May 10, 2015 — Red Pill Junkie with Richard Dolan

[kanakaris]

Anyone listened to Dreamland with Strieber , LM Howe ,Maussan ?
Don't miss this , it's hilarious :

science, UFOs, alien abductions, crop circles, prophecy, reincarnation, environment | dreamland radio | unknowncountry

 

[red_pill_junkie]

Anyone listened to Dreamland with Strieber , LM Howe ,Maussan ?
Don't miss this , it's hilarious :

science, UFOs, alien abductions, crop circles, prophecy, reincarnation, environment | dreamland radio | unknowncountry

I think the only good thing that came from that discussion, was how Linda herself chastised Maussan for not sharing the information with his colleagues.

As for how the secret government might have deliberately planted an actual alien body in a museum as part of a disinformation campaign... my head's still spinning over that.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Spinning, flipping, jumping, collapsing.....

 

[wwkirk]

Anyone listened to Dreamland with Strieber , LM Howe ,Maussan ?
Don't miss this , it's hilarious :

science, UFOs, alien abductions, crop circles, prophecy, reincarnation, environment | dreamland radio | unknowncountry

I listened to it. Those guys are really going down with the ship.

 

[kanakaris]

And they have TWO alien body's now.

 

[Constance]

My understanding is the Bewitness "experts" (specifically the anthropologists) spoke about what the slides "appeared" to show, and even went as far to say that without the body, only "opinion" could be offered, as opposed to real physical evidence.

Thanks for clarifying that.

I want to see the professionally translated reports, and it is increasingly suspicious that they have not got around to it yet, but we are dealing with the most slippery subject and characters (the paranormal) and its hard to prove that anyone was anything other than misguided.

I'm also waiting for the translations of the written reports by the forensic anthropologists. It takes time (and skill) to translate a lengthy (33-page) scientific document from one language into another (or into several others). It would take time even to locate a translator or translators equal to the task. I think we'll eventually have an opportunity to read the reports and to weigh the partial evidence on which the scientists drew their qualified conclusions about the possible nature of the body appearing in the slides.

The forensic anthropologists involved in evaluating that image are academics with careers and reputations to protect. They've invested many years in their specialized educations and must continue to produce (and publish in peer-reviewed scholarly journals) creditable research in their discipline in order to maintain their salaried positions in universities and attain promotion and tenure. People like this are not likely to risk their careers casually and certainly not for a 'pay-off' from Jaime Mausson.

 

[Constance]

As for how the secret government might have deliberately planted an actual alien body in a museum as part of a disinformation campaign... my head's still spinning over that.

Agreed. That theory makes no sense. It is remotely possible, though, that one of the Roswell aliens could have been thrown free of the wreckage and escaped into the desert, survived for a while, and then died and been preserved by some individual or group of people. Are there people living in the region who might have done that? If so, how this body might have ended up being exhibited at one of the museums in the area (White's roadside museum or a Park Service museum) is a further question that likely will never be answered. If this mummy was indeed exhibited by the Park Service, there should be, might be, other photographs of it and records concerning where it was found and how it came to be displayed by the Park Service. I wonder if progress has been made by Koi, Rudiak, or Bragalia in obtaining permission to search the Park Service archives for such information.

 

[Han]

Agreed. That theory makes no sense. It is remotely possible, though, that one of the Roswell aliens could have been thrown free of the wreckage and escaped into the desert, survived for a while, and then died and been preserved by some individual or group of people. Are there people living in the region who might have done that? If so, how this body might have ended up being exhibited at one of the museums in the area (White's roadside museum or a Park Service museum) is a further question that likely will never be answered. If this mummy was indeed exhibited by the Park Service, there should be, might be, other photographs of it and records concerning where it was found and how it came to be displayed by the Park Service. I wonder if progress has been made by Koi, Rudiak, or Bragalia in obtaining permission to search the Park Service archives for such information.

