One of my experiences

[DavidRavenMoon]

Hello everyone, my name is David, and I'm new here. I'm 51, and I've been having very odd experiences since I was a young child. My older brother (who is now 62) has also had odd experiences, some of which coincide with mine, even though we had them separately, and at separate times. I'll elaborate on those at another time.

Not all my experiences have anything to do with UFO's, and actually most don't, but they all seem related somehow.

So here's one of them. This was in about 1969-70, and I was in Middle School (Jr High). This would make me about 12-13. I grew up in Orange, NJ, and on the next corner from where my house was is a brook (either known as Wigwam brook or Second River). It's a small brook, but has steep cement walls because it floods when it rains heavy.

So it was probably late February/March, and there was still some snow on the ground what was starting to melt... so you have patches of snow, and soggy ground. I was hanging out with 6 other boys, two of them were close friends, Jerry and John, and the rest were friends of John. I've known Jerry since I was about 4. I can't remember exactly who the rest were. So we were sitting on my front porch, I think it was about 8-9PM. I know it was already dark. The sky was overcast that day, and I noticed lights moving in the clouds that seemed very odd. It was like a headlight from a car or landing lights on a plane, but it was going back and forth. So I point this out to my friends and we are sitting there watching this and wondering what it was.

Now this is where things start getting weird. We think we could see something that the lights are attached to... it was a brownish colored shape, tapered on either end, and the lights were on the end, and maybe some in the middle. That part is sketchy. We could see an outline in the clouds. We all came to the conclusion that it was a flying saucer (people didn't say UFO back then), and then we decided it was heading for the train tracks up the street, and seemed to be descending. I don't know why we thought that... even a few days later it seemed odd. But we all agreed it was landing. This was the old Erie-Lackawanna freight line that had been defunct for a few years. On my street the train tracks were a block way, but on the next block they ran alongside the brook.

So we decide to all go take a walk and see what this thing was. As I said we thought we saw it going down... I say "thought" because we were all kind of confused about it. It was sort of dream like.. things weren't making any sense. I'm not sure if that's because we were seeing something we didn't understand, or something else was going on. But everything was odd feeling, kind of not real.

So we gathered a bunch of sticks and things... I remember two of us had these aluminum poles from a tent, and maybe an old Army MP billy club. We must have looked like a mob of angry townspeople going after the troll! All we needed was torches. So we walked up the street directly in front of my house and then made a right at the next corner. The train tracks crossed that street. On the other side of that street was an area where the tracks ran along side the brook. It was dark back there because it was behind some empty factory buildings on the right (US Radium factory), and on the left was the brook, and then the backs of houses on another street. It was overgrown with bushes and stuff since the train didn't run anymore.

So we start walking along the tracks and we see this object maybe 50 feet away. It was very dark back there, but we can make out an outline that looked like the thing in the sky. I thought it looked like the typical saucer shape, but it didn't have a dome or anything on top. It appeared to be sitting very close to the ground, or directly on the ground. It was very dark. Looked maybe 15 to 20 feet in diameter.

So now we are all looking at this thing, and wondering what it is... of course we are all thinking it's a flying saucer. We are scared sh!tless! We are trying to get the nerve up to walk back there (we should have taken flash lights, but it was very impromptu) and just then I hear a splash in the brook to my left. The walls of the brook are probably 12 feet high, and the water level is only a couple of inches. It runs up the middle of the cement part. My friends used to go down there and walk along the water. Since this was right by where the street crossed over the brook, the water was slightly deeper and wider, and there was a mud "island" in the middle. So I hear a splash and look down in the brook. I can see this area because of a street light a few feet away. What I saw was two creatures, about 4 feet high. They were very dark, and appeared to be covered with black fur. They had very large round glowing green eyes. I couldn't make out a face... just the two big eyes looking at me. Larger than human eyes. I really couldn't see any surface details on them at all. Just shaggy black stuff. They were posturing as if they were leaning over to look at us and didn't want to be detected. One creature was slightly behind the other. They had their arms raised slightly like someone trying to walk quietly would.

My heart dropped to my feet, and I said something to my friends, who then looked down in the brook, but they were gone. But at least two of the guys said "what was that down there?" Then someone said "where's Jerry?".. he was gone, so in a panic we hauled ass up the street as fast as we could!

We made the left onto the street that faces my house, and there on his front steps was Jerry, out of breath and white as a ghost! So we asked him what happened and he said that he felt something touch his arm, and turned to see a dark hairy creature with large glowing green eyes, and then turned and ran home as fast as he could. He didn't see them in the brook and had left right before we saw them.

