I've chatted about this stuff a bit before, but then Burnt and Robert began to distract, sidetrack, and then bore me at some point early into it. That's no Love Triangle there with us three from those brief exchanges. More like a Jackass Triangle - all three of us think the other two to be jackasses, lol. Kinda funny. That'd be a helluva thread - just me, Burnt, and Robert talking about something, lol. Well, I suppose the optimistic way to look at all of that is that it also means we all agree on at least one thing with other two.
I'm gonna type real quiet like this time. You guys make sure to read quietly, too. Sssshhhh. Hopefully Burnt won't hear me and stop by to start throwin' down some of his tortured pseudo-poetic mumbo jumbo in lieu of intelligent, open minded discourse again ...
There are at least three significant cover ups of information to contend with when trying to sort all of this stuff out, including sorting out the 'UFO' stuff. The one Fomenko identifies is the one that took place circa 1500's-1600's. And the pile of BS known as the Historical Chronology handed out by the Jesuits (the spearhead of the operation, but others were involved) at that time is very, very entrenched today - from the Hallowed Halls of Academia to 'Alternative/Diffusionist' Historians like Childress, Bauval, Schock, et al., to the Conspiracy 'Theorists', to people like DM Murdock and Joseph Atwill with their very, very incorrect theories about teh origins of the Bible and what it is all about, to the average Joe/ette. And so many of these Childress/Murdock/UFO GOOROO/(Insert your favorite Conspiracy Talking Mouth here)/Etc. 'free and open minded thinkers' have their theories so intertwined and dependent upon the Falsified Chronology (and their reputation staked on those theories), that, well, forget about any of them, in general, approaching the subject with an open mind, for they know if Fomenko is right (if they ever come across his work), all of them pretty much have to come out and say, "So, all that stuff I have been sayin' for decades, promoting myself as an expert seeing through all of the BS to bring you, my loyal fans and followers, clarity, education, and Truth, insisting how right and brilliantly smart I am, well, turns out all of my theories are built upon a steaming pile of BS, and, well, I need to start over on a lot of things. In fact, pretty much everything I said was wrong or worthless in regards to understanding Truth, even though I insisted to you it was the Truth, so, umm, just forget about all that, okay? Don't worry, though, I'll totally tell you about my 'new' theory I will just know is right this time in my new book, and then you can buy a ticket to see me talk about it at a conference and tell you to buy my new Book of Truth in the back when I am done speaking."
Who's going to volunteer to do that? Keep that in mind if I keep posting about this stuff and start talking about the Mythologies of the world, well, from reptilian believers, to UFOers and their Ancient Alien Garbage (very, very largely based upon said mythologies), so many of the 'thinkers' and 'speakers' in all these fields (Pure UFO, to Conspiracy of all sorts, to people like Childress and his diffusionism theories) have so heavily based their work upon many of these mythologies that their theories start to fall apart once you understand the mythologies true source and who they are talking about, and when.
Now, wrapped up within that cover up that Fomenko's work deals with is another one (a couple, actually) that Fomenko does not identify. It involves the events of that thing called the Crucifixion and the Amarna Heresy, both of which were circa 1200 AD - it is all the same event, just called different things. It (Fomenko not identifying this cover up) does not affect the actual scientific aspect of his work concerning the Falsification and elongation of the Historical Chronology but does affect his reconstruction. It should be noted that of his reconstruction, he fully states he is speculating about much, doesn't claim to be able to nail down anything with more than 50-100 year accuracy, and calls for multidisciplinary scholarly work to reconstruct the actual history of the last 1,000 years, 'cause it ain't an easy task, nor that for one mind. Fomenko himself pins the Jesuits largely responsible for all of this. First of all, they are the only group capable of pulling it off, starting with they were EVERYWHERE pretty immediately after their founding, including the Far East, including setting up and running things like Universities. Jesuits, as a group, are also, quite literally, one of the most intelligent groups of people there are. Plenty of PhDs amongst Jesuits, and plenty of Jesuits with multiple PhDs. They have been involved with the education system since their founding. They were also founded by an ex-soldier and are a Military Order.