Re how the museum got the Mummy:

"A splendid mummy was received by the Park Museum recently when Mr. S.L. Palmer Jr. of San Francisco returned one that his father had taken from the ruins in 1894. The mummy is that of a two year old boy and is in an excellent state of preservation. At the time of burial the body was clad in a slip-over cotton shirt and three small cotton blankets. Fragments of these are still on the mummy."

source: Mesa Verde National Park (Notes)

RE the Mummy in the Museum:

"Another excellent mummy in the Mesa Verde Museum is that of a small boy of perhaps two or three. X-rays of the teeth have not been taken so the exact age is uncertain. The body is well mummified, but small patches of skin are missing and the lower part of the right leg has disappeared. The skin has lost all of its former color and is an uninteresting dull gray shade. Part of a small slip-over cotton shirt still hangs around the shoulders. Several pieces of cotton in which the body was wrapped are well preserved. This mummy is not popular with visitors. It has such a negative personality that it has never been named. Even though it is well preserved, it fails to click. The spark is not there; that certain something is missing."


source: Region III Quarterly (1940)

RE Problems with FOIA request: I suspect that the harassment caused to the parks services by Mr D. Paulides (missing 411) has made them reluctant to associate with those involved in "paranormal research", and I don't blame them.

The people that "need" the body to prove their case are Maussan and co, they should be the ones doing the searching, rather than offering petty cash rewards.

Just to clarify: Maussans and co's argument is based on two slides, whilst there is a whole body of other evidence that shows that the Mummy was on display for many years and was eventually returned.

What I am trying to say is that the rest of the world (those with no interest in Roswell or ET) are not bothered buy such speculation and accept that it is indeed a Human Mummy. In short there is no "Need to Know" meaning that any FOIA request could be denied on perfectly reasonable grounds. I.e out of respect to the child's ancestors.

It is inevitable that this will be interpreted as a grand conspiracy by some.


RE Translated reports:

You can read RICHARD DOBLE's report here (its written in English): thefaceofroswell

And the "Ratification of the forensic medicine institute" has now been translated, you can read it here: thefaceofroswell

I can't wait for the others!

 

[Constance]

Re how the museum got the Mummy:

"A splendid mummy was received by the Park Museum recently when Mr. S.L. Palmer Jr. of San Francisco returned one that his father had taken from the ruins in 1894. The mummy is that of a two year old boy and is in an excellent state of preservation. At the time of burial the body was clad in a slip-over cotton shirt and three small cotton blankets. Fragments of these are still on the mummy."

source: Mesa Verde National Park (Notes)

RE the Mummy in the Museum:

"Another excellent mummy in the Mesa Verde Museum is that of a small boy of perhaps two or three. X-rays of the teeth have not been taken so the exact age is uncertain. The body is well mummified, but small patches of skin are missing and the lower part of the right leg has disappeared. The skin has lost all of its former color and is an uninteresting dull gray shade. Part of a small slip-over cotton shirt still hangs around the shoulders. Several pieces of cotton in which the body was wrapped are well preserved. This mummy is not popular with visitors. It has such a negative personality that it has never been named. Even though it is well preserved, it fails to click. The spark is not there; that certain something is missing."

source: Region III Quarterly (1940)

http://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/region_111/vol2-1c.htm

Is there photographic evidence identifying one or the other of the mummies described in those sources as the mummy appearing in the Roswell slides? It seems to me that while we can imagine connections, a demonstrated identity with the body in the slides has not been obtained yet.

RE Problems with FOIA request: I suspect that the harassment caused to the parks services by Mr D. Paulides (missing 411) has made them reluctant to associate with those involved in "paranormal research", and I don't blame them.

The people that "need" the body to prove their case are Maussan and co, they should be the ones doing the searching, rather than offering petty cash rewards.

Just to clarify: Maussans and co's argument is based on two slides, whilst there is a whole body of other evidence that shows that the Mummy was on display for many years and was eventually returned.

