add up to a great big question mark. Both sides also overlook evidence, or consciously ignore it, or move on to the next point without discussion of the previous.

Doing any sort of serious research into this subject is nigh impossible any more, as the source material is obscured and quoted, misquoted, generalized, categorized and used to support some of the most ridiculous arguments...but I digress. The truth will never be known.

What is known is the results of the attacks and the multinational carnage that ensued, as well as the usurpation of various freedoms which were guaranteed by the Bill of Rights (for those of us in the USA.)

 

[paraschtick]

Hoping to further your case by posting links to websites isn't going to help you!! My posting was based on real life data fact and evidence accumulated over 10 years from the 1993 attack in New York, to the 2001 attacks in New York. You'd have opinion, there was conspiracy which the United States government, had an involvement in correct.

Anyway, I'm not going to comment further on 9/11. The United States took there eye of the ball when it came to terrorism, and the failure of the FBI and the CIA to share information is what caused and enabled the attacks to occur, end of story.

How you have put it sounds all very well. Unfortunately, it all falls down when you take into consideration a number of things that cannot be explained away. First of all, the collapse of the towers. Noone has any idea how they collapsed. How they turned to dust. How the central columns in the towers were somehow compromised by jet fuel that burns off rather quickly and at a temperature too low to burn them. The squibs that are seen to go off when the towers collapse. The molten liquid pouring out of at least one level of one of the towers.

[I take it that although most of the filing cabinets, people, computers etc were turned to dust, the passports were somehow made of some mystical material then ...]

The explosions that were heard by witnesses before the towers came down. The dancing Israelis who when they went back to ISRAEL admitted to having "documented the event". The van that was commandeered near the George Washington bridge that was full of explosives. The 200 or so ISRAELI "art students" who were sent home without being charged with anything. The put options that were traced to Israeli dealers. The Odigo instant messages (Odigo being an Israeli company). The steel from the Twin Towers which were sent off to China before anyone could look at them ... by an Israeli company. It goes on and on and on ...

The Pentagon. So you're saying that some Arabs who apparently could hardly fly a small aircraft were capable of flying a very large sophisticated aircraft flying at a high speed, at a very very low altitude (we're talking 20 or 30 feet tops here) into the Pentagon ... without touching the grass in front of the Pentagon ... and only hitting a few street lights before hitting the Pentagon itself.

In those Pentagon pictures, you may also notice some "plane" debris ... yes. Unfortunately if you look closer you will see only one engine. Hmmm. And its an engine that is too small for the plane that was supposed to have hit. So ... are you saying that once a plane hits a building, most of it (there was no trace of the really big wings by the way) evaporates, one of its engines mysteriously vanishes, and the other shrinks in some magical way???

Oh and if as you say that some parts were "rusty" why was the plane even allowed to get off the ground in the first place???

A few more things. Why did Norad stand down? Why weren't ANY fighter planes scrambled that day?? Why did the BBC report that WTC 7 was collapsing 20 minutes before it actually did ...

Oh and when I finally figured out what box cutters were ... well ... I had to giggle really. Americans aren't so tough as they sound are they???

Oh dear. I'll keep throwing all these anomalies out there until someone listens I guess. Its the most I can do to make sure some people one day wake up and smell the coffee. And I shall take the word of someone like Alan Sabrowsky and the guys at Veterans Today before I take the word from someone on an internet forum who is unfortunately naive to how the world really works.

[Oh and those hijackings in the 70s etc ... you'll find that at least one of the them: the Entebbe one ... was orchestrated by MOSSAD. Sometimes these things are dirtier, nastier and scarier than you could ever suppose.

Case in point. I recently saw a link on a website I frequent almost daily to a website that was called something like "filthystinkingjews.com". Now although I despise Zionism, hate what is going on in Gaza, believe that Israel was partly to blame for 9/11, I thought that this was a bit ... strong. So I had a look at the website and did some digging around. Now the website itself was the usual Israelis are evil, Zionism is evil sort of website. Nothing especially strange there but it wasn't greatly anti-semitic in any real sense.

And then I started doing some digging around. I figured out that the website used an application that was created by Israelis who worked for a company that was based in Israel. Tel Aviv, I think. Hmmm ... strange ... now why would an ostensibly anti-zionist website use an Israeli application? Very odd. I then did some more digging around and it turned out that this website was set up by Israelis ... hmmm. And one of those Israelis had worked for major Israeli newspapers and websites!

In other words, this website was designed to pull people to it who were anti-zionist ... and then I guess in some time in the future, the rug would have been pulled out from the under the people who frequent the site, and they would be deemed to be anti-semitic by associating with it. I sent a note to this anti-zionist website I mentioned at the beginning of this little account, and they removed the link from their website. So ... they understood it too. Things out there are sometimes a bit stranger and more complicated than most people understand. False flag operations go on all the time, and in a number of guises.

