What's up with justcurious ?

[justcurious]

The UFO phenomenon is also (and for some exclusively) a socio-cultural phenomenon. One of its socio-cultural aspects is the public reaction toward witnesses, "experiencers", "contactees" and "abductees" which is mostly one of distrust and ridicule and ostracism. For valid reasons in many cases, as you know.

I am quite intensively researching the phenomenon, including field research, mostly but not only, through my own experiences which have a regularity and variety that propels me, I'm afraid, into the "experiencers" category. This situation allows me to also study first hand the socio-cultural effect described above and that is what partly motivated my joining The Paracast Forums.

So after a few weeks here, some uploaded lousy pictures and a few accounts of my sightings being posted, I would like to know your take on my story.

Please answer only if you are familiar with my accounts as related in this thread : Advice seeked on a contactee situation

Please note that I do not make any kind of claims as to the origin of the manifestations.

My bet is that the 2 first choices will constitute the majority of the votes. To what extent is what I would like to know.

Thx for contributing to the march of science. (for some it's your moment, enjoy )

 

[ArchieBedford]

The UFO phenomenon is also (and for some exclusively) a socio-cultural phenomenon. One of its socio-cultural aspects is the public reaction toward witnesses, "experiencers", "contactees" and "abductees" which is mostly one of distrust and ridicule and ostracism. For valid reasons in many cases, as you know.

I am quite intensively researching the phenomenon, including field research, mostly but not only, through my own experiences which have a regularity and variety that propels me, I'm afraid, into the "experiencers" category. This situation allows me to also study first hand the socio-cultural effect described above and that is what partly motivated my joining The Paracast Forums.

So after a few weeks here, some uploaded lousy pictures and a few accounts of my sightings being posted, I would like to know your take on my story.

Please answer only if you are familiar with my accounts as related in this thread : Advice seeked on a contactee situation

Please note that I do not make any kind of claims as to the origin of the manifestations.

My bet is that the 2 first choices will constitute the majority of the votes. To what extent is what I would like to know.

Thx for contributing to the march of science. (for some it's your moment, enjoy )

Well justcurious, you asked, so here goes.

IMO your narratives are pretty standard stuff for an abductee who has not had his/her case extensively investigated. They are close to my own experiences and conscious memories, and though not identical are definitely in the same ball-park.

A while back (March I think) a thread was going in which abduction research in general and Dave Jacobs in particular was being trashed and ridiculed by some very ignorant posters. This motivated me to sign up with the forums, as I have a fair amount of personal experience of the issue and of the individual/s in question, and I thought I would share what had happened to me personally in case it helped members to sort out perspectives.

As a result of this online interchange, a number of "lurkers" who had been reading the forums subsequently signed up and, though few of them ever posted, many sent me PMs and asked if I could put them in touch with Dave Jacobs or Budd Hopkins. Obviously I can't and won't go into details, but there have been good productive results in most cases. The detail in some of the stories is just astounding; breathtaking. Obviously most abductees want anonymity and have no interest in discussing their lives and experiences in public. But believe it, there's a lot of it about. It's a huge, secret world rarely acknowledged.

The important thing to note here is that many people report more or less what you do, and this is (quoting now) "typical of what abductees consciously remember, part-remember, think they remember and confabulate."

Of course the agency behind your experiences may be something different. You can never know without investigation. But it sure looks like the abduction phenomenon to me. Exactly like it.

 

[Kandinsky]

You're setting up a 2:1 bias in the results that actively skews the outcome and makes it kinda redundant. You aren't daft, so I guess you're aware of it. I'm not going to vote. The choices aren't appropriate or varied enough. If you're after some form of validation, it's not likely to come from this survey.

FWIW nobody but you can know if you're seeing a phenomena. If you can add a box for 'Who Knows?' or 'Uncertain' I'll tick it.

regards
K

 

[justcurious]

Well justcurious, you asked, so here goes.

IMO your narratives are pretty standard stuff for an abductee who has not had his/her case extensively investigated. They are close to my own experiences and conscious memories, and though not identical are definitely in the same ball-park.

Of course the agency behind your experiences may be something different. You can never know without investigation. But it sure looks like the abduction phenomenon to me. Exactly like it.

Thanks for voting ,

pretty standard stuff for an abductee ?

I have not claimed abduction, please clarify ? Are you implying that I might have been abducted and not remember ? No antagonism here, just asking.

I would like to know of your experiences, have you described them in this forum ?