When I talk about Jesuits and the Vatican, or any other 'group' I identify, I am talking about a select few within. Plenty of Priests who are neither pedophiles, nor up to anything nefarious, nor aware that such is even going on. Just know I am not painting with as broad a brush as it may appear with those words. And there are multiple 'groups' involved in all of this stuff, some having been for CENTURIES ...
Just to refresh with the bare essential of Fomenko's work. For now it doesn't matter if you think it impossible for him to be right at this point, as the only way one can actually have an opinion about that is to have first read his work, otherwise, one simply is in a position of not knowing what the hell they are talking about concerning his conclusions if they choose to opine on said conclusions. These are simply some of his conclusions, understanding of which is important to understanding the things I talk about aside from Fomenko's work. Think what you want of them, just know what they are so you can understand how the variety of things I talk about are actually quite tied together:
- We do not have any written records prior to about 900 AD. None of these alleged 'ancient' texts are ancient.
- One Empire was responsible for all of the archaeological remains that have been independently attributed to Romans, Greeks, Phoneticians, Egyptians, etc., and none of them are anywhere near as old as they are currently claimed by academia (he puts construction of the Roman Colosseum somewhere around 1300 or 1400 AD, as an example).
- The Empire's capital was, depending upon the time frame, in the Constantinople area, or to the north of there in Kiev. In the latter stages of the Empire, before it officially collapsed, it was known as the Hapsburg Empire, and it was based out of Kiev.
- The events of the New Testament occurred on the Bosporus in Turkey, not Israel, and circa 1185 AD, not 2,000 years ago. The 'Jesus' character is based upon the Byzantine Emperor Andronicus Komnenos.
- The events depicted in the Old Testament happened AFTER the New Testament events, and are retellings of events occurring in Asia Minor, Europe, Russia, not the Middle East. None of the events of the Bible, Old or New Testament, happened prior to about 1200 AD. As an example, when you read in the Old T about the Trumpets blowing the walls of Jericho down, well, you can call a cannon a trumpet if you want - it is still going to blow a castle wall down and it is still a cannon, not some magical, Biblical trumpet.
- Egypt was the Royal Graveyard of the Empire, not its capital. It was also the major grain supplier to the Empire. (I also label it as the Religious Epicenter of the Empire).
- The Historical Chronology was significantly elongated in the 1500's-1600's, and the Bible wasn't finished being written until that time, either, and it was put together to support the Falsification.
- There's obviously a lot more to it than just this, lol.
Far more conclusions than that, just a little of the gist of it all - the Historical Chronolgy was Falsified 500 years ago, there was one Empire that emerged at some point at who we have no written record from prior to about 900 AD (hence don't know much, if anything, about that, or any, Empire prior to that), that one Empire is responsible for the 'ancient ruins' that have been falsely attributed to fictional societies that never existed in time (Greeks, Egyptians, Romans, etc.), the Hapsburgs were the last really identifiable 'rulers' of that Empire and it went into a severe collapse during the Reformation Era, and everyone, including every PhD, is still all bass ackwards and turned around, and wrong as hell about most of what they say concerning History. Lol. But not really lol, cause this is a jacked up world all ya'll live in, and will continue to remain such, and get worse, if History is not understood properly, among other things ...
Trust me when I say I understand how preposterous that all sounds on the surface. Pretty much every Historian and Archaeologist in the world has History totally wrong, even with all of this alleged 'hard science' from the field (like the often very, very biased and unscientific Interpretive Tea Leaf Reading called C14, etc.). And that doesn't sound like it is even conceivably possible, does it? That it is silly to even consider. It took me a good couple years of reflection, further research, etc., after I a came across his work before I was ready to actually fully subscribe to it - it seems 'impossible' on the surface. Did to me, too. But, I assure you that 'impossibility' is simple that - and illusion on the surface ...