We were all very shaken up about this and didn't tell anyone. So the next day John and I went for a walk to the area, in the daylight. Back in the wooded area was a large circle melted in the snow... right down to the soil. Down in the brook, where the mud was, were a number of very odd prints. We also saw these in the snow. They looked like this: ( ) Sort of like hoof prints open in the front and back. They were small, about 2.5 to 3 inches from front to back, and they were more-or-less one in front of the other. Not staggered like human foot prints.

So I went home to see if my dad had plaster or something so I could make a cast of it. I found some kind of plaster that was a funny pinkish tan color, and mixed some up in a coffee can and went back up the street to the site. I poured some in a couple of the prints in the snow.

I went back the next day, with my friend John, and the plaster had dried, but had been broken into pieces. I probably said "who the heck would do that?" John had some stupid answer that "there's these kids who walk on the tracks breaking plaster in the snow with sticks" ... yeah John... OK. So I figured he did it. I don't know if he was trying to remove it from the snow, or just broke it for what ever stupid reason he had. He was flaky like that. I was very disappointed.

As the years past, I started to doubt the UFO part of the experience... just because it seemed to be so very vague. Like I couldn't remember much about that part. But I remembered the creatures very clearly.

Now, fast forward to about 1972. I was in High School and I had a girl friend that lived in West Orange, which was right up the street (right by the Thomas Edison laboratory). I never told her this story... I don't think I told anyone except my brother. Me and my friends didn't talk much about it, but we did acknowledge that it happened.

So one evening I'm walking Ruth home. It was about 10PM, and was sometime in the winter. We are walking along with me on the street side of the sidewalk. The brook wound around under part of the old Edison factory and under the street we were walking on (Lakeside Ave). Just as we passed the brook there was the sound of cracking ice. It was cold enough that while the water was free flowing in the middle, it iced up on either side. She looked down in the brook when she heard the noise, screamed and ran up the street!

I looked down and didn't see anything, except the ice was broken. So I chase after her and caught up to her at the next corner, where she had stopped. She was really freaking out. I calmed her down and asked what happened? She said she heard the noise, and then saw a small dark hairy thing with big glowing green eyes looking at her! I then told her the experience my friends and I had a couple of years earlier.

Now, we fast forward a few more years. I think it was about 1976-77. I'm still living in the same house, and Debbie, my girlfriend at the time, lived around the corner on the street that ran alongside the brook. I never told Deb about there incidences, but Debbie was no stranger to odd things. She would constantly have light bulbs burn out when she turned on the lamp, and once we were on a roof top of a 100+ year old building in town were she used to live, and were being pelted by small pebbles from out of a clear blue sky! We were three stories up, and it would have been hard for someone to throw them that high, plus when we looked over the edge, we didn't see anyone.

Back to the story... so one Saturday morning about 8am, my phone rings. I was still in bed. I answer it and it's Debbie, and she's hysterical. She had a large Belgium Shepherd dog, and he was barking in the background, and he was a very calm dog. So I get her to calm down and she said her dog started barking out the window... really making a lot of noise. They lived on one of the upper floors in a house that overlooked the brook, which was across the street (Gist Place). So she gets out of bed to see what he's barking at, and she sees across the street on top of a garage that is along side the brook (on the opposite bank in a backyard) something she described as a black hairy ape, like an orangutan, with large green eyes, and a pot belly like it was pregnant, on top of the garage roof. It grabbed ahold of a willow tree that hung into the brook, and slid down and ran towards the street overpass!

Now a few interesting tidbits... I was no stranger to flying saucer lore. I had been interested in them since as far back as I can remember (and not sure when that started or why), and I had read about the dark hairy "bellicose dwarfs" that were reported I think back in the 70's. So I assumed these were the same creatures. But later since they seemed to be appearing in the brook, and independent of any saucer sightings, I started to think maybe it was just some cryptozoological oddity. But my feeing had been that while they were clearly real creatures, they might not be living in the book, or even be in this reality all the time. I spent a lot of time in and around that brook, and never saw any signs of them. But when I was younger I had a recurring dream about that brook.. something was going on at night, and there were people with spotlights and stuff.

Also the site of what we thought was the UFO landing is where the former United States Radium factory is located. The building was still there, as were several next to it (my mom worked in a sequin factory next to the radium factory). All those buildings, and the tracks are gone, as part of a SuperFund project. There was old radioactive ore buried under the ground back there. They have since dug up all the old soil.

You can read about it here: Radium Girls.

(As an aside to that story... I used to have another recurring dream where I found a path that joined all the backyards in the neighborhood together.. after I moved from the area, the SuperFund took down a few houses and dug up the backyards.. Making it look just like that dream.)

