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Tea party holding the US as hostage ?

Government shutdown after midnight ?

  • Yes

    Votes: 5 55.6%
  • No

    Votes: 3 33.3%
  • Maybe

    Votes: 1 11.1%

  • Total voters
    9

Jeff Davis

Paranormal Adept
While not true that an ambulance service would leave someone behind who didn't have health insurance, I have heard that not having an insurance card in your wallet could determine which hospital you are taken. I can't think of it now, but there is a term for the process of checking a patients wallet for an insurance card. "Cold search" or some such term. Let's be honest though- while you won't get turned down for care- those with good insurance will surely get the better care, all around.

Stagger,
If you go back and check, I edited my post that I acted like a proud bragger within, wrote Mike a formal apology, and will admit here and now, that I am the BIGGEST FRICKIN' IDIOT ON THE PLANET.

I am so disappointed in myself, that since I found out after talking to the operations manager this morning, at the Company I eluded to doing business with yesterday, I found out that I was honestly DEAD WRONG. Your post is just the courage I needed.

Don't get me wrong, the matter is absolute urban legend, but honestly, I can't stand to knowingly mislead people so here is the TRUTH, and not my previously expressed premature IGNORANCE which was due to confusing another billing aspect of this Ambulance company with whom I talk to daily. I should have known better than to speak up when uncertain, even though last night, I did believe I was certain. I HATE my impulsiveness as it's so subjective and annoying to even me!

This particular EMT service BILLS THE PATIENT DIRECTLY. If the patient does not have insurance, they are referred to technically as "private pay". HOWEVER, there has NEVER been a time within the history of EMT operations wherein the driver arbitrarily decides whether to transport the patient or not. That much is total BS. That's all I am going to state here. I SO DEEPLY APOLOGIZE to EVERYONE. I did not mean to deceive you, but there you have it.

I'm pretty F'ed in head, but I've done OK for an honest loser, lol! :D
 

Jeff Davis

Paranormal Adept
I admire a guy who admits when they are wrong and is man enough to apologize.

Pixel,
I still can't believe it. I wrote Mike just as soon as I talked with Greg this morning. If my lower jaw was made of glass, we wouldn't be having this conversation right now, cause let me tell you, it HIT THE FLOOR when I found out I was wrong. I lost all wind. Goodbye. That will teach me to get emotionally embroiled in matters such as these, when in reality, it's the paranormal that I am honestly most interested in. I gotta learn to stick with that.
 

Stagger Lee

Paranormal Adept
ah, no worries Jeff. Even the "wallet biopsy" is something I have heard before, but can't say from experience. I always thought it was common knowledge that the level of care you received could depend on the type of insurance, or lack of. Sure, no one can be "turned away" -but the level of care issue is one that would concern me if a member of my family happened to be uninsured. Something I will have to deal with this summer when my employer removes my dependents from my health plan.
 

mike

Paranormal Adept
The liberal media goons have the nerve to call this an "urban legend". :rolleyes:

AUSTRALIAN PRIME MINISTER TELL MUSLIMS..TAKE IT OR LEAVE!

Yep, seems like a cultural melting pot to me. That is as long as each cultures on it's own burner. It's YOU that has to be joking. I am thinking quite truthfully, that you just support the left aspect of what is primarily a govern mentally conservative majority populous. :D

Ok now we need to look at this link carefully.
For starters thats ex PM kevin rudd, His own party deposed him then brought him back just prior to our last election because he was popular with the public.
They lost anyway.
Its true he did say those wanting sharia law should go to a country where they have it, we wont be having it here.

But the rest of that piece is simply the opinion of the blogger, not the PM past or present.

We have laws down here about racial vilification, the KKK could not exist here, they would be illegal.
Your right to free speach doesnt extent to hate speach and discrimination based on race

