New Roswell Evidence

[PararealitySaint]

Although I must admit this sounds really interesting, I can't help but wonder how many different types of material fall from space onto the desert floor there at Roswell.

This does peek my interest more than usual because he did find the material at the supposed "debris field", and I did read where it's specified how,"Another important aspect of the material being aluminum and showing unearthly origins is that aluminum must be manufactured."

That being said, it would rule out the "meteorite" perspective, or would it?

Considering the constant collisions that occur in space between many types of debris, could a "fusion" of two or more substances, combining under intensive heat, join to become the properties found in this metal and thus fell to earth without the need to be there because of an extraterrestrial crash?

I believe that one way of concluding this possibility would to match the properties of this find with other space debris throughout the world to see if the same elements could be found in a "raw" or combined form. It still would not prove the existence of E.T. but it would show that more than one form of the same ingredient has fallen in different areas via natural occurrences....

But again this was found at the supposed Debris Field.....hmmmmm. Excellent Post!


Hmmmm....Someone over at abovetopsecret just posted the following which confirms my initial reaction to this post above:

"Article not peer-reviewed. A little early for that. This is still in the testing stage. If the initial results are confirmed, I'm sure the scientific establishment will have much to say about it in the peer-reviewed journals. Isotopes are slightly different forms of a chemical element. How much of one as against how much of another makes a ratio. Matter on Earth has unique isotopic ratios of various elements. Another planet will have different ratios. Meteorites have been analyzed and were found to have different ratios than Earth. The meteorites came from the asteroid belt. The Roswell sample checks out at about twice the difference from the usual earth ratio as a meteorite. Seems reasonable that it could be from ever farther afield, such as another solar system. Ross"

 

[Trajanus]

60+ years is a long time. I dont think we can assume that the site is still considered a priority for anyone even if it were debris from an alien space craft. Presumably, they have the big pieces and I'll bet it is a mater of time before we start hearing about how isotopic ratios are circumstantial at best. My point here is, even if there were a clandestine directorate responsible for managing "finds" at the site they would be better served to attack any data than attempt an overt action.

Depends on the quality of the evidence, which in this case isn't all that high, at least compared to material described previously. Instead of forcing Kimbler to surrender the stuff, they could offer to help analyze it and never return it. That's happened before e.g. with Soccoro metal.

 

[Ron Collins]

That's happened before e.g. with Soccoro metal.

I take Stanford with a mountain of salt. If you have heard his theories on Bruce Macabee you probably would too. I think whatever happened there was probably a lot less shady than Ray makes it out to be.

 

[PararealitySaint]

LOL! This is from a friend of mine who is a mechanical engineer with a background in metallurgy (I am not saying I agree with him by the way, but thought this was funny nonetheless :

"You see those bits of foil like substance? He says they are 'similar' in composition to an alloy used in 'construction' applications but not as foil? You know what they are?

It's what's left of old-time tin roofing after the steel rusts away. It's plated onto the steel (which explains the 'banded' structure of the 'foil') and the steel is now gone but the plated layer is left behind.

I think what he's looking at is what is left over after a military plane crashed mixed in with other debris that was dumped there before or since the incident."

I find this entire subject very interesting, as I am all about "proof" as everyone on this forum knows. Anyone who can discuss this subject with a sense of open ended understanding and still be a devout Christian has to be, as I will admit many in my faith POO POO the entire subject as nothing more than B.S.

The very idea that a metallic composition similar to this was found in the debris field at Roswell, strikes a nerve in my original conclusion that this entire "Roswell" affair was nothing more than well wishing by a bunch of E.T. nuts. I really believe that further investigation should be maintained here and will be VERY interested in what the results are from the other labs.

 

[Trajanus]

I take Stanford with a mountain of salt. If you have heard his theories on Bruce Macabee you probably would too. I think whatever happened there was probably a lot less shady than Ray makes it out to be.

There has been at least one similar claim involving film.

 

[jjflash]

Hi, all -

During the past couple years I have corresponded with Frank Purcell, a retired Chemical Engineer. Frank has written that he holds a Masters of Science in Chemical Engineering, a Masters in Control Systems Engineering and a Bachelors in Computer Science.

In a recent email he offered comment about the article being discussed (Test confirms Roswell debris is not from Earth, published by Open Minds - not to be confused with Open Minds Forum: http://www.openminds.tv/test-confirms-roswell-debris-733/ ).

The article was written by Alejandro Rojas and explored the work of Frank Kimbler, a teacher in Roswell. It seems Kimbler found some debris, suspected it may be from the famous crash, and subsequently had the debris analyzed.

As can of course be gathered from the title of the article, Rojas suggested no further analysis is necessary and that the debris is certainly “not from Earth.” Frank offered some contradicting peer review, the gist of which is that Rojas' claims are premature. With Frank's permission, I post his comments:

The chart below, taken from the article, plots the ratio of isotopes Mg26/Mg24 vertically against the ratio of isotopes Mg25/Mg24 on the horizontal axis. The sample of metal analyzed from Roswell is shown by AH-1 that is clearly not on the line of the other samples. The line represents the spread of Mg26 relative to Mg25, the two minor isotopes, each nominally 10% compared to the more abundant isotope MG24 that is roughly 80% of earthly magnesium.

Presenting the data in this manner without error bars is deceptive because it suggests the AH-1 sample has non-earthly isotope ratios - the conclusion intended by the thrust of the article.

The data points on the line are presumably from many analyses of many samples by many different laboratories. Properly, error bars, typically of 1 standard deviation, should be shown and would be if this were an article in a scientific journal. Even though we don't have that information, we do have an error analyses for the AH-1 sample, as follows:

Isotope Abundance - observed Abundance - natural
MG24 79.1 +/- 0.5 78.6
MG25 10.1 +/- 0.5 10.1
Mg26 10.5 +/- 0.5 11.3

I assume the error estimate of +/- 0.5 represents 1 standard deviation for each analyses. Note that MG24 analyses falls within expectations for natural abundance, i.e., 78.6 to 79.6 where the expected mean is 78.6 . Similarly, Mg25 is at the expected level. MG26, within 1 standard deviation, however, is not at the expected 11.3%, but is estimated to be in a range between 10.0 and 11.0 . Is this significant? We can't say for sure. We can statistically argue that the measured 10.5 +/- 0.5 really has a mean of 11.3 with a probability of 11% using the normal distribution table. But that 11% probability, although small, assumes perfect knowledge that the true mean is 11.3, and this we don't know because no error estimate is given for the accepted value.

The data is presented and plotted as isotopic ratios. Although AH-1 is shown as a point, it is really an area on the chart extending from 0.120 to 0.135 on the horizontal axis and from 0.125 to 0.140 on the vertical axis. (These ranges are calculated from the observed data.) It is clear that this range does in fact intersect the line and is suggestive that the AH-1 sample is not extraterrestrial.

Sure, additional measurements would be helpful to discern if the metal is terrestrial, or not. Hopefully, Open Minds will publish additional results when they are available.

I would also like to see Open Minds or others follow up on the Kimbler debris, eventually giving us the rest of the story. One way or the other, I appreciate Frank offering qualified peer review. Ufology could use more of this kind of analysis of such circumstances and those who report them.