Is anyone else following independent research into Sandy Hook?

[mike]

Human emotions are like that. We're complex creatures who are capable of feeling many contradictory feelings all at once. A grieving parent may recall a happy time with another grieving parent and laugh, yet still be overcome by the reality of loss.

I had my wife watch the video, and she made the same observations.

Given the counter arguments, i can only stand corrected.

My premise was never that it was faked, only that i couldnt get my head around Parkers behaviour.

I still cant, but i respect the counter arguments/Experiences and am happy to concede that i cant know in this case.

I apoligise if my speculation has caused any upset

 

[5tomidnite]

I had my wife watch the video, and she made the same observations.

Given the counter arguments, i can only stand corrected.

My premise was never that it was faked, only that i couldnt get my head around Parkers behaviour.

I still cant, but i respect the counter arguments/Experiences and am happy to concede that i cant know in this case.

I apoligise if my speculation has caused any upset

You know it's nice that you show human caring and apologize for potentially offending people but really I don't think you should have to. Once again it is kind and decent of you to do it however I find that if you don't want people to ask questions about a situation "that isn't right" in the wake of a tragedy is to shame them into silence by making the questions out to being in poor taste or disrespectful to the victims of the situation.

 

[Secretbanana]

I had my wife watch the video, and she made the same observations.

Given the counter arguments, i can only stand corrected.

My premise was never that it was faked, only that i couldnt get my head around Parkers behaviour.

I still cant, but i respect the counter arguments/Experiences and am happy to concede that i cant know in this case.

I apoligise if my speculation has caused any upset

Wow. It's rare to see somebody admitting they might have been wrong, or spoke too soon, so kudos to you. That you consider how raw this subject might still be for some people, and apologize for that also speaks to your humanity.

Kudos. I tip my hat to your sir!

 

[RenaissanceLady]

RenaissanceLady, sorry for your loss, and again to hear you're in poor health.

Your post does help put things in perspective, Its not been my experience to laugh during the grieving period, but since its yours. I have to give Parker the benefit of the doubt.

Ive never said Sandy hook didnt happen, just that i find Parkers behaviour outside that of my own experience.

Thanks for taking the time to share your experience

Thanks,

My point is that if someone had photographed me during my dad's funeral or anytime during this whole grieving process, they would have seen very different behaviors and facial expressions. This doesn't mean I'm an actress or that any emotion I'm feeling at any specific time isn't genuine. It does indicate that different memories elicit different feelings and that happier times can be remembered even during times of profound grief, illness or stress. Any person with a basic background in psychology can explain that we are capable of feeling extremely contradictory emotions at the same time. Add into this equation that a father has also been thrust onto the national spotlight during utterly tragic and insane times and we should be able to understand a hysterical range of emotions. This is all perfectly normal. The response to this, however, shows a perverse delight in finding conspiracy theories where there are none by some truly sick individuals.

One of the tragedies of Sandy Hook is that those who actually helped the children during the massacre have been accused of acting and even been subjected to threats and stalking - all because someone failed to grasp these basic concepts or is otherwise incapable of empathy. Why do we have to believe that every tragedy is a conspiracy theory and that any feelings that (we suspect) might be different from our own feelings if we were subjected to similar circumstances is somehow fake or otherwise invalid? Are we that mentally ill as a society? Is it so hard to remember that decent people can react in different ways at different times when under duress?

 

[mike]

You know it's nice that you show human caring and apologize for potentially offending people but really I don't think you should have to. Once again it is kind and decent of you to do it however I find that if you don't want people to ask questions about a situation "that isn't right" in the wake of a tragedy is to shame them into silence by making the questions out to being in poor taste or disrespectful to the victims of the situation.

Getting to the heart of a matter is more important to me than "being right"

I had questions based on my limited experience set, and when presented with more data revised my hypothesis, thats just good science.

My pov is never set in stone, and i dont come here to impose them on others, rather i share them and compare them with others, in such a manner they can and do evolve.