The other interesting thing was years after that sighting, I was in the local library reading a book on UFO's. It was maybe 1976 or so. I don't recall the book, but it talked about a case in 1855 in Devonshire, England. This is commonly referred to as the "Devil at Devonshire".

The London Times wrote this at the time:

It appears that on Thursday night last there was a heavy fall of snow in the neighborhood of Exeter and the south of Devon. On the following morning, the inhabitants of the above towns were surprised at discovering the tracks of some strange and mysterious animal, endowed with the power of ubiquity, as the foot-prints were to be seen in all kinds of inaccessible places – on the tops of houses and narrow walls, in gardens and courtyards enclosed by high walls and palings, as well as in open fields. There was hardly a garden in Lympstone where the footprints were not observed.

The track appeared more like that of a biped than a quadruped, and the steps were generally eight inches in advance of each other. The impressions of the feet closely resembled that of a donkey's shoe, and measured from an inch and a half to two and a half inches across. Here and there it appeared as if cloven, but in the generality of the steps the shoe was continuous, and, from the snow in the center remaining entire, merely showing the outer crest of the foot, it must have been convex.

One of the illustrations in the book looked exactly like the prints that we saw that day!

There is an illustration at Wikipedia that shows them closed in the front, like a horseshoe, but the prints we saw, and the ones in the book were open in the front. (see below)

Of course I'm not saying the same "creature" made the prints, but when I saw them in the book it sent chills down my spine!

So that's one of my strange tales. I'm wondering if anyone else living in that part of NJ saw anything strange around that time.

For people who want to follow along, I've attached a small map showing our path. We started at A, and the first event happened at the X. The brook is in green. B and C are the places of the other two sightings by the girl friends.

Here's an illustration of the Devonshire tracks that looked a lot like what we saw.

 

[skunkape]

On more than one occasion, when I was very young, I was terrified by what looked to me like midgets in furry, teddy-bear costumes walking around the house at night. I don't recall seeing glowing, green eyes...best I can remember, the eyes were like circular, black glass buttons. Whatever it was, it scared the living crap out of me and I would hide under the blankets until I woke up in the morning.
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[DavidRavenMoon]

It seems young children can often see things that grownups can't. I don't know if it's because we become conditioned, or something else.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

I have some updates to this thread I started way back when. I got a chance to talk to a few old friends that shared this experience with me. First it was Debbie who had seen one of these creatures out her window. We had gotten back in contact with each other on FaceBook, so I asked her about the incident, and she reminded me of a few other weird things.

She answered:

Yeah, I remember the Gist Place incident. I remember taking notice of the dog with all the fur raised up on his back and he was kind of snarling, growling and moving slowly towards the window. Best way I can describe what I saw was I thought it looked almost like a monkey-type thing swinging down into the brook. Geez...I getting chills just writing about it.

Then she said "I remember Jerry always talking about some kind of troll/elf/leprechaun type critter with a rather long beard being on his front steps."

Troll???? I hadn't heard this before. I got to see Jerry in December before he and his wife moved to the Philippines. We met at a local Starbucks and at some point I asked him about the brook incident. He remembered it pretty much the same as me. He described the creature that touched his arm before he ran home which matched what I saw.

Then I asked him about the troll. He said once when he was a kid he was in his backyard and turned to see a small man about 2 or 3 feet tall with a very long beard. He said it was dressed like you expect a troll/elf/leprechaun to be dressed. They looked at each other for a while and it just vanished. Then years later when he was in his 20's, he was home and his nephew was over and taking a nap upstairs in a room they called the "shower room". It used to be a large bathroom which was converted to a bedroom, and still had the shower head sticking out of the wall! He always told me it was a strange room and felt odd things happened there. I remember it from when I was younger.

He said his nephew, which was about 5, started screaming and ran downstairs to the living room. His nephew said he was napping and then woke to see a small man with a long beard in the room looking at him!

Debbie had some other interesting stories as well. I remembered that she used to see a large black dog in her house. Once it was laying at the foot of her bed and she woke up and pushed it off with her feet. But the rest of the stuff I had forgotten.

OMG the phantom black dog. That was something that kept appearing for many years through my life. I first remember seeing very large black dog out of nowhere when I was like 5 years old. Scared the crap out of me. I remember one time riding with you and maybe Nic Ferro going to the city and a large black dog bolted across the road in front of the car and kind of stood there and looked at the car coming and then took off and I do believe it finally ended when I think I was dreaming (or something) and I woke up screaming and at the same time a car hit a black dog out in the street. I was at your house......do you remember?

