Santa Barbara Shooting Hoax

[BoyintheMachine]

You said you're "formatting a theory," and you're way out of line here. Let's just move away from this since this isn't something I expect to see evidence for, or at least real evidence.

Yes, Gene I was formatting a theory. I don't take theories personal. I discard them when they can't be proven. However, If we aren't able to discuss pretty much anything without threats of shutting down the discussion then I don't know how your forum will ever grow, nor do I understand how you wish to attract posters to your forum. People are not going to feel comfortable posting when the owner keeps popping in trying to shut down topics he doesn't like or believe in.

And this is the conspiracy section at that, the place for this discussion.

 

[Muadib]

Can you prove this claim?

No because it makes no sense, think about it, after the last couple of school shootings, when the country was basically in a national debate about gun control, they tried to pass gun control legislation and even after those tragedies, it didn't work. So why in the world would they bother to do the same thing again, on a much smaller scale, when it clearly didn't work the first time around, even though the circumstances were much worse? If the shooting up of an elementary school doesn't get gun control passed, then why in the world would these shadowy government operatives think that it's going to work this time?

Also, what need is there for fake victims? You don't think that if your daughter was killed in a mass shooting incident you might have something to say on gun control, maybe as a way to use the tragedy of your daughters death to accomplish some good in the world? Maybe you wouldn't, but obviously this guy has, and many others who have been victims of unrelated types of crimes have done the same thing, look up Meghan's Law, the Adam Walsh Child Protection and Safety Act, or the mother who crusaded for stricter controls on online doctors and pharmacies after her underage son died of a drug overdose from pills he obtained over the internet.

It's actually not strange at all for people to want what they perceive as some good (whether you agree it's good or not is irrelevant, obviously they do) to come out of a senseless tragedy like this, you question their motives because they're attacking a subject that you have strong opinions on, and that's it.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Yes, Gene I was formatting a theory. I don't take theories personal. I discard them when they can't be proven. However, If we aren't able to discuss pretty much anything without threats of shutting down the discussion then I don't know how your forum will ever grow, nor do I understand how you wish to attract posters to your forum. People are not going to feel comfortable posting when the owner keeps popping in trying to shut down topics he doesn't like or believe in.

Please stop misquoting and misrepresenting what I said. I would close this down because certain posters are making it personal and engaging in speculation that is not only unwarranted but in extremely poor taste. Get it right please.

 

[marduk]

You said you're "formatting a theory," and you're way out of line here. Let's just move away from this since this isn't something I expect to see evidence for, or at least real evidence.

I agree.

Implying that some of the victims are not real without evidence to back that claim is deeply insulting and dehumanizing to the victims of this tragedy.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Exactly.

 

[BoyintheMachine]

Implying that some of the victims are not real without evidence to back that claim is deeply insulting and dehumanizing to the victims of this tragedy.

I never implied that nobody died nor that nobody was hurt. This is stuff you are making up and accusing me off.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Then stop telling us about the wacky theory you're formatting. It's over!

 

[BoyintheMachine]

Then stop telling us about the wacky theory you're formatting. It's over!

I only mentioned it in one comment, Gene! And I was directing it at Charlie and asking for his input. It's not even something I stand behind at this point. Why you are making it seem like that's all I talk about?

 

[Charlie Prime]

That theory is that these tragedies are real but that the "powers that be", are quickly sending in "fake victims" and "fake family/friends/witneses" to be included with the real victims and real family/friends of the real victims and then these fake victims/family/witnesses then make sure to hog the media spotlight to push for an anti-gun agenda. What do you think about that?

I believe that theory would be difficult to support. Every time I looked into that theory I dug around and found that the victims who theorists claimed to be "crisis actors" were indeed real people.

The problem is that these events range across a scale from completely genuine to completely fabricated. It's very difficult to discern which is which, and unless you were personally involved, you can never know for certain. We are thus left with only probabilities.