My guess is Fomenko is an Eastern Orthodox Christian. I guess that, or he and/or the translator was trying very hard to not offend Christians as he is telling them Jesus was a Byzantine Emperor who lived and died 850 years ago, not 2,00, lol. He also has a higher IQ than you. Fomenko is literally in the upper fractions of a percent of the global population of 7 billion brains when it comes to IQ. That doesn't make him right about Christianity or anything else, but his 7 book set (each book is several hundred pages long and college textbook size) is science and rigorous thought, and nothing but. Whatever his beliefs about all of that are, he never states them overtly (I suspect he is, but actually don't know his belief system, if any) and the only ramifications are that he identifies Jesus as Andronicus and seems to believe in his 'godliness', if only believes by default of never really questions those claims. Again, the science and theory behind it all are precisely that - science and critical thinking. So, don't be scared because he doesn't attack Christianity like an Atheist, lol. The two are NOT intertwined (his work on the Chronology and any religious or spiritual belief), and there is nothing about subscribing to Christianity that has anything to do with subscribing to his work and theory. He never states it, but if he is a Christian, well, I sure as hell ain't in that Biblical sense. I couldn't subscribe to his work if it had any basis in Christianity or any religion.
I just gotta throw that caveat out there, as UFOers seem to forget that the vast majority of the world is NOT Atheistic, and half of the world's population is either Catholic/Protestant, Muslim, or Hindu. Throw in the Buddhists, and everyone else, and there are a lot of SMART people, including people with PhDs in science related fields, who are NOT Atheists. They may not be religious or really spiritual at all and genuinely agnostic in their views, but I assure you there are plenty of non-Atheistic scientists. And a great many of those smart people successfully separate spiritual beliefs from their scientific work, and you don't even know those beliefs exist, as they are never an issue. With this subject, however the Bible is intimately intertwined, as it was written and assembled precisely to SUPPORT the Falsified Chronology, so it has to be talked about in Fomenko's work. And I have already seen people here that don't understand Atheism is a belief system, like ANY other religion. Look at the word. It is pretty damn simple to understand, and ridiculous to deny. These are Greek words, and in Greek, the 'a' prefix has a meaning. A Theist believes in the existence of a God. An A-Theist BELIEVES the opposite; namely there is no such thing as a God or 'Higher Power'. They are NOT open to discussion about the matter, are they? They mock and deride anyone that suggests the existence of things Spiritual as being stupid and backwards thinking - this is the VERY ESSENCE & CORE of a BELIEF SYSTEM, as Atheism most definitely is - a Belief System, just like ANY religion - they have made up their mind; they have a BELIEF about it. And, amusingly and ironically, one for which they have ZERO evidence, or even any real overwhelmingly intelligent argument, arrogant and snarky as Atheists are about their belief system they incorrectly claim they don't have, lol. A Gnostic has knowledge of things (in this case, Spiritual things). An A-Gnostic (agnostic) has no knowledge - "Maybe the Atheists are right, maybe the Theists are right. I dunno, they dunno, everybody is just guessing, nobody has any real knowledge about it, any Gnosis, to say either way, and I keep BOTH options open to receipt of further evidence and argumentation." The 'true' lofty intellectual purist scientist can only be agnostic, not Atheistic, and say, "I dunno - I haven't seen enough verifiable scientific evidence to tell who's BELIEF is correct - the Theists or the A-Theists," else they are being intellectually dishonest and inconsistent, scientifically.
Personally, I define myself as a very Spiritual person, and way more 'in touch' with all of that then the average person. I'll leave it at that. I also think science and the scientific method is a constrained model under which to try to understand such, let alone have any experience or interaction with it. I was told by someone that got to know me while still a sophomore in college, "Come see me as soon as you graduate, so I can put you to work." I walked away from all of that as Junior to go be a skibum. All of that being my academic pursuit of degrees in Electrical Engineering and Mathematics and the waiting job was at Lockheed Martin in the aerospace industry/military industrial complex. I like science and the scientific method, understand it well, etc. I don't, however, arrogantly and closed mindedly proclaim it to be the be all, end all and ultimate and only way to understand EVERYTHING (like matters that may be of a Spiritual Nature), though.
Ask Bigelow how all of that science and scientific method framework worked out for understanding this stuff. Lol. His ass should've brought in a Shaman, someone in touch with that kind of stuff more than your average pointy head pencil and calculator pusher ...