 

[ArchieBedford]

Thanks for voting ,

I have not claimed abduction, please clarify ? Are you implying that I might have been abducted and not remember ? No antagonism here, just asking.

I would like to know of your experiences, have you described them in this forum ?

Yes, suggesting that as a possibility, as your reported experiences match those of so many abductees very closely. Of course the origin of the events in your case may be something completely different. You can't know for sure without investigation, and maybe not even then.

And yes I have made posts about my experiences. I am about to go to a social engagement so don't have much time right now, but I'll get back to you with links, maybe a PM.

 

[justcurious]

You're setting up a 2:1 bias in the results that actively skews the outcome and makes it kinda redundant. You aren't daft, so I guess you're aware of it. I'm not going to vote. The choices aren't appropriate or varied enough. If you're after some form of validation, it's not likely to come from this survey.

FWIW nobody but you can know if you're seeing a phenomena. If you can add a box for 'Who Knows?' or 'Uncertain' I'll tick it.

regards
K

You are right, I considered adding "unsure" for a moment but was worried to have too many unsure, and I want to know what's "your take on my story". Sorry, English is not my native tongue, neither it is the one I use the most. To me "your take" means "your gut feeling", "your bet" etc, and it's what I want to know, Ok may be I am making it worse now. Is "unsure" a gut feeling ?

I think it is too late now but if a moderator (Ron, Angel, anybody there ?) can delete it, I will post it again with the extra choice you mentioned. Anyway, your post(s), as much as your votes, give me the data I'm looking for.

Also, I kinda took the example on the Jim Spark poll, which doesn't have an unsure "choice", and nobody seem to have minded. Anyway, if anybody has any recommendations to make this poll better, I'm all ears... In the mean time, Kandinsky, I book your vote as "who knows", OK ? What kind of validation do you think I could be looking for, if any ? (just curious)

I knowingly put myself in a very vulnerable position with this thread, that should show, to some, the sincerity of my intentions. If not, it will be DATA non the less as far as I am concerned.

Thank you for your time, (truly :shy

 

[Kandinsky]

I knowingly put myself in a very vulnerable position with this thread, that should show, to some, the sincerity of my intentions. If not, it will be DATA non the less as far as I am concerned.

Thank you for your time, (truly )

It's a forum and maybe that makes you vulnerable to armchair assassins. That won't be me...or many others around here. I think you're style is interesting and colourful.

My 'gut feeling' hasn't drawn any conclusions

 

[paraschtick]

The UFO phenomenon is also (and for some exclusively) a socio-cultural phenomenon. One of its socio-cultural aspects is the public reaction toward witnesses, "experiencers", "contactees" and "abductees" which is mostly one of distrust and ridicule and ostracism. For valid reasons in many cases, as you know.
...
Please note that I do not make any kind of claims as to the origin of the manifestations.

My bet is that the 2 first choices will constitute the majority of the votes. To what extent is what I would like to know.

Thx for contributing to the march of science. (for some it's your moment, enjoy )

Dear justcurious,

I'll not vote in the poll because I believe that however you structure the poll you can never really take in all possible permutations as it were. The poll would be farrr too big. However, it is possible that you have had some strange things going on in your life. My younger brother has had strange things go on in his life (mostly ghosts, apparently) so I believe that they do go on ... although I've not had any really interesting things happen to me (apart from seeing something in the sky when I was a kid during a ufo flap in Wales where I lived at the time).

So whatever it is, investigate if you can. Whatever has happened to you may have a plausible explanation. And you may not even know what that is for years. But keep all eyes and ears open to anything and everything (except the angels and demons thing ... I mean ... cmon ) but don't come to any hard or fast conclusions straight away.

And I believe that is most important ... do not go to someone like Budd Hopkins or David Jacobs. And do not listen to the Archie Bedfords of this world who can't get it into their skulls that these people will twist what you are experiencing and mould it into their own belief system, and their way of making money in this world. Look at all other options such as sleep disorders and hallucinations of some sort (brought on by medication or some such) ... but stay away from the hypnotherapists. Especially the ones who practice without a licence (see David Jacobs for instance). Sorry to bring this up again, but a certain previous poster has and I have to acknowledge that and respond accordingly. Too many people have been hurt by Jacobs and his ilk for me not to do so.

Anyway as I say keep all options open (except for the ones I have mentioned), since otherwise you will limit yourself, and you may close yourself off to the real explanation(s).