What I am trying to say is that the rest of the world (those with no interest in Roswell or ET) are not bothered buy such speculation and accept that it is indeed a Human Mummy. In short there is no "Need to Know" meaning that any FOIA request could be denied on perfectly reasonable grounds. I.e out of respect to the child's ancestors.

It is inevitable that this will be interpreted as a grand conspiracy by some.

Maybe.

RE Translated reports:

You can read RICHARD DOBLE's report here (its written in English): thefaceofroswell

And the "Ratification of the forensic medicine institute" has now been translated, you can read it here: thefaceofroswell

Thanks for the links. I've been to the latter and as you can the source has not yet found an adequate translator. That's probably why we have not yet seen, and will not see for awhile, translations of the written reports of the forensic archaeologists.

 

[Han]

Is there photographic evidence identifying one or the other of the mummies described in those sources as the mummy appearing in the Roswell slides? It seems to me that while we can imagine connections, a demonstrated identity with the body in the slides has not been obtained yet.

here are two comparisons with indicators:
Firstly Shelving and Brackets: (key below)

A = Bracket in Mesa Verde Museum
B = Bracket in Mesa Verde Museum
C = Bracket in Mesa Verde Museum


Second comparison of Floor and Bench:

A = Bench in Mesa Verde Museum
B = Floor tiles in Mesa Verde Museum

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Spinning because you trust your government not to misinform or that they are incapable of a common breaking and entering? Or both?

What's a common sense reason for feeding the corpse of an alien body into a museum to masquerade as a human mummy?

Where's the logic in that?

If such a corpse existed, in any form, you'd expect it to be kept under wraps in a secure place. And what about the oft-neglected issue of potential alien viruses?

 

[Constance]

here are two comparisons with indicators:
Firstly Shelving and Brackets: (key below)

A = Bracket in Mesa Verde Museum
B = Bracket in Mesa Verde Museum
C = Bracket in Mesa Verde Museum


Second comparison of Floor and Bench:

A = Bench in Mesa Verde Museum
B = Floor tiles in Mesa Verde Museum

Thanks, Han. Yes, the mummy in the Roswell slides has been located to an exhibit in the Mesa Verda Parks Service exhibit. What I'm getting at is that we still don't know with certainty the origin of the mummy from Park Service records (where it was found and by whom; who brought it to the Park Service; anything further about its examination by Park Service experts or consultants in the fields of medicine or forensic archaeology; any other photographs that might be contained in the Park Service archive along with reports of such examinations of the body).

 

[Constance]

ps, I might be missing something from what's been published in your posts and elsewhere. I'll be grateful for any further information.

 

[Burnt State]

Is there photographic evidence identifying one or the other of the mummies described in those sources as the mummy appearing in the Roswell slides? It seems to me that while we can imagine connections, a demonstrated identity with the body in the slides has not been obtained yet.

For Braglia it was that that was written in the park notes corresponds directly to what's in the placard that convinced him.
A Different Perspective: Tony Bragalia and the End of the Roswell Slides

Mesa Verde National Park (Notes)

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Straw man arguments. My question was simple, "do you trust your government not to misinform or that they are incapable of a common breaking and entering? Or both?"

My response is simple: It doesn't matter. We know they can and no doubt do when required. But the theory as to whether it was done here is absurd.

 

[Constance]

For Braglia it was that that was written in the park notes corresponds directly to what's in the placard that convinced him.
A Different Perspective: Tony Bragalia and the End of the Roswell Slides

Mesa Verde National Park (Notes)

Yes, but this only means that the mummy in the Roswell slides was most likely resident at and exhibited at the Mesa Verde Park. We still don't know where it was before that exhibition (unless I've missed something posted here or elsewhere). If this is in fact the mummy that Palmer stole from an archaeological site decades before (and which his son returned), there should be information to that effect in the Park Service archives. There might also be photographs of this mummy that Palmer himself took, or taken by others to whom he might have shown the mummy when it was in his possession.