I remember both of these incidents. The "city" referred to is NYC. That's what we call it here in NJ. Nic was our drummer in a band at the time. Debbie was the singer/keyboardist/saxophonist. This really big black dog just jumped over a divider or something in front of the car and stood there staring at us and then took off. We all felt it was very strange. The second incident happened when Debbie had stayed over my place. She woke up screaming in the middle of the night and a few seconds later we heard car tires skidding and a large thump and a blood curdling howl. We ran outside and saw a very large black dog in the street that was coming out from between two parked cars. It had apparently been struck by a car and its head was crushed. It's important to note that she woke before the dog was hit by the car. I think she was dreaming about the dog or something. This was around '79/80 I think.

Then she mentioned the building from the 1800's with the falling stones:

That house on Main and High streets was crazy active with something. As we sat on the roof small stones were being thrown at us and no one around. I remember one time, again, watching my other dog staring at something rather intently and when I look to see what she was looking at......the TV and the TV stand were swaying back and forth (gently mind you, but moving). Also at that place the dog was forever getting locked in the kitchen pantry when we went out (?) and if you put your keys smack down in the center of the table and walked away for a bit, you would come back to find they were no longer there. That actually started to be a bit of game we would play.

Then there was the "moon" story I had forgotten about!

I would say most outstanding weird moment was when I was around 7 or 8 years old and I was out in the garden with my mom and she was watering her plants and I ketp pestering her about where the moon was. (it was just around evening when we were outside) Any ways.....next thing you know there is this gianormous red ball in the sky kind of just sitting up above the trees. I saw it, mom saw it and our downstairs neighbor saw it. He was so frightened he ran into the house and called the police and I think he tried to call the military. While he was calling the authorities, the darn thing just disappeared in the wink of an eye and then we saw it again in the distance (very small) and it just swooshed right back to where it had been above the tree. I remember that it appeared to not have any dimension to it. Again it disappeared and we never saw it again. According to the authorities it was a meteor. SURE! Any ways years later I was talking about it and Madeline said they saw a red ball flying through the sky and heading towards Main Street (she lived in the valley part of Orange). Now that's weird. She saw it flying and so did a few others.

That would probably have been about 1966. Evidently Orange NJ is a weird place!

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

New stuff

As long as I'm here, I'll mention a few new strange things that have happened recently. I have already mentioned the odd blinking white light flying around the trees in my backyard.

I don't remember if I posted this, but on three separate occasions I woke up with very odd scratches on my right inside upper arm. They looked sort of like cat scratches, but where thinner, like someone had taken four or five needles and dragged them on my arm. They were about five inches long, and very red looking. They were parallel to each other. They weren't puffy like cat scratches get though. They were rather painful but there was no blood. My wife didn't know what to make of it. It happened twice and then the final time is weird.. I was sitting on our couch and realized that my arm felt sore. It was in the middle of the afternoon on a Saturday. I pulled up the sleeve on my T shirt and there were the scratches again. Only about 3 this time. I felt kind of confused because they weren't there when I got up, and I couldn't account for them. Now I wish I had taken a photo of them.

Back in December I had something very weird happen. I woke up about 4:30-5 am, and it was still dark out, and very dark in our bedroom. For some reason I opened my eyes and looked at the celling over me. I was still half asleep, but not dreaming, as I looked at the time on the clock, which we keep across the room (so we have to get out of bed to turn off the alarm).

This is hard to describe, but above my head was this odd rotating thing. It was a grayish/greenish color, but it's hard to say because it was dark. It rotated slowly in a clockwise motion. It was as if a segment was cut from a wheel or disk, and that segment was rotating around an unseen axis, as if the rest of the disk was still there.

There were some kind of patterns or something on this segment, as if it was carved from stone. Then I realized I saw a face on it looking at me. I thought it was my cat's face, but then it started to look like the "skull" face I saw when I was 4, and I became frightened and closed my eyes. As I looked at this thing it would "slip" down towards my feet. It's hard to describe, but it was hard to keep my eyes on it, and either my eyes would move, or the thing moved, so as I watched it, it would move down. I felt it was my eyes having a hard time keeping focused on it.

Then after a few moments I opened my eyes again, and this time it was a full disk made from what looked like the same material. It was rotating clockwise like the one with the face. It reminded me of a sand dollar. It had some kind of patterns on it, but it was hard to understand. It also slipped downward as I tried to keep my eyes on it.

Once again I ended up closing my eyes. This was a funny thing because I was awake, but it was as if I was so tired I couldn't keep my eyes open. It was a real struggle. I opened them again and looked at the ceiling above me, and this time I saw some kind of green patterns forming. Kind of fractal looking or something, but once again I have no words to describe it. I did draw what I remembered the best I could as soon as I woke up. Some details were impossible to draw as I can't really understand what I was looking at.

