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Ray Stanford has a photo of the Socorro craft & Martin Willis has seen it and is impressed but...

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I'd like to know more about the brother's work, or even just his name if you have it. Thanks.

His twin brother Rex, who is a past President of the Parapsychological Association.

Rex G. Stanford

Guy Lyon Playfair wrote a good book on telepathy between twins. I wonder if Ray and his brother ever shared any telepathic or paranormal experiences. I wonder what his parents thought about the paranormal, given the direction both of their sons went in. There's a lot about Ray that is rarely talked about. I'd like to hear about some of that stuff.
 
It also changes ones perspective on Ray when it is learned that Ray used to live with George Adamski. I mean, if I had compelling UFO footage to show everyone but then you learned I used to live with Billy Meier, would it change what you thought about my photo's & videos?
 
Get the facts straight. He never ever said humans. And Chavez showed up as the craft was still visably leaving. ( At the end of the primary event) Duh.
Your post here is either willful disinformation, completely false, or you, Ben Moss, do NOT know THE FACTS about your statements claiming to know the truth about this matter in the Socorro case.

I lean towards willful disinformation, because you've done it already, imo, with "the need to know" debate. You can't even answer a simple question with a yes or no about it. It shows a clear bias with a clear attempt to distort the truth. Imo.

The real truth is Ray Stanford was not a UFO investigator at 26 years old working for any organization when he went to Socorro. He does say he sent a report to NICAP, but he does not go to Socorro on their direction. He arrived the following Monday morning at the police station three days AFTER the Friday Socorro event to begin to learn what happened, though Ray himself is unclear about the exact timing and date. (He says he takes notes, so maybe that info is available.) He was NOT able to speak with Zamora there, because Hynek was already there interviewing Zamora.

Let's get the FACTS straight:

1) Chavez would NOT cooperate with Ray Stanford the way Ray wanted him too, because Chavez thought this was a Secret Government Project. Chavez probably knew this 26 year old had no credentials to do any official interviews with police anyway. Wink! Chavez said publicly he NEVER saw the Egg including where the Egg had floated up and moved off.

IF it is true, as reported elsewhere, I gave a link to that wiki, that Ray Stanford in 2009 said Chavez saw the object, then I already have Ray Stanford contradicting himself and discrediting his own 'on record' words. Yup, I have PROOF. For some drama I say: Boom! As Zamora said about the loud explosive blast.

Ben Moss: put up or shut up about what Chavez said. You sir, claim to KNOW the facts calling me and others here dunces among many other put down snide remarks, but it is you that apparently needs that dunce cap to use your own words. YOU, Ben Moss fail to know the truth about Chavez, or, more likely, you're just a disinformation agent. Thanks for your worthless disinformation.

Ben Moss: Next up is your absolutely absurd claim that Zamora never said Humans???????????? Get real. What did he say? Humanoids?

You're going down BIG TIME with a CRASH and BURN Ben Moss on this idea too! What are THE FACTS Ben Moss? You've got some Humanoid disinformation for us too?

Guess what Ben Moss: Boom! I've got The Proof how this Humanoid BS [other than human idea] was played as more disinformation by you and whom else??? OMGosh, I wonder who started that Humanoid idea and Humanoid rumor BS. Is it by chance in Ray's Book???? LOL.

Put up or shut up Ben Moss, because I've got the proof to PROVE otherwise!

Are you, Ben Moss, suggesting Zamora said these were not humans? Prove it. Prove it that Hynek put in his report that Zamora said these were not Humans too. Is there even any mention by Hynek about this "humanoid" matter in his report? Prove it. I can tell you now I have PROOF otherwise, so Boom! I think you have some more disinformation egg on your face about these alleged "humanoids".

Btw, Ben Moss is the Chief Field Investigator for MUFON VA, so I really think he needs to clear his disinformation deck about Chavez and the humans. We've been dealt everything but the facts. Let's see if Moss can set the record straight vs the good "smoking gun" information I have waiting for his reply. Of course, I seriously doubt he will reply, because I've exposed THE FACTS already!
 
I read 6 diffrent write ups on the event. Depending on who is writing the description. .the two were described as. .
1. Children or small adults
2.small people
3.small humans
4. small humanoids
5.enitys
The only way to be sure what Zamora said is to see the original police report or the earliest reports on the sighting.
The fact is only Zamora saw the occupants of the craft.

Sent from my SCH-I435 using Tapatalk
 
Personal attacks and name calling add nothing to the debate. I join Chris in asking for civil discussion.