This would all be less ambiguous if it were not that White's roadside museum displayed a number of mummies (including small ones such as that very strange 12-inch one with the enormous head). That museum was located close to the entrance to Carlsbad Cavern and to what appears to be a large Indian territory on the map. Were the White's mummies found in the cavern and/or elsewhere in the area perhaps? They had to have originated somewhere, and their histories, if we had them, might be very interesting.

 

[Han]

Straw man arguments. My question was simple, "do you trust your government not to misinform or that they are incapable of a common breaking and entering? Or both?"

I trust your government a lot more than you.

 

[red_pill_junkie]

Spinning because you trust your government not to misinform or that they are incapable of a common breaking and entering? Or both?

It's not my government, vato

Spinning because it's trying to maintain a 'plausible' alternative to the other-worldliness of the body, by concocting a rather bizarre scenario.

A much likelier theory, if one would still would like to speculate about it, would be that the alien lived among the Pueblo centuries ago, died, was buried, and then many years later someone found it but didn't know what actually was.

 

[Han]

Yes, but this only means that the mummy in the Roswell slides was most likely resident at and exhibited at the Mesa Verde Park. We still don't know where it was before that exhibition (unless I've missed something posted here or elsewhere). If this is in fact the mummy that Palmer stole from an archaeological site decades before (and which his son returned), there should be information to that effect in the Park Service archives. There might also be photographs of this mummy that Palmer himself took, or taken by others to whom he might have shown the mummy when it was in his possession.

This would all be less ambiguous if it were not that White's roadside museum displayed a number of mummies (including small ones such as that very strange 12-inch one with the enormous head). That museum was located close to the entrance to Carlsbad Cavern and to what appears to be a large Indian territory on the map. Were the White's mummies found in the cavern and/or elsewhere in the area perhaps? They had to have originated somewhere, and their histories, if we had them, might be very interesting.

RE the stolen Mummy, I am very confident that the museum or the park service will indeed have such records, but accessing them may be tricky for the reasons I mentioned before, i.e where is the "Need to Know?" and does it outweigh the need for respect?

RE the other Mummy? if that is what it is? remember it was housed in a "freak show type of setting" and sadly retro taxidermy on human remains is not unheard of. I don't see any connection between the two "Mummies" and I don't see any connection to Roswell either.

IF an ET occupied saucer did crash in Roswell, how did one of its occupants get given to the (Chapin) Mesa Verde museum before the crash happened?

for reasons of clarity my understanding is that the Roswell incident happened in 1947 and the Mummy was stolen in 1894, it was then given to the Museum in 1938.

I think that the bad state of preservation of the Chapin Mesa Museum Mummy is a result of it being removed from its "stable" environment (a Cave) a being housed in a domestic setting (MR Palmers Home for 44 years) and the Museum did not do a much better job, judging by the lack of temperature and humidity controls we are so used to seeing in museums today, (especially in wetter places like England) I can tell you that if the Mummy was kept in a similar setting over here it would quickly rot because of the amount of moisture in the air, but in an arid setting like Chapin Mesa Museum it would last a lot longer, but would still deteriorate over time, without the proper humidity and temperature controls.

The last point I want to make is that I wonder if: the "Bewitness experts" had been party to the deciphered placard, and the matching details in the Chapin Mesa Museum before they presented their findings, would they have still gone ahead? I have serious doubts about whether they would.

 

[Han]

It's not my government, vato

Spinning because it's trying to maintain a 'plausible' alternative to the other-worldliness of the body, by concocting a rather bizarre scenario.

A much likelier theory, if one would still would like to speculate about it, would be that the alien lived among the Pueblo centuries ago, died, was buried, and then many years later someone found it but didn't know what actually was.

Don't give em ideas!!!!!!!!!!!!!!