I was intrigued by this, and on the following days made my self look at the celling as soon as I thought about it when it was still dark in the room. The interesting thing is even though I was in the dark, and my eyes had been closed for hours, I had that impression you see if you look at a bright light and then close your eyes... that sort of after image left behind. The next few days I saw the following. These are all things I can't begin to understand, so I feel my brain saw them as familiar things, or something. The first was kind of funny, and it looked like a Saint Patrick's Day thing you might hang on a wall... it was like sparkly green, and looked like a shamrock with some writing, but I couldn't read it, and I knew that wasn't what it was. The writing and the "shamrock" had thick outlines.

The next night I saw what looked like "scribbles" or a lot of string in a random messy pattern. Unfortunately I didn't write any of this down when it happened, except the drawing I made, which I neglected to date. I need to keep a note book by the bed.

A few other weird things which I may or may not have posted here was one night I was woken by a slap in the face! I jumped out of bed and yelled "HEY!" My first thought was that my wife rolled over in her sleep and flailed an arm that hit me. But she was sound asleep facing away from me with one arm tucked between her legs and the other in front of her. She didn't wake when I yelled. Our bedroom door was still closed. This was about 3 am. I remember I was having a pleasant dream when I was slapped, so I know I didn't dream it, plus my face still hurt.

Another night I had a very very strange lucid dream where I was shown the name of a women, except when ever it was shown it was written backwards. This writing looked a lot like the "shamrock" thing, with the thick outline. I was told the name also meant "something was not right" and that I was to tell people that "I had the most amazing dream". In those words. In the morning I told my wife I had a really weird dream. I couldn't get myself to say it! I didn't recognize the woman in the dream.

A few other things.. I also don't remember if I mentioned these here yet. One evening around 10 PM I was standing at the kitchen table doing something. The doorway to our kitchen is to my left, and has a dark brown curtain hanging in it for when we use a window air conditioner in the living room. We haven't used that in a few years, but we like the curtain so we left it up. My 18 year old son was in the next room playing with his XBox. In the corner of my eye I saw the curtain move and someone stick their head in and look at me, and then leave quickly. They seemed to have black and white clothing on, and looked about 5 feet tall. I think I saw black hair. The curtain was still moving when I turned my head and I could hear my son playing the whole time.

I stuck my head out and asked him if he stuck his head in the kitchen, even though I knew it wasn't him. He's like six feet tall.

On another night I thought I saw my 5 year old daughter running from our hallway through the living room and then into the kitchen, kind of flapping her arms while she was running. The doorway between the hallway and living room has a beaded curtain. Yeah, we like curtains. The beads made the usual sound and were still swaying. I was walking from our bedroom following. I figured she went into the kitchen to say good night to her brother. When I got there he was standing leaning against the counter with listening to his iPod. My daughter wasn't in there. It turns out she was already asleep in bed!

My wife got freaked out and said if I keep seeing these things we are moving!

The last incident was a few weeks ago when I was a rehearsal for a band I play in. I was sitting on my amp while the rest of the band was talking on the other side of the room, and heard several seconds of an unintelligible woman's voice directly in my right ear. It startled me, and there was no one near me at the time, and I was near a wall.

The two times I've heard a voice was a male voice, and it was in my head, not in my ears. Only once did I hear a woman's voice, and again it was in my right ear. Only that time I understood what it said to me.

I post this stuff because when I first came here and started reading other people's experiences, I saw that people were having the same or similar things happen. I have no answers about any of this, or even an opinion on what it might mean, but if it strikes a chord with someone else, that's a good thing.

Here's the rotating thing.

 

[Poi]

New stuff

When the Monroe Institute had their series of hemi-sync discs on sale near Xmas so I bought the series. Good thing, the prices are steep again now. But when I finally got myself relaxed enough to just go with whatever I might experience, I saw similar things that you describe, David.

While I was very calm and interested in what floated into my vision, the most interesting to me was the super bright, white and indistinct head that floated up to my left eye from below my vision to stare into my left eye. It was almost skull like and had one one human eye that was lidless. The other eye just wasn't there, but the black area where an eye should have been was also indistinct. Only that veined blue eye staring into my left. It just occurred to me that his right eye looked into my left.

Hemi-sync is all about activating both the left and right hemispheres of the brain fully so that the creative and the reasoned work in sync. I mention this because I wonder if you somehow manage to do that yourself quite naturally. Maybe your being a musician helps. (Or hinders, depending on how you feel about it.)

