1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. SUPPORT THE SHOW AND ENJOY A PREMIUM PARACAST EXPERIENCE! Welcome to The Paracast+! For a low subscription fee, you will receive access to an ad-free version of The Paracast, the exclusive After The Paracast podcast, featuring color commentary, exclusive interviews, plus show transcripts, the new Paracast+ Video Channel, Classic Episodes and Special Features categories! We now offer lifetime memberships! You can subscribe via this direct link:
    https://www.theparacast.com/introducing-the-paracast/

    The Official Paracast Store is back! Check out our latest lineup of customized stuff at: The Official Paracast Store!

    Subscribe to The Paracast Newsletter!
    Dismiss Notice

On Jim Moseley

Discussion in 'The Best of Dark Matters Radio' started by Decker, Nov 20, 2017.



  1. Decker

    Decker Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,710
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Occupation:
    Paranormal Curmudgeon
    Location:
    Southern California
    Home Page:
    Gray Barker once famously wrote “UFO is a bucket of shit.” Actually, he wrote a poem titled “UFO is a bucket of shit.

    Its followers: perverts, monomaniacs, dipsomaniacs Artists of the fast buck True believers, objective believers, new age believers Keyhoe believers Shushed by the three men Or masturbated by space men UFO is a bucket of shit The A.F. investigated UFOs And issued a report Couched in polite language Which translated, means: “UFO is a bucket of shit” Meade Layne is a bucket of shit Lex Mebane is a bucket of shit James W. Moseley is a bucket of shit Richard Ogden is a bucket of shit Ray Palmer is a bucket of shit And I sit here writing While the shit drips down my face In great rivulets”


    Barker was a rather famous UFO “investigator” (and many might disagree with that) or figure back in the 1950s or 60s, and was the author of “They Knew Too Much About Flying Saucers”, the famous Bender case. So, what has this to do with the sentiment about UFO or UFOs being a bucket of shit? Well, this was driven home to me once again.


    I left, for the most part, UFO research in late 2006. My wife Vicki and I left our positions at UFO Magazine (Vicki was a founder back in 1986) in 2006, very unhappy at the direction the magazine took under Bill and Nancy Birnes. (The magazine totally then floundered and collapsed in the next couple of years.) I was fed up in large part because there was almost no in-depth research being done by many calling themselves “researchers.” Very few people were “getting out in the weeds” to track down cases, witnesses, and all other things associated with good research. So, what exactly is this little “op-ed” piece all about? Well, by doing absolutely nothing on my part, my name and rep are being bandied about in a derogatory manner by number of reprobates, all over a so called 20 plus years ago “feud” I had with the late Jim Moseley, who died back in 2012. Huh? Yup! Maybe UFO IS A BUCKET OF SHIT.


    Back in the early 90s, I took the subject of UFO research in a very serious way. I conducted my investigations pretty much just like I had conducted criminal investigations back when I was a cop. I had gotten pretty deep in the weeds with a number of UFO cases, breaking them open in the magazine and also on quite a few television shows. I took the topic very seriously, and that was about when I first met Jim Moseley. I knew who he was by reputation, the good along with the bad. The bad I refer to deals with his many hoax’s he carried out with people like Gray Barker. I knew about his ‘zine, Saucer Smear, and his laissez faire attitude toward the subject and his constant promotions of the feuds and dark underbelly of the field. (Mostly commentary and so on with various people in the field of UFOs.)


    Moseley was well aware of the exposes I wrote that ran in UFO Magazine (we sent him a comp subscription), including my very public exposes on Bill Cooper. Cooper, who was shot and killed by police during a gunfight in 2001, was a vicious sociopath, a plagiarist and liar who would not hesitate to unjustly defame anyone whom he felt had wronged him. Moseley connected with Cooper, who told him that I had not served in the Army or in Vietnam, claiming I “stole valor” as a phony soldier. Moseley broke the first law of any type of journalism or even quasi-journalism … confirmation. He never called me to confirm or deny Cooper’s lies, then ran the false allegations in Saucer Smear. (On a side note, Moseley knew Russ Estes and called Russ and asked him about Cooper’s claim. Estes told Moseley that it was a baldfaced lie, but Moseley wanted to “get me.”) I went lawyer hunting.


    As I soon discovered, a lawsuit is a very expensive proposition. I did not have the needed money then and the lawyers I knew would not take it on a contingency basis. (I got screwed twice.) My attitude toward Moseley then was that I would not take a piss on him if I saw him catch fire. (And I stated this on my first Paracast, just after I left UFO research. Gene Steinberg, who interviewed me along with David Biedny, did not take kindly to my sentiment. He was a long-time friend of Moseley’s.)