Best wishes

paraschtick

 

[Hotkafka]

This is a potentially tricky situation. Being a trained psychotherapist who is interested in this subject matter, I have to caution you - no matter what direction you choose to go to for support or to seek out an opinion on your experiences, there is always going to be a certain degree of "reframing" going on. And this simply means that those who consider themselves experts on anomalous experiences will file them away according to their main frameworks of interpretation. For example: A Jungian psychologist might see them as Transpersonal in orientation, a Psychiatrist as potentially psychotic delusions, a shaman as initiation episodes, a Hindu Yogi as "siddhi", a Dr. Stanislov Grof as experiences of non-material realms, and a Budd Hopkins type as precursors or indications of abduction-related phenemenon. The path you chose to take is an important one, for your experiences can only be validated ultimately by you. I'd say there's a few steps one might consider - First, do your best to rule out that there isn't any neurological disorder -schedule an appointment and avoid describing the backstory to your present experiences. Reveal your concern in the framework of "unexplained" phenemenon, but unless you want to be on the high road to neuroleptics, be frugal with the details. I say this only upon the assumption that you are not a potentially dual-diagnosis candidate, i.e. experiencing said phenemenon with the addition of depressive episodes, substantial mood swings or changes in energy, and or delusions of reference and hearing voices. If your psychological state happens to fit with dual symptomology, well, do consider quite seriously the option of seeing a psychiatrist. Additionally, consider the option of seeing a psychotherapist. Take the time to learn about yourself and the implications of your family of origin as well as subconscious and higher conscious activity. Do this only if you feel comfortable devoting yourself to such an enterprise, because it does demand a great deal of energy and fortitude. Therapy may stand to provide you with a clearer picture of why these things may be happening. Practically, maintain a healthy amount of skepticism and continue to investigate the phenomenon, but be sure to involve a system of checks and balances - i.e. bounce some of your findings/ideas/conclusions off someone close to you who is level headed and whom is someone you can trust. This forum is a good expression of that, but there is a considerable amount of "reframing" you will face on this board.

 

[Slim Shady]

could you change buzzed by ufo's to buggered by ufo's please =)

 

[CapnG]

justcurious is evidently egotistical enough to devote an entire topic to himself. I think that says plenty.

 

[NTS]

I'm a little hesitant to post on this since I've never experienced anything like it, or known anyone who has. But I'd say that Hotkafka's advice sounds good.

 

[Double Nought Spy]

I'm a little hesitant to post on this since I've never experienced anything like it, or known anyone who has. But I'd say that Hotkafka's advice sounds good.

I'll go further and say it's some of the most sensible advice I've seen in such a situation. Thanks, Hotkafka, for the term "reframing." I've been looking for a term like that to describe what seems to happen with a lot of different investigators, authors and so on, as they go about filtering the data they receive. Even more interesting, over the years I've noticed a weird pattern in which the phenomenon appears to begin to conform to the predispositions of the investigators who are looking into the experiences of the people who come to them for help. It's easy enough to chalk it up to ordinary bias. For a while. Then things get really strange.

I agree with Cap'n G that the OP's egotism is off-putting, and I would not be surprised if he turns out to be full of crap, but I don't have enough information to form an opinion yet. The fact that it has brought the discussion to this point is interesting.

 

[Ron Collins]

You are right, I considered adding "unsure" for a moment but was worried to have too many unsure, and I want to know what's "your take on my story". Sorry, English is not my native tongue, neither it is the one I use the most. To me "your take" means "your gut feeling", "your bet" etc, and it's what I want to know, Ok may be I am making it worse now. Is "unsure" a gut feeling ?

I think it is too late now but if a moderator (Ron, Angel, anybody there ?) can delete it, I will post it again with the extra choice you mentioned. Anyway, your post(s), as much as your votes, give me the data I'm looking for.

Also, I kinda took the example on the Jim Spark poll, which doesn't have an unsure "choice", and nobody seem to have minded. Anyway, if anybody has any recommendations to make this poll better, I'm all ears... In the mean time, Kandinsky, I book your vote as "who knows", OK ? What kind of validation do you think I could be looking for, if any ? (just curious)

I knowingly put myself in a very vulnerable position with this thread, that should show, to some, the sincerity of my intentions. If not, it will be DATA non the less as far as I am concerned.

Thank you for your time, (truly :shy

PM me the new choice text and I will edit the poll.