Sounds to me like you have the makings of a shaman.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

New stuff

Hemi-sync is all about activating both the left and right hemispheres of the brain fully so that the creative and the reasoned work in sync. I mention this because I wonder if you somehow manage to do that yourself quite naturally. Maybe your being a musician helps. (Or hinders, depending on how you feel about it.)

That's very interesting. One interesting thing is that being a musician has taught me to be ambidextrous, and I often prefer to use my left hand for certain things. My dad was left handed, but back in his day (he was born in 1900) they made him use his right hand instead. Left=sinister.

Sounds to me like you have the makings of a shaman.

Now the funny thing is I say all the time that I was a shaman in a former life, and I have no idea why, but I always said that since I was younger. I've been into the occult since I was a teen. My dad had a lot of prophetic dreams, especially concerning when people he knew, or used to know would die. By brother always asked me if any of that happened to me, and it hasn't, but then my brother had a dream about a co worker breaking his leg in a very peculiar accident, and that day when he went to work it happened exactly as in the dream. So something seems to run in the family.

My dreams are either the usual normal stuff, or the Jungian "big dreams" where clearly stuff is coming to me from somewhere else. I generally don't understand most of it, but sometimes I do. The other stuff happened when I was awake, but clearly in an altered brain state of some kind, such as induced by playing a musical instrument, or having just woke up.

Also I have learned to get into that state and let the stuff happen. But sometimes it just happens when I'm not expecting it.

 

[Poi]

New stuff

In a way, I envy your knowing how to induce the state, but my experience, oddly pleasant as it was, also weirded me out. I never made progress with more of the discs so I put them away until I could process how I really feel about "going there."

On a lark, sure, it's incredibly interesting, but I don't think I'm ready to see what you see more often. I've been somewhat concerned about opening Pandora's Box. Doesn't appear that's happened so I'm giving it time while trying to make a little sense of what I saw. I've learned to live with auditory events, but the visual is just too new.

 

[SpecialK]

Wow! David, your experiences are wild. Those childhood experiences with the short furry beings would have freaked me out. Regarding children and the paranormal - they are more open to it. They don't shut it out as quickly, and they are not as caught up in the nuts and bolts of life as are adults. It sounds like your life as a musician has kept you somewhat more open than, say, a businessman commuting to NYC. I am also from NJ, and it is a weird place to be sure.

Do you meditate? Meditation often opens up doors to the paranormal. As Whitley Strieber says, if you sniff at the paranormal it sniffs back.

What I find interesting is the number of people I know who have had paranormal experiences and have never reported them. They mentioned them to me in conversation because I am interested in such things. They are all normal folks, and most had only the one weird experiece. They didn't think much about the events, and just shrugged and forgot about them.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

New stuff

In a way, I envy your knowing how to induce the state, but my experience, oddly pleasant as it was, also weirded me out. I never made progress with more of the discs so I put them away until I could process how I really feel about "going there."

On a lark, sure, it's incredibly interesting, but I don't think I'm ready to see what you see more often. I've been somewhat concerned about opening Pandora's Box. Doesn't appear that's happened so I'm giving it time while trying to make a little sense of what I saw. I've learned to live with auditory events, but the visual is just too new.

Well what used to happen, and sometimes still does, is I start to see this opening of sorts, and at that point I've seen some weird stuff, but then I get scared and pull back from it. So I have been trying to just let it happen. One time I was on the train commuting to work in NYC and had dozed off. I had one of these lucid states, where I knew I was asleep, but conscious of something happening, and saw through this "hole" another landscape. It was quite strange looking. I could see a building or something. Kind of like a big machine, but building size. And then I snapped awake and startled. I was disappointed that it only lasted a few seconds.

So I actually like when it happens, but at the same time an uncontrollable fear can take over at times.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Wow! David, your experiences are wild. Those childhood experiences with the short furry beings would have freaked me out. Regarding children and the paranormal - they are more open to it. They don't shut it out as quickly, and they are not as caught up in the nuts and bolts of life as are adults. It sounds like your life as a musician has kept you somewhat more open than, say, a businessman commuting to NYC. I am also from NJ, and it is a weird place to be sure.

For me, it was quite fascinating. Or at least a day or two later it was. lol At the time it was just plain scary. It's a feeling that something is going on that you have no prior experience with, and you even wonder if it's really happening. You don't know what to do. I suspect that it really affected some of the people that were there. But I remember that we never really talked about it after that. My curiosity made me want to get closer and get a better look at the disk, which was obscured in shadow. You could just see the outline. By the time we saw the little hairy things we took off running. It all happened pretty quickly; probably not more than a couple of minutes.