Examples: I believe the Rodger shooting, the University of Texas tower sniper, and Sandy Hook were real events. The Boston Bombing was "helped along". Oklahoma City was completely staged with McVey sacrificing himself to save his family.

To learn the secret of how the small ones are done, you have to study big historical examples like the Lusitania, Gulf of Tonkin, Iraq's WMDs, etc. It takes decades for the truth to come out, so it's a waste of time to study recent events.

In fact, once you know that some media events are staged and others managed, it is somewhat a waste of time to study them. I only do it in passing, for diversion. A more educational study is understanding how Divide ut Regnes is used to manage populations. That's big, and takes years of study to fully appreciate.

 

[Goggs Mackay]

Tell you what, perhaps someone got the wrong impression of something someone else said, etc but let's just leave it there regardless. As of now there probably won't be any meaningful discussion on the topic so....

 

[BoyintheMachine]

I believe that theory would be difficult to support. Every time I looked into that theory I dug around and found that the victims who theorists claimed to be "crisis actors" were indeed real people.

The problem is that these events range across a scale from completely genuine to completely fabricated. It's very difficult to discern which is which, and unless you were personally involved, you can never know for certain. We are thus left with only probabilities.

Examples: I believe the Rodger shooting, the University of Texas tower sniper, and Sandy Hook were real events. The Boston Bombing was "helped along". Oklahoma City was completely staged with McVey sacrificing himself to save his family.

To learn the secret of how the small ones are done, you have to study big historical examples like the Lusitania, Gulf of Tonkin, Iraq's WMDs, etc. It takes decades for the truth to come out, so it's a waste of time to study recent events.

In fact, once you know that some media events are staged and others managed, it is somewhat a waste of time to study them. I only do it in passing, for diversion. A more educational study is understanding how Divide ut Regnes is used to manage populations. That's big, and takes years of study to fully appreciate.

Well, beg to differ on the OKC bombing. I live here and I can tell you stories. Unfortunately it was not staged and many people, including children, died. However, it's a big conspiracy for sure and people have no clue all that went on. It's pretty much forgotten now. All people know about now is 911. I truly think that OKC was supposed to be the 911 but it didn't go down right or have the effect that was intended. Most people don't even know we had an Al Qaeda cell here in OKC at the time of the bombing. McVeigh was unfortunately not innocent. He just wasn't the mastermind. They made him the patsy.

I don't think she has made any public statements, but the rumor here is that Jayna Davis left OKC and took a position in I believe Chicago, due to death threats and harassment over her investigation.

Jayna wrote a book called, The Third Terrorist, the title being a reference to "John Doe #2", who was described by countless witnesses as a middle-eastern man who accompanied McVeigh. The authorities claimed he didn't exist and that the dozens of witnesses were mistaken, even though he was allegedly even captured on video with McVeigh. This footage was never released to the public.

Here's the media reports that say that tapes exist that show that McVeigh was not acting alone.

 

[mike]

Mike, your reading comprehension skills are extremely poor. I've already explained this several times now. Your beef with me is personal at this point.

Get real, you start a thread titled "Santa Barbara shooting hoax"
Your first post lists 11 things that are odd in your opinion, which in the context of the title can only be interpreted as supporting the premise clearly stated in the title, and when ppl call you out on this your reaction is

A Sociopath, also known as an Antisocial Personality Disorder, is a member of a diagnostic group known as ‘Personality Disorders‘ Without question, an Antisocial Personality is well aware they are telling a lie and in fact, lie very purposefully in an attempt to manipulate others, deny personal responsibility, escape the consequences of their behavior, or place them at some advantage. Telling a lie is always an option for an Antisocial Personality, especially when their behavior has caused them some social or personal difficulties.

The moment your attempt to paint this tragic event as a hoax backfires and ppl call you out, you lie about what you meant.

The only one who believes your lies is you, as evidenced by the responses you've had.

Perhaps you would care to tell the audience here why you included the word HOAX in the thread title ?

 

[Charlie Prime]

Well, beg to differ on the OKC bombing.

No. You misunderstand me. When I say "staged" I mean the event was set up, not that the event fake.