Sent from my SCH-I435 using Tapatalk
 
I read 6 diffrent write ups on the event. Depending on who is writing the description. .the two were described as. .
1. Children or small adults
2.small people
3.small humans
4. small humanoids
5.enitys
The only way to be sure what Zamora said is to see the original police report or the earliest reports on the sighting.
The fact is only Zamora saw the occupants of the craft.
Here's what Zamora allegedly said for Project Blue Book about Humans. Zamora never said these were occupants, nor did he say there was a hatch to enter the Egg:

Saw two people in white coveralls very close to the object. One of these persons seemed to turn and look straight at my car and seemed startled--seemed to jump quickly somewhat.

[...]

The only time I saw these two persons was when I had stopped, for possibly two seconds or so, to glance at the object. I don't recall noting any particular shape or possibly any hats, or headgear. These persons appeared normal in shape--but possibly they were small adults or large kids.
======================================

Well, well, and just read how Ben Moss or Ray Stanford would have you believe. Humanoids?

Here's EXACTLY what I think about such disinformation, distortions, and trash talk:

Ray Stanford has a photo of the Socorro craft & Martin Willis has seen it and is impressed but...
 
When it comes to Stanford I find myself polarized in both directions at the same time. On one hand I think he seems rather remarkable, but on the other, I think that if everyone has to kiss his butt in just the right way to get him to share the evidence he has, he can keep it stuffed up there until the Sun goes nova. Sure, old photos and films might be interesting, but in the bigger picture they're just not all that relevant anymore. We don't need either Ray or the PTB to confirm alien visitation. We already know that's taken place. What we want are the details about where they're from, how they got here, and why.

A Composite Graphic of the Socorro Incident Craft Taking Off
Assembled from witness description and a local landscape image.


SocorroUFO-01a.png


BTW: Still not sure the Socorro craft was alien.
More likely some sort of secret
military project.
 
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I just read a bunch of the actual scanned reports about Socorro. One of the conclusions is that it was a lunar lander prototype. They just didn't know exactly which one and from where. The conclusion also makes the statement that it was NOT a space ship from another world. Whatever it was, it's from Earth.
 
I do not think that Lonnie would be the object of a psy ops mission. That is ludicrous. The 4 dots comment could not be more wrong. 2 pictures produces parallax. Both pictures have objects that are easily discernible after enlargement. Many of these comments I understand are because you have not seen the data or know the film and camera type. Once released after careful analysis you will understand. There is no duck. (Jeez) When released it will be open for all to do their own work on but we will not stream it live, charge a fee or rent a room. It is not a mummy. It is not a toy, a hoax or a flying pig. It is not staged, nor hoaxed. But of course many will not believe any of this even after it is out. Be patient we want to do it right. After you can say whatever you want but for now speculation is healthy but it is not a conspiracy even if you really want it to be one. The lunar lander did not have an internal engine in 1964 and was being dropped from a cable. It was not that either.
 
Development flights
LM-1 was built to make the first unmanned flight for propulsion systems testing, launched into low Earth orbit atop a Saturn IB. This was originally planned for April 1967, to be followed by the first manned flight later that year. But the LM's development problems had been underestimated, and LM-1's flight was delayed until January 22, 1968, as Apollo 5. At that time, LM-2 was held in reserve in case the LM-1 flight failed, which did not happen.

LM-3 now became the first manned LM, again to be flown in low Earth orbit to test all the systems, and practice separation, rendezvous, and docking. planned for Apollo 8 in December 1968. But again, last-minute problems delayed its flight until Apollo 9 on March 3, 1969. A second, higher Earth orbit manned practice flight had been planned to follow LM-3, but this was canceled to keep the program timeline on track.

Apollo 10 launched on May 18, 1969, using LM-4 for a "dress rehearsal" for the lunar landing, practicing all phases of the mission except powered descent initiation through takeoff. The LM descended to 47,400 feet (14.4 km) above the lunar surface, then jettisoned the descent stage and used its ascent engine to return to the CSM.[11
 
The lunar module’s first flight was unmanned, aboard a specially-configured Saturn 1B for an Earth orbital mission for Apollo 5. As evidence of the problems encountered with development of the lunar module, LM-1 was not fitted with glass windows, but with aluminum plates; during a pressurization test, one of the glass windows shattered. In addition, LM-1 would be launched without its landing legs or environmental control system; LM-2 was built but never flown.

SA-204 with its LM-1 payload was launched on January 22, 1968. It was successfully inserted into a 163-by-222-kilometer Earth orbit. The first lunar module decent engine programmed burn of 39 seconds stopped prematurely after four seconds by a flight software error. Flight controllers nevertheless conducted several descent engine burns as well as the “fire in the hole” ascent engine test to simulate separation from the descent stage. Despite the anomaly of the first descent engine burn, NASA deemed the remainder of the lunar module tests so successful that the second unmanned mission was canceled.

Apollo 9 mission planning and flight hardware
 
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