This weird stuff started when I was about 4 or 5, so after all that time you tend to just think it's normal. Well maybe not normal, but something that happens. Then I talk to other people and they have very strange tales as well. So I really do think this is a normal part of our reality, but either uncommon or ignored. People have been talking about these things for as long as people have been around. At some point society started to dismiss it as superstition. But people did have experiences, and still do, even if mainstream science doesn't think so.

Do you meditate? Meditation often opens up doors to the paranormal. As Whitley Strieber says, if you sniff at the paranormal it sniffs back.

What I find interesting is the number of people I know who have had paranormal experiences and have never reported them. They mentioned them to me in conversation because I am interested in such things. They are all normal folks, and most had only the one weird experiece. They didn't think much about the events, and just shrugged and forgot about them.

Yes, I do, and have since high school. I don't as much as I used to, but I try to. I do find that the more attention you give it, the more stuff that happens.

I had to go back and read what I posted above because I wasn't sure when the post was from.

I believe that is very true, that people don't talk about them. We didn't after the above incident. Probably the reason is that people don't take you seriously and imply that you imagined the whole thing. Except when you meet other people who are interested or have had similar experiences.

I didn't tell people about the hairy dwarf incident until years later, even my family. I only told my wife recently after the story was posted on Jason Offutts blog. And even then I had written to him about a totally different experiences that delt with some type of "shadow" being. My wife said to me "is this true?" with a smirk. I don't know if she believes it, but she's uncomfortable talking about this stuff anyway,

Since posted that stuff here I have had another incident of having scratches on my back. (I think I posted about this before) This time I wasn't aware of it at all, until I had taken my shirt off and my wife saw them. She took a few photos. These didn't hurt like the last two times, except the one behind my neck.

Unfortunately you don't see them as well in the photos. There were more than what you see here. The read bad ones were up by my neck, but I also had them on my arm. These were taken on 22, 2010 at 8:30 PM. I have no recollection of anything that would have caused them.

 

[SpecialK]

It sounds like your paranormal experiences can be unnerving, to say the least. Not having had such frightening experiences - mine were all non-threatening - all I can do is to suggest that you ask to be protected from evil in an affirmation or prayer before you meditate. Keep us up to date on your experiences and any progress in ending negative ones. God bless.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

It sounds like your paranormal experiences can be unnerving, to say the least. Not having had such frightening experiences - mine were all non-threatening - all I can do is to suggest that you ask to be protected from evil in an affirmation or prayer before you meditate. Keep us up to date on your experiences and any progress in ending negative ones. God bless.

You know, I never looked at it as evil. Some unseen presence has been with me since I was young, and has saved my life on two occasions. I may have talked bout his already, but the first time was when I was about seven or eight, and was walking home from a friend's house who lived up the street from me. It was about 4 or 5 pm, and a storm was coming. It was getting dark and windy, and I was getting scared, and walked up the street very slowly. As I turned the corner, with my house visible at the end of the street, someone grabbed me by the shoulders, and I couldn't move. Just then a large limb from a maple tree broke off and landed inches from my feet! I turned to see who grabbed me, and no one was there. I could distinctly feel their hands on my shoulders. I realized the tree limb would have killed me, and turned and ran home as fast as I could!

I always assumed this was what people called a guardian angle, but later realized it was probably the same entity that I saw when I was four, and later told me to write a book and gather people into a movement. That also made me realize how often this happens, and that it's been going on for a long time. The big question is who are these beings? I'm pretty sure they aren't "aliens" in the sense that people think, but they use that persona. I also think it's beyond our understanding, as much as why we are here and what reality really is, is also outside our understanding. Sure, science can learn how the big machine works, but not why or what made it. It's like finding a carburetor, figuring out how it works, but never seeing an internal combustion motor. It's out of context.

Now the scratches and even the time recently when I was slapped int he face while sleeping still don't seem evil. I think we are dealing with a non physical intelligence that can only manifest in our physical plane on a limited basis. So it leaves you with the knowledge that its real. Someone might have imagined seeing things, or hearing voices (very unlikely!), but you can't dismiss physical interactions as easily. (but then the "gold leaf lady" is a case that shows we might be able to manifest things out of nothing).

In the letter from my old friend Debbie, she pointed out that the orange orb seen by her, her mother, a neighbor, and even a childhood friend (who saw it across town by her house) had no dimension to it. It was flat, but was in our 3D space. That seems to imply it either was not part of our 3D reality, or it was taking on some form that we can't interpret correctly. Morphing seemingly solid UFOs are another indicator that we may be seeing the 3D "shadow" of an object from a space that contains more than three dimensions.