Definition: staged
1 : to produce (as a play) on a stage
2 : to produce or cause to happen for public view or public effect <stage a track meet> <stage a hunger strike>

I believe the man in the truck with McVeigh was German intelligence agent Andreas Strassmeir. This is why the FBI deleted all the video of the truck traveling through Oklahoma City from the scores of video surveillance tapes they seized from businesses in the area.

Every time these events happen people scramble atop the pile of bodies to scream for their pet cause; gun control, psychiatric medication reform, etc. That fact is not an indication the event was staged.

 

[Han]

In my opinion it would be more respectful to wait until the victims were in the ground, before starting a thread regarding doubts you may have about the incident.
Freedom of speech is important but so is respect, honestly the only reason I have read this topic is because I was suprised to see it up in the first place (so soon after the incident).
Just to be clear I have no criticism of your thoughts because you are free to think as you will, but publishing them in a public forum is a different matter because it belongs to everyone.

 

[BoyintheMachine]

In my opinion it would be more respectful to wait until the victims were in the ground, before starting a thread regarding doubts you may have about the incident.
Freedom of speech is important but so is respect, honestly the only reason I have read this topic is because I was suprised to see it up in the first place (so soon after the incident).
Just to be clear I have no criticism of your thoughts because you are free to think as you will, but publishing them in a public forum is a different matter because it belongs to everyone.

That's not what this thread is about. If you read the opening post it's clearly a heads up that this topic is the latest conspiracy theory of the week. I've now had to repeat this several times and I do believe it's due to people posting without reading the thread.

I've already stated my opinion that whenever there's a tragedy anti-gun activists immediately jump on it.

 

[Bob Watson]

May I suggest speaking private with a moderator explain the topic. Then have the topic renamed. Simple. .

Sent from my SCH-I435 using Tapatalk

 

[BoyintheMachine]

No. You misunderstand me. When I say "staged" I mean the event was set up, not that the event fake.



I believe the man in the truck with McVeigh was German intelligence agent Andreas Strassmeir. This is why the FBI deleted all the video of the truck traveling through Oklahoma City from the scores of video surveillance tapes they seized from businesses in the area.

Every time these events happen people scramble atop the pile of bodies to scream for their pet cause; gun control, psychiatric medication reform, etc. That fact is not an indication the event was staged.

Jayna Davis identifies him as someone else and she talks about it in the video. Whoever he is, he is most likely working for the U.S. government as that would be the main reason to lie and cover-it up.

You are right, it is usually the anti-gun activists who do try to take it over and make it support their cause. However, I never said this proves it is fake or a hoax or staged in any way.

 

[Han]

I've already stated my opinion that whenever there's a tragedy anti-gun activists immediately jump on it.

let me get what you are saying right because my comprehension skills seem to be flawed in your opinion. are you saying that anti-gun activists immediately jump on any tragedy? or just those that involve shooting?

 

[Bonzo4880]

Whether it's a hoax is neither here nor there now. Not a week goes by now where we don't hear about a shooting of some sort. Just shy of 2 weeks ago we had two police officers ambushed and killed while eating their lunch here in Vegas. The Police are not the enemy no matter how you slice it. There are good cops and bad cops and the good cops far outnumber the bad cops. Some officers have no business being cops and unfortunately they ruin it for all of the good cops. I feel our country is going to hell in a hand basket but that's not a reason for me to go around just shooting a bunch of random people. These shooters are wack-jobs plain and simple. Wack-jobs will never go away but now with social media and camera phones it is much easier for these crazies to get the recognition they so desire.

 

[Tyger]

I feel our country is going to hell in a hand basket but that's not a reason for me to go around just shooting a bunch of random people.

Not so - you have to have gone through the 1960's to fully appreciate how stable we are now. Just saw on PBS last night a documentary on the Attica Prison inmate uprising in 1971 - that brings home forcefully the bad 'ol days. We still have a far ways to go but the stress of the moment can cloud the truth that we have improved.