 

[justcurious]

justcurious is evidently egotistical enough to devote an entire topic to himself. I think that says plenty.

Megalomania is a very relaxing hobby, I recommend it...

:redface:

 

[Xylo]

JC, I voted in the "who knows" category. I did so because even though I've read your postings, I don't know you. I am inclined to be open-minded but skeptical of experiences (even my own) due to the way that the human mind works and the way that memories are stored and recalled.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

I haven't voted because what I think isn't there. I don't think you're lying since you have taken pictures. I don't think you're deluded. If by UFO you mean something paranormal or alien, that choice is ruled out.
What I do think is that you're misinterpreting something and attributing it to some kind of unknown phenomenon that has not been discovered by humans yet (i.e. paranormal or non-human intelligence).
You should really watch the Michael Shermer TED talk I posted earlier today in another thread. I would urge you to watch the whole thing.

 

[justcurious]

I haven't voted because what I think isn't there. I don't think you're lying since you have taken pictures. I don't think you're deluded. If by UFO you mean something paranormal or alien, that choice is ruled out.
What I do think is that you're misinterpreting something and attributing it to some kind of unknown phenomenon that has not been discovered by humans yet (i.e. paranormal or non-human intelligence).
You should really watch the Michael Shermer TED talk I posted earlier today in another thread. I would urge you to watch the whole thing.

Thanks Angel, I will watch it ...

By UFO I mean ... UFO. Unidentified Flying Objects, or UAPs which I like more, I should have used that term. (As a moderator you can fix this, I'd be grateful if you could just replace UFOs by UAPs in the 3rd choice of the poll)

I never implied anything about their origin and have been careful to mention it in the OP of this thread:

Please note that I do not make any kind of claims as to the origin of the manifestations.

Since you seem to accept that I didn't fake the pictures (thank you I really appreciate that) , you could accept that it's UAPs. They are unidentified (can someone identify the pic I use as an avatar, or any other I posted ?), aerial (again see pics), and certainly phenomenal, as opposed to imaginary since they affect the sensor of my camera(s).

And in any case there is the "Who knows ?" option which was gracefully advised by Kandinsky.

So may be you can vote after all... Not that you Have to...

 

[Angel of Ioren]

By UFO I mean ... UFO. Unidentified Flying Objects, or UAPs which I like more, I should have used that term. (As a moderator you can fix this, I'd be grateful if you could just replace UFOs by UAPs in the 3rd choice of the poll)

Okay, so then what's the point of this exercise. If you are going through the effort of having everyone vote on your lights and whether we believe you or not, it implies to me that you think something strange is going on. I don't think there's anything strange going on, as I think you're just mis-interpreting something in the sky. The pictures you have posted suggest nothing but lights in the sky to me, especially the blurry, magnified one you use as an avatar. They are definately not extraordinary. Since it seems to happen so often rent a good camera with a good telephoto zoom lens as I have suggested to you, the mystery will be solved real quick.

---------- Post added at 12:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:40 PM ----------

UFOs changed to UAPs as requested.

 

[justcurious]

Angel of Ioren: Okay, so then what's the point of this exercise.

The point of the exercise is clearly stated in the OP as well :

...study first hand the socio-cultural effect (of being or claiming to be an "experiencer")

Which bit you do not understand ?

Angel of Ioren: If you are going through the effort of having everyone vote on your lights and whether we believe you or not, it implies to me that you think something strange is going on.

Not much of an effort really, and no I don't expect everyone to vote. But giving me an idea of whether I am believed or not is what the poll is for, as stated in the OP and re-stated above. And yes, I "think something strange is going on", that is why I set up the poll to study first hand the socio-cultural effect of claiming .... "that something strange is going on"... Not that complicated really...

Angel of Ioren: The pictures you have posted suggest nothing but lights in the sky to me, especially the blurry, magnified one you use as an avatar. They are definately not extraordinary.

I agree with your estimation of my pictures, and again I have stated the same in the OP:

...some uploaded lousy pictures...

One last time, the poll is not : "What do you think about my pictures ?", rather "What do you think of my claims ?" humorously stated as "What's up with justcurious ?" and clarified in the OP for anyone who cares to read it.
If you want I can set up a poll about the pictures, actually thanks for the idea. To me it would also be a useful test of the socio-cultural aspect of the phenomenon.

If there is anything else you would like to know as to why I set-up this poll, I will be glad to explain it by showing that it is already explained in the OP of this thread.

Thank you for editing the poll...