Just something to hopefully make you guys out there understand that things are never as they seem on the surface. Like a bunch of Arabs hijacking planes and flying them into buildings. ]

 

[Angel of Ioren]

I try my best to stay away from this ridiculous argument, because much like the moon landing hoax nutters, people that think that the 9/11 attacks were anything but what we all saw that day make my head hurt. Perhaps we don't know the ins and outs of how Al-Qaeda planned it all, but we do know they crashed the planes into the towers and the Pentagon. Anyone thinking that was faked is delusional.

I blame ass-hats like Alex Jones and Jason Bermas. You all know that Loose Change started life as a work of fiction and they decided that since they were horrible writers they could try passing it off as a documentary, right? People seem to have bought it. Intellectual, rational thought seems to have lost out when it comes to Truthers. They seem to be looking for an alternate truth that they will never find because they're not looking at the facts.

 

[cottonzway]

Weak.......

 

[Sean Elifritz]

Weak.......

Yep, reality should start taking some steroids. Would be more fun that way.

 

[cottonzway]

Yep, reality should start taking some steroids. Would be more fun that way.

Meh.

*insert random ad-hominem attack*

 

[pixelsmith]

I try my best to stay away from this ridiculous argument, because much like the moon landing hoax nutters, people that think that the 9/11 attacks were anything but what we all saw that day make my head hurt. Perhaps we don't know the ins and outs of how Al-Qaeda planned it all, but we do know they crashed the planes into the towers and the Pentagon. Anyone thinking that was faked is delusional.

I blame ass-hats like Alex Jones and Jason Bermas. You all know that Loose Change started life as a work of fiction and they decided that since they were horrible writers they could try passing it off as a documentary, right? People seem to have bought it. Intellectual, rational thought seems to have lost out when it comes to Truthers. They seem to be looking for an alternate truth that they will never find because they're not looking at the facts.

It is indeed a ridiculous argument. Anyone with half a brain should be able to see it did not happen the way the 9/11 commission said it did.

 

[vonmazur]

It is indeed a ridiculous argument. Anyone with half a brain should be able to see it did not happen the way the 9/11 commission said it did.

Just the facts, not personal attacks......I guess that logic is not taught in the schools anymore, along with the rules of formal debating...All lost to the Net and modern sensibilities

Just what about the attacks requires the dismissal of scientific parsimony, and the embrace of speculation?? Even if the Commission covered up or distorted certain items, what leads to the speculation??

Dale

 

[ALPHA ROMEO UNIFORM]

Just the facts, not personal attacks......I guess that logic is not taught in the schools anymore, along with the rules of formal debating...All lost to the Net and modern sensibilities

Just what about the attacks requires the dismissal of scientific parsimony, and the embrace of speculation?? Even if the Commission covered up or distorted certain items, what leads to the speculation??

Dale

Logic/Common Sense taught at school today na teachers to busy on facbook , watching big brother and dancing shows

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Just the facts, not personal attacks......I guess that logic is not taught in the schools anymore, along with the rules of formal debating...All lost to the Net and modern sensibilities

Just what about the attacks requires the dismissal of scientific parsimony, and the embrace of speculation?? Even if the Commission covered up or distorted certain items, what leads to the speculation??

Dale

It's because conspiracies sell more books, second rate videos, and air time. I'm glad the Paracast stays away from having truthers on as a guests.

---------- Post added at 08:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:32 AM ----------

Meh.

*insert random ad-hominem attack*

I try to stay away from attacks on people, but I think Alex Jones and Jason Bermas are responsible for creating doubt where there should be none. However, you're right, I should not attack them directly. I let the evidence speak for itself and people can decide with that.

 

[pixelsmith]

I let the evidence speak for itself and people can decide with that.

Thats exactly what I think as well. The FACTS speak volumes. The FACTS indicate conspiracy.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Thats exactly what I think as well. The FACTS speak volumes. The FACTS indicate conspiracy.

You're absolutely right - a KNOWN conspiracy by an organization using religion to attack and terrify a country it considers a threat.

 

[pixelsmith]

you are absolutely right, one Nation under God...

like i said before, lets arm our troops with simple box cutters, you can cripple the most powerful Nation in the world with just a few of them. imagine what we could do if every soldier had a belt full of them.

pentagon vs a 99 cent box cutter.... who do you think will win? LMAO!

 

[Angel of Ioren]

you are absolutely right, one Nation under God...

like i said before, lets arm our troops with simple box cutters, you can cripple the most powerful Nation in the world with just a few of them. imagine what we could do if every soldier had a belt full of them.

pentagon vs a 99 cent box cutter.... who do you think will win? LMAO!

Just to correct you, I said organization, not nation.