 

[trainedobserver]

DRM,

I really appreciate you sharing your experiences with us. As to the motivations of these entities, you had mentioned elsewhere that at some point you felt they wanted you to spread a message or philosophy of some sort. Do you that is the primary motivation behind their interaction with you now, do you feel they still want you to be a conduit for some sort of communication?

Have you heard of Andrew Peake and his work? I mention it because I happen to be reading one of his books at the moment and he has a different kind of take on the guardian angel concept.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

DRM,

I really appreciate you sharing your experiences with us. As to the motivations of these entities, you had mentioned elsewhere that at some point you felt they wanted you to spread a message or philosophy of some sort. Do you that is the primary motivation behind their interaction with you now, do you feel they still want you to be a conduit for some sort of communication?

When that happened it was when I realized this was related to what people call "aliens" and the whole abduction experience. Except I didn't see them, and didn't have the other trappings of the abduction thing, which I think is a show they put on. But I did have the scenes of some kind of impending disasters and the information being "downloaded" into my mind, and the telepathic voice. When it told me (asked me? I forgot which) to write the book and all, I immediately thought of all the religions and cults formed when some apparition appeared before someone and commanded them to do so. So I think this is where ALL the religions and beliefs we have come from. That's the usual stories anyway. Then you have to interpret that as either "them" wanting us to believe in something (true or not) or that they are the presence we associate with religions.

I post my experiences because after this happened I was understandably a bit freaked out. I had been reading about UFOs and the paranormal since I was a kid, but I stated looking up more recent stuff and found this and other podcasts, and saw the correlation in other people's experiences, which validated mine. And its all pieces to a larger puzzle, only we don't know what the picture is suppose to look like, and they are no straight pieces, let alone corners!

But I think it guides people and tries to enlighten us. It told me this would help people. People talk about "first contact"... we have it all the time, one person at a time.

Have you heard of Andrew Peake and his work? I mention it because I happen to be reading one of his books at the moment and he has a different kind of take on the guardian angel concept.

No I haven't. I'll have to look him up. My brother felt it might have been my "higher self" stopping me from being squashed by the tree limb, but as with most of this stuff, it's hard to explain an intangible with another intangible.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

Hi David,

What do you think of people that have no religion or a belief in any sort of higher power? Why can't these beings get to us?

Keep posting your experiences. I find them fascinating.

Thanks.

 

[DavidRavenMoon]

Maybe they think some people are a waste of time? But another interesting thing to consider is that some people believe in aliens and not God, and others have been skeptics until they have some UFO related experience. So it seems to taylor itself to the person. A lot of so-called religious events, such as at Fatima were clearly UFO related events, silver disk and all. Does that mean they weren't religious? Not at all. We don't know what UFOs are, so we can't say if they are the source or the messenger. As people's belief systems change, and the older people with older beliefs die off, things change. But it's very slow and you hardly know it's happening. That's one way to stop the collapse that would happen if some other (maybe advanced) living beings showed up here and said "Hello. Oh and by the way, you got it all wrong..." I don't think humans would like being told they don't know squat about reality. So you have to nudge them along.

Personally I think all organized religions were created to control people. The original intent was then perverted by humans for more control. As scientific as someone is, you have to stop and ask the big question: "why?" As in there was the big bang... but why? What was the event that triggered it. No one can say. And then where did everything come from? Another answer we can't have. Some scientist like to use the convenient answer that there was no reason and it just is. But that's just dumb IMO.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

A lot of so-called religious events, such as at Fatima were clearly UFO related events, silver disk and all. Does that mean they weren't religious?

Fatima was a UFO related event? I've actually never heard that take on that event before. I've always thought of the Fatima and the later Garabandal stories to be the work of the overly active imagination of children. Ultimately, the predictions did not come true.

 

[trainedobserver]

What do you think of people that have no religion or a belief in any sort of higher power?

From what I've read of Mack, Jacobs, Strieber and others there is no religious or belief system perquisite for these experiences. These experiences seem to trigger a great deal of questioning of any established beliefs a great deal of the time anyway. One could argue that whatever their source may be, that triggering the questioning and reevaluation process could be the actual intended outcome. DRM is entirely correct in his observation that this, whatever it actually is, seems to be the source of religious revelation though the ages and is most likely directly responsible for the establishment of religion as a human institution.

 

[Angel of Ioren]

DRM is entirely correct in his observation that this, whatever it actually is, seems to be the source of religious revelation though the ages and is most likely directly responsible for the establishment of religion as a human institution.

I don't disagree with him. I just think that the source is our brain, not something external. Religion stems from it, and it why I think man created gods, and not the other way around.