So, to finish this post up, let me just offer a couple tidbits of how it all works. How it was pulled off. The original chronicles were both destroyed and tendentiously edited, with some surviving here and there. There were also works, like Josephus' Works, that are complete fabrications, meant only to support the BS with no basis in actual History. But, obviously, there are enough identifiable elements of surviving, genuine texts to conclude the originals only go back to 900 AD. From that, the written History from 900 until about 1500 was duplicated, with things like dates, places, names changed. Through statistical mathematics, Fomenko created this visual representation. What's in the bottom right is the actual Historical record (with the period around 1250 AD to be very lacking in any real historical data), then broken down into segments and labeled. Those segments were then pulled out, duplicated, rearranged in order, etc, to elongate the known Historical Chronology and record by thousands of years. A snapshot from one of his books:
I ain't a PhD in mathematics, so I really can't check Fomenko's math, can I? What I can do, however, is find evidence in the actual Historical Chronicles of these duplications of events, with slight changes, you see in that graph to verify Fomeko's work. One thing among other things there is to do (and I am doing) to verify his work (I actually subscribe to it, after a couple of years of reflecting upon it). Some more of that boots on the ground Field Work type stuff to be done as well. I actually came across Fomenko's work because I figured out that Julius Cæsar and Jesus Christ, well, that was the same person. And this gets into how Fomenko's work can be verified using other methods.
Let's play a game I made up that I call Jesuit Déjà Vu:
I say, “Tell me a figure from History who’s initials are JC, was born of a Virgin Birth, had a friend named Mark who led the way for his deification after death, and was betrayed by a confidant leading to his execution at the hands of the Romans.”
And you say, “Well, CJ, I need more info. For, a C-Section is a ‘Virgin Birth’, I don’t know if you are talking about Mark Antony or Mark the Evangelist, and I don’t know if the confidant is Brutus or Judas. So, I need more info to tell you which JC it is - Jesus or Julius.”
Here’s another one. I say, “Tell me the name of two cities that were notoriously aberrant and deviant in their sexual behaviors, were destroyed when fire and brimstone fell from the sky, and whose inhabitants were turned into pillars of salt.”
And you say, “Well, those bodies left behind in Pompeii and Herculaneum most definitely look like pillars of salt, P & H were as sexually perverse and deviant as the Biblical Sodom and Gomorrah ever were, and all four cities were destroyed by fire and brimstone from the ‘heavens’, so I don’t know which pair of cities you are talking about.”
See how it works? Same story retold, being shifted in time and geography to elongate the Historical Chronology. We can play this game of Jesuit Déjà Vu all day long. That Sack of Constantinople circa 1200 AD, aka the Trojan War, as a direct result of the Crucifixion of the person people erroneously call Jesus Christ a decade or two earlier, was a pretty important event with global implications. Think Copper Scroll of Dead Sea Scroll fame, the stashing of money and religious objects by the Priests of Amen who were in control of about 90% of ‘Egypt’s’ shipping fleet circa the Armana Heresy (aka the failed Spiritual, Societal, Cultural, and Political Revolution people think happened 2,000 years ago in Israel as relayed in the New Testament (and even earlier with ‘Ahkenaten’ and Nefertiti, but happened about 850 years ago).
Person A/Event A was duplicated with changed names, place locations, etc., to then also be called Persons B, C, D, etc., as well as real Person/Event A & B being combined into one Person/Eevnt C. Back to Constantinople, circa 1200 AD. Going to source documents (which, in the end, only fill up a few library shelves and is a relatively meager collection - all of the Historical source documents your education was based upon, that is), you can find what Nicaetas Chroniates, a claimed eye witness to the Trojan War, err, First Crusade, err, Fourth Crusade, had to say about the Crusader Sack of the city. This is a source document I am quoting here:
How shall I begin to tell of the deeds wrought by these nefarious men! Alas, the images, which ought to have been adored, were trodden under foot! Alas, the relics of the holy martyrs were thrown into unclean places! Then was seen what one shudders to hear, namely, the divine body and blood of Christ was spilled upon the ground or thrown about. They snatched the precious reliquaries, thrust into their bosoms the ornaments which these contained, and used the broken remnants for pans and drinking cups,-precursors of Anti-Christ, authors and heralds of his nefarious deeds which we momentarily expect. Manifestly, indeed, by that race then, just as formerly, Christ was robbed and insulted and His garments were divided by lot; only one thing was lacking, that His side, pierced bv a spear, should pour rivers of divine blood on the ground.
