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Werner Boch

Secretbanana

Skilled Investigator
Wow! Whats an episode!

As soon as i heard Mr. Bock mention Agenda 21, I was reasonably sure that we were in for a big bagful of craaaaazy, and an hour into the show, we've already heard about death rays, local mafia-grassroots groups, shady neighbors, NWO, chemtrails and lord knows what else.

It's somewhat encouraging for my opinion of her credentials as an investigator to hear that Mrs. Moulton Howe in no uncertain terms that she only deals with alien-cattle mutilations. Can't have been easy to get rid of a nut as persistent and paranoid as Bock!

(I wonder if its a common problem for investigators of UFOs and the paranormal, that clearly delusional individuals contact them regarding their own, private persecutions!)

I wonder what we're in for the next two hours, and wish Mr. Bock a good psychiatrist in his near future! (And an explanation for why only his cows got targeted by death rays. You'd think it'd be more common, no?)
 

Melly

Paranormal Novice
Hi, I'm a long time listener and havent posted before. I love the show, I think there needs to be more people like Gene and Chris asking the tough questions, but I have a major bone to pick with this episode. I understand that with these type of subjects you have the occasional iffy guest on from time to time, but I wanted to reach through my headphones and strangle this guy. I feel like you could've perhaps vetted him a little better before having him waste two hous of my life. It seems understandable why no scientists, law enforcement or researchers would take him seriously after hearing him go on these tangents which I think mentioned every possible conpiracy theory from the last 100 years. When he talked about these professional's expression changes and then not wanting to deal with him, I'm sure it's because they listened to him speak for a minute. The mysterious phone calls they received were probably warnings to not waste their time. In 35+ years he cannot produce one piece of evidence, and when challenged on this point after having all his loopholes closed he ends with "I don't have any more samples right now" because "he made such a stink on the Internet". Seriously? A google search on him produces articles of which Gene alluded that should've raised red flags. Again, I realize it's not easy to find guests every week in an ever shrinking field...but rather listen to Gene and Chris talk to each other than have to listen to this nonsense. It was very disappointing.
 

pong

Groupthink Must Die
Not so fast. Werner's parting words were correct: There is no place for profitable, productive, self-sufficient organic family farms in the world run by big government and big agribusiness. I don't know what happened to Werner's livestock, but there is no doubt that Monsanto and its political allies have targeted the family farmers of North American for extinction. Werner is obviously frustrated--and so are tens of thousands of other small farmers and ranchers.
 

Secretbanana

Skilled Investigator
In my experience, failure to provide concise answers to simple questions is typical for people suffering from Paranoid Personality Disorder.

Whenever you ask a simple question, you get a long weaving answer that doesn't answer anything. (Like when Gene asked if he has any proof, or why he didn't get a forensic test done)

Mr. Bock should ask himself: "Why is this just happening to me?" And "why don't they just kill me?" Failure to provide a clear, concise answer to those two questions would seem to indicate that yup, its all just in his head...

(And yes, why not just kill him? Would sure seem a lot easier, If the conspiracy is really so powerful as he seems to believe. Objectively speaking, an evil cabal of farmers, grassroots activist, police and Agenda 21 that fails to get rid of ONE single farmer after working in it for over 30 years, is doing a piss poor job and is an embarrassment to the NWO. Thanks to Mr. Bock I will sleep soundly tonight. Safe in the knowledge that if there IS a mason conspiracy, they're so inept as to be relatively harmless.)
 

Secretbanana

Skilled Investigator
Not so fast. Werner's parting words were correct: There is no place for profitable, productive, self-sufficient organic family farms in the world run by big government and big agribusiness. I don't know what happened to Werner's livestock, but there is no doubt that Monsanto and its political allies have targeted the family farmers of North American for extinction. Werner is obviously frustrated--and so are tens of thousands of other small farmers and ranchers.
Yes, there is pressure on small family farmers, and thank god for that! I like my food to be as cheap as possible. (As for the organic farms, maybe if they ever provide a double blind study that shows any health-advantage to organic foods, which so far hasn't been proven, they'd do better....)


Pressure on family farmers have to do with economical reasons and no conspiracy, Monsanto led or otherwise.
 
F

Fcseven

Guest
Wow! Whats an episode!

As soon as i heard Mr. Bock mention Agenda 21, I was reasonably sure that we were in for a big bagful of craaaaazy, and an hour into the show, we've already heard about death rays, local mafia-grassroots groups, shady neighbors, NWO, chemtrails and lord knows what else.

It's somewhat encouraging for my opinion of her credentials as an investigator to hear that Mrs. Moulton Howe in no uncertain terms that she only deals with alien-cattle mutilations. Can't have been easy to get rid of a nut as persistent and paranoid as Bock!