Race Discrimination Commissioner delivers address

It may sound an odd to say ‘we’ about what was a defining moment in the American civil rights movement’s fight to end racial segregation and discrimination. And, yet, as anyone who has ever seen or heard those soaring words of Dr King will know, it is only natural to use the word ‘we’. For how could anyone deny the universal power of Dr King’s dream – of a society in which people weren’t judged by the colour of their skin, but the content of their character?
If our moral sympathies are piqued by what was ultimately an American moment, it was also because it had global import. The American Civil Rights movement was, of course, part of a larger international struggle to end racial discrimination. A struggle that culminated with the International Convention on the Elimination of all Forms of Racial Discrimination coming into force in 1969.
It was Australia’s signature to this convention that preceded the introduction of the Racial Discrimination Act in our Commonwealth parliament in 1975. This piece of law was, in turn, an expression of a new sensibility in Australian political culture; a recognition that Australia was a country that was multicultural.
It was forty years ago that the word multicultural was introduced to our national vocabulary. Though the word was borrowed from Canada, it nonetheless had an unmistakable Australian accent when the then immigration minister Al Grassby used it for the first time. As Grassby put it, multiculturalism was about expanding the family of the nation. It wasn’t about repudiating an Australian national identity. It was about ensuring that our national identity could adapt to the new diversity brought about by waves of mass immigration from Europe.
Multiculturalism
If one takes a long view of Australian multiculturalism, it is hard to argue against its success. Australian society performs admirably when placed alongside other countries in the West which have had to contend with mass immigration. The Australian model works, and works well.
As political historian Robert Manne has described it, there is near universal acknowledgement that “the painless acceptance of millions of non-Anglo-Celtic migrants from the four corners of the Earth represents one of Australia’s great political and social achievements”. Indeed, this is something even many critics of multiculturalism readily concede.

I love our multicultural model, its like the whole planet is represented right here, proof positive our cultural differences can blend more or less seamlessly, people of all races and creed living together in peace.
When you live inside such a model you get a sense there is hope for humanity still, weve done it here, we can do it globally

Is it perfect ?, of course not we have issues as the ex PM's quote shows, but thats a mouses piss in the ocean compared to the great social achievment australian multiculturalism is.

Living within this model i can firmly attest, this is how racism dies................
 

Jeff Davis

Paranormal Adept
Ok now we need to look at this link carefully.
For starters thats ex PM kevin rudd, His own party deposed him then brought him back just prior to our last election because he was popular with the public.
They lost anyway.
Its true he did say those wanting sharia law should go to a country where they have it, we wont be having it here.

But the rest of that piece is simply the opinion of the blogger, not the PM past or present.

We have laws down here about racial vilification, the KKK could not exist here, they would be illegal.

I am truly unaware of any racial vilification within what I used to demonstrate Australia's position relevant to what my original point was. Is there white supremacists BS in there? If that is any way represented in your mind, by what I proposed within the content of that link, I deeply apologize. To separate signal from noise here, my point was, was this a REAL event or not? You answered that question. Making my point in this case "validated". Where is the race thing coming from here anyway? Where's that coming from? I certainly hope that you are in no way suggesting that I am suggesting ideologies or personal reflections that indicate "racism". Philosophically I am assuredly predisposed to a mono cultural position, however, that in NO WAY shape or form demonstrates, nor supports, "racism". When many people, of all different ethnicity, share common themes with respect for what are familiar basic schools of knowledge. The result as a collective demonstrates what we typically call society. That design gets degraded, or rather eroded, to extinction level status, by the corruption of that very design. This pattern repeats itself throughout nature continually. Our very mortality is one such prime example.







Your right to free speach doesnt extent to hate speach and discrimination based on race

Race Discrimination Commissioner delivers address



I love our multicultural model, its like the whole planet is represented right here, proof positive our cultural differences can blend more or less seamlessly, people of all races and creed living together in peace.
When you live inside such a model you get a sense there is hope for humanity still, weve done it here, we can do it globally

Is it perfect ?, of course not we have issues as the ex PM's quote shows, but thats a mouses piss in the ocean compared to the great social achievment australian multiculturalism is.

Living within this model i can firmly attest, this is how racism dies................

Whereas I respect your ideologies in terms of an attractive design, it's one that seems to me, greatly lacking in functionality within the context of the direction your gun is pointing here. In fact, I am starting to think that it's not really that far away from our own bi-partisan system. You, here, within these last few posts, seem to have switched gears with respect to the core issue that we started with in utter agreement. Namely, the failed system of debt that we (read:USA) currently live within, as your link demonstrated and substantiated perfectly, just two days ago. That's where we started.

Now, I'm getting just a slight whiff here of a "left", or "liberal" juxtapositioning coming into play here with respect to your own political orientation? Is it accurate to suppose, that there might be at least TWO major perspectives with respect to your voting base? Oh my.

Ask yourself this if you could please: As a hard working, tax paying citizen within this failed system that your link so absolutely demonstrates, how are we going to fix the problem by increasing our debt load? Some problems don't fix easy Sir. No matter how ideologically pretty a picture we might wish to paint. That's the jungle. To deny nature Mike, is to deny responsibility for our very sentient condition. I won't do that, nor will I encourage it. I am not a Repubulican, I'm a Responsibilican.