    Well, my friend who informed me of this minor tempest in a teapot was threatened with banishment from the forum for telling this Moseley story with my involvement. Of course, all these “keyboard warriors” did not have the testicular guts to ask me about it personally.. Perhaps I will include this bunch on my “No Piss On” policy. Carry On, Troops ….

    Moseley.jpeg
     
    PointLess and mike like this.
  2. Gene Steinberg

    Gene Steinberg Forum Super Hero Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    12,267
    Likes Received:
    4,833
    Occupation:
    Forum Super Hero
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Home Page:
    Jim was one of my best friends, but I was well aware of his shortcomings. Carry on.

    But I never heard from anyone contacting us about telling this Moseley tale. Never. Usually when someone posts, they post. They don't request permission. If we object because it contains defamation or otherwise violates our posted terms of service, we'd object, but if someone is quoting something Moseley actually wrote in his publication, certainly it's already public right?
     
    mike likes this.
  3. Gene Steinberg

    Gene Steinberg Forum Super Hero Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    12,267
    Likes Received:
    4,833
    Occupation:
    Forum Super Hero
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Home Page:
    I finally read the old Saucer Smear piece that mentioned Cooper's attacks on Don and Vicki Ecker. At no time did Moseley endorse those attacks and, in fact, treated Cooper skeptically, concluding, "Thus, could Bill's attack on the editors of 'UFO Magazine' be a case of 'the pot calling the kettle black'? Quite possibly..."
     
  4. Decker

    Decker Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,710
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Occupation:
    Paranormal Curmudgeon
    Location:
    Southern California
    Home Page:
    And Gene, what exactly is your point? You know that I know that you know Moseley was simply attempting to cause me embarrassment. Why? Because Moseley KNEW Coopers allegation was bogus (or more specifically a lie) because he telephoned Russ Estes to ask Estes who knew me very well. Estes told Moseley (because Estes called me immediately after Moseley called him) that Cooper was full of shit, a liar, and was trying to "get me" after my UFO Magazine exposes (a 2 parter at that point). Moseley was pissed at me because he knew how I felt about his role in the UFO field at that time. Moseley was simply attempting to be sly. "Well, I NEVER said Ecker wasn't a soldier, I simply repeated what Bill Cooper told me." What I didn't say was "I knew it was bullshit because Russ Estes told me it was bullshit." Oh yea, and I didn't call Ecker because I wanted to embarrass him and besides, if he told me it was bullshit ... I would have to include that!"

    This sure as hell isn't my FIRST RODEO Gene, I do know how this game works.

    Decker
     
  5. Sentry

    Sentry Paranormal Adept

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    763
    Likes Received:
    800
    Home Page:
    Here's a copy of the email I sent Don Ecker about the person posting on Facebook as "Stevenson Brad"

    Subject: Stevenson Brad exhumes an old feud on in the service of his own

    Don, this Stevenson Brad guy has been trolling me for months, and when his misguided insults about Hynek failed, he switched to attacking me over my friendship with Jim Moseley, who I corresponded with for the last two years of his life.
    Anyway, SB, dragged up the old Bill Cooper business out of the blue in this post in UFO UPDates. You should read it, and perhaps re-evaluate the character of Stevenson Brad.
    Also, you should share the link from it to the Saucer Smear issue so your page members can see the context of Moseley presentation of Bill Cooper's comments for themselves.
    Link: Stevenson Brad, commenting on the UFO UPDates Facebook group.

    Curt Collins
    - - -

    I have not yet received a reply.

    For the record, some documentation: Stevenson Brad's 2nd-hand accusations against Jim Moseley are based on a misrepresentation of something published in the the June 1, 1996 "Saucer Smear' section, "Tidbits of Trash," summarizing the claims made online by William Cooper:
    Saucer Smear, June 1st, 1996

    For the sake of completeness, here's Don Ecker's post along with further incendiary comments and distortions by Stevenson Brad:
    Link to Facebook post, Dark Matters Radio w/Don Ecker Fan Club, "An Op-Ed piece from yours truly..."

    It's unfortunate this old controversy was reignited by a troll with an agenda, and also unfortunate that it had to be spread here as well.