Nor can the violation of the Great Church be listened to with equanimity. For the sacred altar, formed of all kinds of precious materials and admired by the whole world, was broken into bits and distributed among the soldiers, as was all the other sacred wealth of so great and infinite splendor.
When the sacred vases and utensils of unsurpassable art and grace and rare material, and the fine silver, wrought with gold, which encircled the screen of the tribunal and the ambo, of admirable workmanship, and the door and many other ornaments, were to be borne away as booty, mules and saddled horses were led to the very sanctuary of the temple. [A vertible wagon train of Treasure hauled off] Some of these which were unable to keep their footing on the splendid and slippery pavement, were stabbed when they fell, so that the sacred pavement was polluted with blood and filth.
Nay more, a certain harlot, a sharer in their guilt, a minister of the furies, a servant of the demons, a worker of incantations and poisonings, insulting Christ, sat in the patriarch's seat, singing an obscene song and dancing frequently. Nor, indeed, were these crimes committed and others left undone, on the ground that these were of lesser guilt, the others of greater. But with one consent all the most heinous sins and crimes were committed by all with equal zeal. Could those, who showed so great madness against God Himself, have spared the honorable matrons and maidens or the virgins consecrated to God?
Along with all of that Byzantine Emperor Theodore I was installed.
Wait a minute … I thought all of that happened centuries prior, in Rome, not Constantinople:
The College of the Vestals was disbanded and the sacred fire extinguished in 394, by order of the Christian emperor Theodosius I. Zosimus records how the Christian noblewoman Serena, niece of Theodosius, entered the temple and took from the statue of the goddess a necklace and placed it on her own neck. An old woman appeared, the last of the Vestals, who proceeded to rebuke Serena and called down upon her all just punishment for her act of impiety. According to Zosimus, Serena was then subject to dreadful dreams predicting her own untimely death. Augustine would be inspired to write The City of God in response to murmurings that the capture of Rome and the disintegration of its empire was due to the advent of the Christian era and its intolerance of the old gods who had defended the city for over a thousand years.
You understand that 'virgins consecrated to god' in one story are the same group of gals referred to as Vestal Virgins in the other, right? That the 'certain harlot' of one story and Serena are the same, as are the old ladies and the Emperors named Theodore I of one story and Theodosius I of the other.
You’re not going to tell me that is some kind of coincidence, are you (along with a bazillion others)? That would be silly. That the exact same events, separated by almost 1,000 years happened to the same Empire, to Emperors of the same name, etc. They are the SAME event, with one of them having been displaced in time (shifted backwards) and geography to make it seem like two distinct events. Concerning that Byzantine Emperor in that story, English History taught at Oxford is nothing but Byzantine History retold and relocated. The Theodores became the Tudors, England = Angleos (Byzantine Power Family) Land, the Wallachians became the Welsh (this is where the Welsh Dragon comes from - Wallachia and the Order of the Dragon that Vlad, and others, were a member of. Me and that Dragon of Saturn/Amen have a big damn problem. Don’t confuse the legged Dragon or Wyrm of Saturn with the Feathered/Horned Serpent - they are different things, and one of them, the Dragon, ain’t no damn good, while the Serpent is Good Stuff), etc.