(I wonder if its a common problem for investigators of UFOs and the paranormal, that clearly delusional individuals contact them regarding their own, private persecutions!)

I wonder what we're in for the next two hours, and wish Mr. Bock a good psychiatrist in his near future! (And an explanation for why only his cows got targeted by death rays. You'd think it'd be more common, no?)

Why pooh-pooh talk of Agenda 21? It's not a fake or imaginary thing. Look into things like Ickly (ICLEI) and see it is indeed being implemented. Skeptics who seem to have a hard on for dismissing everything and calling others crazy look like smug and arrogant pricks.

I could only listen to an hour of Mr. Bock, not because he mentioned Agenda 21 but because he was another guest who did nothing but ramble and ramble plus make little sense. Not to mention it was starting to sound less paranormal and more like a group of vandals. It could have been due to his heavy accent but I just could not listen to his voice any longer.
 

Christopher O'Brien

Back in the Saddle Aginn
Staff member
t length
Hi, I'm a long time listener and havent posted before..I realize it's not easy to find guests every week in an ever shrinking field...but [I would] rather listen to Gene and Chris talk to each other than have to listen to this nonsense. It was very disappointing.
Don't be so quick to dismiss this "baby-in-the-bath-water" scenario. Something about this case (and Werner's interpretation) is beyond your simple, off-hand dismissal of a man's sanity. According to Werner, something has impacted the health of his herd. He does have documentation to back up his forensic analysis and legal claims. I don't think he's crazy—he's definitely pissed! But, I interviewed him at length (and based on my "amateur" understanding of animal husbandry) he may have a case. Sure, on-air, he comes across like he's pissed, motivated (and delusional?), but he does claim to have a solid body of documentation bolstering his claims. Remember: we covered a 30+ year process in a mere 120 minutes.

IMO he is dealing w/ something abnormal—worthy of investigation. What that truly is? I dunno. Are there any Maritime Province investigator-volunteers out there willing to agree to make a trip to his farm for an in-depth visit and help the investigation to move forward?If so, let me know.

As many of us know, the "cattle mutilation" phenomenon is highly complex and there are no "one-size-fits-all" answers to explain this mystery. Hopefully, after listening to Werner on the show, you've got a sense that this subject is a potential vehicle for cultural programming. That's just a "what-if" opinion—accept of reject at your leisure.

...
 

Grifynne

Paranormal Adept
I've been listening for a few weeks so thought I would join the forum. :) Great show, by the way!

I just listened to the Werner Bock archived show and I have mixed thoughts. He definitely was a difficult guest and one that is easy to dismiss as delusional. Perhaps there is a little more to it, though. He seemed to lose his place once in a while, going off on tangents. Is it possible that the combination of language barriers and an aging mind could possibly make his ability to provide concise responses more difficult? I can't say I'm sold on his story in its entirety, but that was quite a lot of "to do" for something that was completely made up (if it was in fact a farce).

I think there may be a touch of paranoia, but what if you have an elderly person who lives alone and is maybe a little paranoid (or at the very least, suspicious of groups, government, etc.) who also happens to live in a place with strange occurrences? The activity isn't exactly the same but this brought to mind the Skinwalker Ranch incidents. What if some of his land was a sort of Skinwalker Ranch light version? How would someone in his situation and at his age interpret the activity and communicate with others about the incidents? Maybe much like he did. And when he goes to professionals, they may have the knee jerk reaction like many seem to and take him for a crazy person (which would, of course, further his idea that he's being targeted/intentionally brushed off). He has no one living with him to back up his stories or clarify points he's having trouble making. I'm sure that is frustrating as well.

Just a thought. The jury is out on this one as far as I am concerned. And I admit it was difficult to listen to at times.

Disclaimer: I am in no way indicating that all older people cannot communicate well. I know/knew people decades older than Mr. Brock who had no problem communicating and interpreting the world around them. I'm simply saying that there are some people who do not age as well and sometimes those changes impact them more noticeably and earlier in life.
 

Secretbanana

Skilled Investigator
Oh COME on Christopher.

Try to look up Paranoid Personality Disorder, this guy checks all the boxes and fits the criteria perfectly.

He has absolutely no proof, beyond some pictures which don't show anything other than his own incompetence and maltreatment of those poor cows...

He even HAD experts look into it, like the vet he mentioned on the show, But since he doesn't like his professional opinion, that there wasn't anything abnormal about the dead cow, he chooses to dismiss the vet as either incompetent or "one of them"

You seriously can't recognize a nut when he's standing in front of you raving about "local grassroots mafia groups"?!?
 