    In any case, "Stevenson Brad" owes Don Ecker an apology for using him as pawn in a Facebook trolling campaign.
     
    mike likes this.
  6. Gene Steinberg

    Gene Steinberg Forum Super Hero Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    12,267
    Likes Received:
    4,833
    Occupation:
    Forum Super Hero
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Home Page:
    Did you write to Moseley at the time?
     
  7. Decker

    Decker Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,710
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Occupation:
    Paranormal Curmudgeon
    Location:
    Southern California
    Home Page:
    Once again, your point? Hell no I did not write him .. I called him on the telephone. You know what Moseley did? He laughed, thought it was funny as hell. Now, do you understand why I wouldn't piss on him if he caught fire?

    Decker
     
  8. Decker

    Decker Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,710
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Occupation:
    Paranormal Curmudgeon
    Location:
    Southern California
    Home Page:
    Well, so you can correspond with me directly? I only ask because according to you I am "just some guy." And, if you were not simply looking to score some points .. you could have asked me directly here. But you didn't, did you? I suppose it is much easier to snipe when you think the guy possibly won't see it, huh? And fwiw, I had not yet decided if you and I had anything to discuss worth discussing.

    Decker
     
  9. Sentry

    Sentry Paranormal Adept

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2011
    Messages:
    763
    Likes Received:
    800
    Home Page:
    Have you read the Facebook scrap your fan initiated? Find the snipe, Don, and point it out to me.
     
  10. Decker

    Decker Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,710
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Occupation:
    Paranormal Curmudgeon
    Location:
    Southern California
    Home Page:
    Yes.

    Decker
     
  11. Gene Steinberg

    Gene Steinberg Forum Super Hero Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    12,267
    Likes Received:
    4,833
    Occupation:
    Forum Super Hero
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Home Page:
    His response?
     
  12. mike

    mike Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2008
    Messages:
    8,307
    Likes Received:
    6,113
    This Genre attracts its fair share of the lunatic fringe.
    The opinion of someone you don't respect isn't worth much anyway, To quote Taylor swift Haters gonna hate, shake it off.

    On the flip side I've seen glowing references to Vicki and yourself as I trawl through the Ufological oceans.
     
    Ron Away likes this.
  13. Decker

    Decker Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,710
    Likes Received:
    2,234
    Occupation:
    Paranormal Curmudgeon
    Location:
    Southern California
    Home Page:
    I have a copy of the entire thread. If you want, I will post it here but the bottom line is .. in my opinion he did not troll anyone. Look, you want it? I will post it. You don't want it, no skin off my nose.

    Here is what I find ironic in all this horseshit ... Moseley has been dead 5 years ... and he is still stirring up the shit.

    Decker
     
  14. Gene Steinberg

    Gene Steinberg Forum Super Hero Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    12,267
    Likes Received:
    4,833
    Occupation:
    Forum Super Hero
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Home Page:
    Don, I'd rather end it here. Moseley wrote a small piece of gossip in Saucer Smear 21 years ago. I doubt that anyone outside of you took it seriously. I never read it at the time, but based on what I read when I finally had the chance to see it a few hours ago, it doesn't seem that it was meant as a crack against you, but as an example of the crap that Cooper was spreading. That's the apparent reasoning behind the pot/kettle remark in the final sentence.

    You give the matter far more importance by mentioning it that it otherwise ever deserved or received.
     
    Paul Kimball likes this.
  15. lancemoody

    lancemoody Skeptic

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2006
    Messages:
    48
    Likes Received:
    13
    Occupation:
    Film Editor
    Home Page:
    Hello Gentlemen!

    Don, I completely understand how you took Moseley's post as an attack. I know that you came by those feelings honestly.

    But as a long time reader of Saucer Smear. I can tell you that I don't think that Moseley's audience would have seen this as an attempt to embarrass you as much as it would have been an exposure of the absurdity of Cooper.

    Moseley loved to stir things up but I never knew him to be vindictive in that way. Indeed, the world could use a few more Moseleys on balance.

    By the same token, Curt is truly one of the good guys. You will not find a more even-handed, fair and honest person. If he tells you this other party has ulterior motives, you can take it to the bank.

    Don, as a friend, I just offer these thoughts.

    And also say Happy Thanksgiving Everybody!

    Lance
     
    Ron Away and Paul Kimball like this.
  16. Gene Steinberg

    Gene Steinberg Forum Super Hero Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2006
    Messages:
    12,267
    Likes Received:
    4,833
    Occupation:
    Forum Super Hero
    Location:
    Somewhere
    Home Page:
    Welcome back Lance. Have a great Thanksgiving.
     
Loading...

Share This Page