See: Where do you fit in as a believer or skeptic? | Page 3 | The Paracast Community Forums

We are all a distorted reflection of ourselves at times. For that much I apologize again. It's the nature of that propagandizing, self deceiving, ego. Peace.
 

mike

Paranormal Adept
I wasnt accusing you of racial vilification, rather i was pointing out that tolerance has been codified into our laws here, such is our commitment to wiping out discrimination including racial discrimination.
I also wanted to point out the text you ascribed to our ex PM was in fact not his words but that of the blogger who used just one quote of his before launching into her own opinion piece.
You gave me the impression you thought these were the PM's sentiments, they are not.

I have no political interests, i dont even vote , and its mandatory down here. I'd rather pay the fine than waste my time on polling day.
I do make comentary on occasion on specific policys like the carbon tax, but thats to do with specific issues, not politics in general.
I'm of the view it doesnt matter who you vote for the govt always seems to get in :D

Nature has its place, i have very firm views about protecting our environment, but i also believe its our destiny to transcend the natural world.(leaving it as we found it hopefully)

To be honest i dont think you can fix your problem, funnily enough because of human nature

You are addicted to debt now.

You dont pay down a debt by borrowing more money, Dr Phil knows this , its pretty simple stuff
You either tighten your belt and or start earning more
In the case of the US problem earning more means raising taxes, tightening your belt is cutting services

But...... If a presidential candidate ran on the platform of higher taxes and less services...... (which is how you tackle debt)
They would not be voted in

Instead, and this has been happening in the US for decades, they promise more services and less taxes, that gets them the votes.
How do they do this magic trick ? they borrow the money to keep those promises.
They get what they want, you the voters get what you want, and we just ignore the numbers ticking away, we kick that can down the road

U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

There is no such thing as a free lunch

But if you were to go out on the streets right now wearing a sandwhich board saying "Taxation is your subscription to civilisation" "we should be paying more Tax"

You'd likely get your bum kicked by an angry mob.
The very initials IRS fill you with dark thoughts, pappy tatum used a shotgun to keep em off his mountain
Kissin' Cousins (1964) - IMDb
As was depicted as a social hero instead of tax dodging bludger and thief.

You know what the solution is, buts is been so deeply culturally ingrained in you to reject it.

Down here the liberal party govt left office in 2007 with a budget surplus
The labour party won office in 2007 and ran up a deficit of 300 billion
They just got hammered at the election by the libs who ran on a platform of bringing the budget back to surplus

I cant ever seeing that happening in the US.

One the means of doing it is deeply unpopular, and two the debt is so great it would be almost impossible to pay.

All you can do is kick the can down the road and hope the bubble doesnt burst in your lifetime
 

Burnt State

Paranormal Adept
Taxation is your subscription to civilisation.
Probably one of the best lines I've read at the forum, period. What I really like is the implications of what we define as 'civilized.'

But the cost of public health care is peanuts, and the return in terms of quality of life and a healthy happy society is something money just cant buy.
Some facts are clear: societies that try to minimize the gaps in privilege amongst its classes are less violent, have less crime and are more productive than those societies that create gaps between the rich and poor. When you care about everyone's health, no matter who they are, then you have something that can definitely be called civilized. Unfortunately, America does not believe in the redistribution of wealth, even on small scales that would lift up the society as a whole.
 

XAF-B-WATERS

Skilled Investigator
Another great Jay Leno line.

"Obama said raising the Debt limit does not raise the Debt-You know, like raising the speed limit
does not increase speed."
 

Michael Allen

Paranormal Adept
Oh, and someone from Fox News admitted today that there was a possible DDOS attack against the New York health care servers. OK, now we have one explanation why the servers are slammed. So if they are being attacked, who are the attackers? Who wants AFA to fail?


Why would Fox News run a story blaming the failures on their own people (yes I am that simple minded, Gene)? This is not a rhetorical question or a question raised to the end of stating an argument. I really am baffled at this.
 

XAF-B-WATERS

Skilled Investigator
October 3rd, Washington Times.

The Obama Administration selectively cutting services for maximum public pain? Why would you paranoid conservatives even think that?
The Washington Times caught up with a federal worker who is sick and tired of being ordered to make the public he serves suffer:
“It’s a cheap way to deal with the situation,” an angry Park Service ranger in Washington says of the harassment. “We’ve been told to make life as difficult for people as we can. It’s disgusting.”
Yes it is, Ranger. Yes it is. And a Petty little man this POTUS is.
 

Tyger

Paranormal Adept
October 3rd, Washington Times.

The Obama Administration selectively cutting services for maximum public pain? Why would you paranoid conservatives even think that?
The Washington Times caught up with a federal worker who is sick and tired of being ordered to make the public he serves suffer:
“It’s a cheap way to deal with the situation,” an angry Park Service ranger in Washington says of the harassment. “We’ve been told to make life as difficult for people as we can. It’s disgusting.”
Yes it is, Ranger. Yes it is. And a Petty little man this POTUS is.