Go ask a geologist when Vesuvius erupted. Is s/he going to whip out a pencil, paper, and slide rule and start showing you, scientifically, when it happened? Hell no. They will go to the History Bibles handed out by the Universal Church of Ra-Amen (Christianity - both Eastern & Western, plus ALL Protestant groups are devotees of Amen-Ra/Satrun-Sol, the Two Suns, the Masons Black & White checkered floor and Two Obelisks of Joachin and Boaz. They are all based off of the same BS Book of Amen-Ra. The worship of the two Suns. Sol/Ra and Saturn/Amen (the Hidden/Dark Sun)) a few hundred years ago, specifically to the works of Pliny the Younger (not to be confused with his uncle, Pliny the Elder, who allegedly stayed in Pompeii and died) who watched it all happen, allegedly, from a ship as he fled Pompeii. And when you ask them to scientifically defend the claimed date of 79 AD as the time of eruption, they will NOT be able to do so. All they can do is stammer and point to the Church of Amen-Ra’s History Bibles that just miraculously started floating up outta Castle Dungeons, Church Monasteries, and Italian Republics circa Renaissance. Or maybe point to interpretive Tea Leaf Reading called C14 by labs that can ask an estimated age be submitted with that sample (yea, that is real, umm ‘unbiased science’ going on there, lol. “Hey C14 Lab, how old is this?” - C14 Lab: “Umm … how old do you think it is?” - Archaeologist: “I think it is blah, blah old.” - C14 Lab after testing sample: “That’s how old we think it is, too, then.” With that conversation taking place on the submission forms where Indiana/ette Jones can be asked to supply her/his estimated age (which is based SOLELY off of the Falsified Historical Chronology), as you can find Labs requesting that info on said submission forms BEFORE they test the sample) for as wildly, wildly, and I mean wildly by incredible factors of numbers, inaccurate as the CALIBRATED (nah, no chance for huge errors here) Subjective Tea Leaf Reading called C14 can be, ESPECIALLY for things less than 2,000 years old, which I assure you anything found at Pompeii or Herculaneum is - less than 2,000 years old.
When did Vesuvius erupt? Probably not much more than about 600-700 years ago. Prove me wrong. You can’t, nor can any geologist. All you can do, and I mean ALL you can do, is refer to the work of some guy who allegedly lived 2,000 years ago named Pliny the Younger that the Church handed out a few hundred years ago. And they aren’t even his actual works, are they? His ALLEGED original works don’t exist - only ALLEGED ‘copies’ ALLEGEDLY made by an ALLEGED Monk (that ALLEGEDLY lived centuries before said ALLEGED copy he ALLEGEDLY made, ALLEGEDLY accurately, too, entered the public domain and centuries after ALLEGED original was produced by someone who is ALLEGED to have been an eye witness to an ALLEGED event (namely, one that ALLEGEDLY occurred Pompeii at an ALLEGED time of exactly 1,937 years ago) said ALLEGED ‘copy’ was ALLEGED to have been made of an ALLEGED original some dude ALLEGEDLY named Pliny the Younger, who has been ALLEGED to have existed 2,000 years ago and ALLEGED to have an Uncle named Pliny The Elder who did all sorts ‘o ALLEDGING about ‘History’ himself and was ALLEGED to have died in 79 AD in Pompeii when Vesuvius ALLEGEDLY erupted and he ALLEGEDLY stayed behind instead of fleeing as his ALLEGED Nephew was ALLEGED to have done, work was still ALLEGEDLY extant, with those ALLEGED copies themselves having ALLEGEDLY been lost for centuries before ALLEGEDLY being surreptitiously rediscovered circa Renaissance with all of the other ALLEGED copies of ALLEGED to have existed, but no longer do, originals.
That’s a whole helluva lot ‘o allegeds & allegedlies in one sentence, ain’t it, lol? And that is what 'ancient' History is based upon, supported by nothing but circular argumentation ...
And that is all just scratching the surface and long enough for one post. But, if Red gets lucky and I keep typing, well, I needed to get a little of that out there. And now I need to decide if I can go straight back to the Grand Canyon and the Tut pictures or I need another long post inbetween for more base info first. If I keep typing tomorrow. Perhaps a nice bowl of a nice Virginia/Burley blend baccy with a multiplicity of casings and toppings delicately applied with a sublime melding of the English Licorice and Venezuelan Cocoa Powder in the right proportions into the woody, versus citrusy, Virginia and the earthen notes from the Burley in support in the crisp Colorado night air will help me figure that out. 'Cause I just know all ya'll care about that, lol ...