Paleontologist

Skilled Investigator
Now I'm disappointed. I understand that there will be the occasional show derailed by an odd guest, but the response by Christopher above tries desperately to put a baby in this cold bathwater. "He does have documentation to back up his forensic analysis and legal claims." I'm not at all convinced there is any value in this "documentation". Also: "IMO he is dealing w/ something abnormal—worthy of investigation." There clearly HAS been much investigation -- a criminal case! -- but none of it supporting death rays or UN conspiracies. If this is the kind of investigation Christopher wants to spend time and resources on, then his research is doomed for lack of discrimination and clarity.
 

Melly

Paranormal Novice
Sure, on-air, he comes across like he's pissed, motivated (and delusional?), but he does claim to have a solid body of documentation bolstering his claims. Remember: we covered a 30+ year process in a mere 120 minutes.
Well, from listening to the interview it would seem to me that if he had this documentation that he *claims* to have, he would've been vindicated. When you both asked him to produce proof he talked in circles and never directly answered the questions until the end when he admitted to not having any samples. Then when you told him how to get samples his response was that he's going to sell his cattle. Hmmm... As you guys brought up during the conversation, if this was his livelihood for so many years and his name was being dragged through the mud, then there are things he could've done to vindicate himself. In addition, if he was so desperate, and without resources as he claimed, and someone who was as well known in the field of cattle mutilation as yourself offered free help...why wouldn't he jump at it? Instead he nervously pushed it aside and dismissed it. While I am sure that something is happening on his farm..be it neglect or vandalism, I have serious doubts about his claims unless some tangible evidence proves otherwise.


How would someone in his situation and at his age interpret the activity and communicate with others about the incidents? Maybe much like he did.
He wasn't elderly when this began in the mid 70's, yet by his admission not much has changed. Also, I don't feel like the language barrier would contribute to this in any way. He speaks English very well, and often uses idioms that only a truly fluent speaker would use. I am an English teacher, and my husband is a native German/Swedish speaker and although it can cause problems about the sense or strength of a particular word or phrase, it would not manifest itself in the way Mr. Bock interprets his cattle issues. At least in my experienced opinion.
 

wwkirk

Paranormal Adept
Many of the posters regard Mr. Bock as delusional. But something has been happening to his herd. Maybe his conspiracy theories are overblown, but someone seems to be acting against him. Just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean they are not out to get you.

How do the doubters deal with the basic facts?
 

Goggs Mackay

Administrator
Staff member
I didn't get past about 10 mins, I don't even know what his evidence or lack thereof, was. I actually had a premonition (!) of a bad show because very early on, both Gene and Chris (you could hear it in their voices) were immediately annoyed with not being able to follow his answers?

I may have been premature but I sensed this was going 'The way of the (Aaron) Kaplan.'
 

Chuck Garabedian

Paranormal Novice
Being a Canadian of German background myself ......well all I can do after listening to this man is hang my head in shame.

I was a bit surprised that the Partacast brought on this individual as a guest. Did you not entirely know his background and "theories" or was he brought out in order to question him and perhaps expose what he is doing/stating?

I've met people not far off from this guy in my part of the country but frankly have just ignored soon after I meet them as I recognize them for who they are.
 

aldo poe

Paranormal Novice
Hi guys I love the show I am a loyal listener,but I must say the Werner show was a confusing mess. None of his arguments had any basis in truth and it was two hours of this gentlemen babbling incoherently.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
I agree Werner comes across as a troubled person. But that doesn't mean his problems with cattle deaths, some mutilated, shouldn't be taken seriously. His conclusions may be steeped in wacky conspiracy theories, but that doesn't mean the events themselves didn't happen. Now maybe I'm an old softie, but I have to feel bad for the guy, living alone on his ranch, with no family or close friends to help him deal with his problems. That doesn't help one's mental health any, and it's very unhealthy in any respect.

It would be nice, however, if an independent cattle mutilation investigator did a hands-on investigation with no preconceptions.
 

williamjwhite

Paranormal Maven
Part of the reason that I finally broke down and joined the forum was directly related to Mr. Bock's appearance on the show. Yes, it did seem farfetched, but I was almost willing to give the man the benefit of the doubt. I say that because I couldn't help but think that if there was any truth to his story, it could explain his general paranoia. I mean, think about it, if this was happening to you for nearly forty years, wouldn't you think it would take a bit of a toll on your sanity too? That said, when he became so insistent that he couldn't get any samples to anyone for testing, that was the point when all of his credibility disappeared for me. I didn't buy into all of the technical aspects of his story, or all of the conspiratorial aspects, but I was willing to entertain the idea that something very strange was happening. But, if this stuff was really happening wouldn't you want to get to the bottom of it?
 


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