You believe this? You do know that the Washington Times was started and is owned by the Unification Church of Sun Myung Moon? Also, it's funding? LINK: Washington Times - SourceWatch

Fact is, shutting down the government back-fired big time on the Republicans in the mid-90's, as well. This is not a good move. It is not the POTUS who is petty - it is the Republican Party - or elements thereof. We need legislators who respect the law (oddly enough) and don't hold the nation hostage to their hissy-fits. A "cheap way to deal with the situation", indeed - but it is the Republicans who are doing everything "to make life as difficult for people as [they] can". This little anecdote is highly questionable - perhaps out-of-context? - and looks to me like a bit of spin trying to use smoke-and-mirrors to tie the pettiness on the opposite party responsible.

All the pay that gets withheld from the millions of employees forced into lay-off gets paid to them once the government starts up again - nothing is 'saved' doing this, just huge inconvenience (understatement) - plus, the workers that return have a nightmare of back-log work to deal with and massive overtime is a given once things start up again. A shut-down costs millions upon millions of dollars per day the longer it goes on. It is a stupid, stupid move - and thankfully we have a president who is doing everything possible to ensure that the worst havoc such an action causes is minimized. Some of it cannot be avoided, unfortunately. Dumbest piece of 'look what we can do so you better do as we want'. Petty isn't the half of it.
 
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Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
Another great Jay Leno line.

"Obama said raising the Debt limit does not raise the Debt-You know, like raising the speed limit
does not increase speed."
It's a dumb, simplistic joke.

You do realize that increasing the debt limit merely authorizes the Treasury to pay the bills. It doesn't increase spending.

Tell me you have a basic intelligence level sufficient to understand this concept.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
Why would Fox News run a story blaming the failures on their own people (yes I am that simple minded, Gene)? This is not a rhetorical question or a question raised to the end of stating an argument. I really am baffled at this.
I'm thinking out loud. The Fox anchor suggested it wasn't a lot of legitimate traffic that brought the New York servers down, but DDOS. So it follows that the people who oppose the law in the most irrational fashion possible would want to bring the services down, that's all. Just thinking of the implications.
 

Ezechiel

Paranormal Adept
I'm thinking out load. The Fox anchor suggested it wasn't a lot of legitimate traffic that brought the New York servers down, but DDOS. So it follows that the people who oppose the law in the most irrational fashion possible would want to bring the services down, that's all. Just thinking of the implications.

This whole situation is irrational. Has there ever been a law repealed or altered with a bill from the house in US history ?

This hijacking reeks of racism and intolerant ideology: white conservatives against one black liberal who happens to be the president of the United States.
liberal-tshirt.gif


Once you've accepted that this makes no sense. You are left with no choice but to look at the foundations of this movement. IMHO, this has always been personal and the effort is directly aimed at Obama.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
By any conventional definition, Obama is NOT a liberal, but very close to what one might consider a moderate Republican. The ACA, for example, is based on long-time Republican principles involving extensive free market participation. Obama, despite claims to the contrary, has accepted many Republican ideas in order to get things accomplished. The stimulus bill had a large tax cut to appease the other party, who still, for the most part, voted against it. The sequester cuts are in the continuing resolution, and those cuts were approved by Republicans.

Do I have to go on?
 

Heidi Lemmer

Paranormal Adept
By any conventional definition, Obama is NOT a liberal, but very close to what one might consider a moderate Republican. The ACA, for example, is based on long-time Republican principles involving extensive free market participation. Obama, despite claims to the contrary, has accepted many Republican ideas in order to get things accomplished. The stimulus bill had a large tax cut to appease the other party, who still, for the most part, voted against it. The sequester cuts are in the continuing resolution, and those cuts were approved by Republicans.

Do I have to go on?
yah, keep going.....I'm bored.
 

Heidi Lemmer

Paranormal Adept
If he was white and was a Republican with the same ideas, how would he be regarded?
I agree with what your saying. When I read the previous post you wrote I knew that the audience who didn't know this also wouldn't read it, really read it. Obama's has had to spend some cash, there's no doubt. But his end goal is to save and backtrack on this road we've been going down with the healthcare, the deficit, the bank bail outs. I've seen him push more on military protection out in combat and when they come home then most other presidents. He came to the table with one of the most conservative budgets than previous presidents, Boehner walked away. He's had a successful campaign on fraud in Medicare. Continued with Bush's border control, less illegal's hopping on over. But we don't talk much about many of these things because the signal through the noise is lost.
 

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