To me thats the proper function of a discussion forum.

Sharing ideas and pov's is better than standing on a soapbox insisting i'm right.
If someone can provide me with a compelling argument to the contrary of my own, Its good sense and good manners to acknowledge that.

 

[5tomidnite]

Getting to the heart of a matter is more important to me than "being right"

I had questions based on my limited experience set, and when presented with more data revised my hypothesis, thats just good science.

My pov is never set in stone, and i dont come here to impose them on others, rather i share them and compare them with others, in such a manner they can and do evolve.

To me thats the proper function of a discussion forum.

Sharing ideas and pov's is better than standing on a soapbox insisting i'm right.
If someone can provide me with a compelling argument to the contrary of my own, Its good sense and good manners to acknowledge that.

We are alike in this.

Where we disagree is that I don't think anyone gave you a compelling reason to change your mind. I mean I'm not you and I don't know what points your wife made but so far everyone is giving you experiences based on the death of an adult. It's not to say that I don't agree that people grieve differently. For me my grief "is not for public consumption" and I'm sometimes eerily cool under pressure so I can come across as cold but when a child dies a brutal death a whole different set of emotions comes into play. You're not just dealing with the loss of the life of someone you love, you're dealing with the loss of a life unfulfilled and the guilt of not being able to protect that life. That still doesn't mean he's guilty of something but it does merit investigation. Just so you know I've had a child I treated as my nephew die when he was three and I can tell you it is far different from the death of any adult. Also we suspected fowl play in his death. I can assure you there was no joking around two days after his death.

 

[Muadib]

I don't think it's strange at all, I don't find it odd that someone who just had his or her child killed by a psychopath would act a little off, whether it's laughing or screaming or whatever. Different people react differently in different situations, there is no universal response to grief, loss or pain. How you personally would handle it has nothing to do with it. The idea that these people are hired actors is literally one of the stupidest things I've ever heard in my entire life, it shows just how far out of touch with reality some of these conspiracy theorists are.

 

[RenaissanceLady]

We are alike in this.

Where we disagree is that I don't think anyone gave you a compelling reason to change your mind. I mean I'm not you and I don't know what points your wife made but so far everyone is giving you experiences based on the death of an adult. It's not to say that I don't agree that people grieve differently. For me my grief "is not for public consumption" and I'm sometimes eerily cool under pressure so I can come across as cold but when a child dies a brutal death a whole different set of emotions comes into play. You're not just dealing with the loss of the life of someone you love, you're dealing with the loss of a life unfulfilled and the guilt of not being able to protect that life. That still doesn't mean he's guilty of something but it does merit investigation. Just so you know I've had a child I treated as my nephew die when he was three and I can tell you it is far different from the death of any adult. Also we suspected fowl play in his death. I can assure you there was no joking around two days after his death.

Unless you have some monopoly on grief - or are the only one of us who has ever lost a young family member (you aren't by a long shot), all you're saying is that YOUR grief, in one particular circumstance, was different than another person's grief in an entirely different circumstance. You didn't have the anxiety of being on a television interview - which may have contributed to nervousness or even near hysteria prior to discussing a tragedy. You didn't have your personal tragedy become international news, adding a different level of emotions to an already horrific set of circumstances. You don't know what effects exhaustion, trauma, anxiety, or anything else played on this parent, or every single thought that can enter a mind during tragic times.

I don't care to get into a pissing contest with you over "My grief is greater than your grief, because..." It's irrelevant. Neither of us are the parents in the video. Neither of us lost children during this massacre and neither of us know anything about these people. Try showing a bit of compassion for someone who has just lived his worst nightmare and come to the realization that good, sane and decent people can react differently under different circumstances. It's the mentality that "I would NEVER act a certain way during times which I've never had to live" that has given us people who stalk the rescuers of Sandy Hook.

 

[Goggs Mackay]

What do you make of this one folks

Tough one though Mike. It certainly looked weird but I for one can assure anyone that sometimes some people respond to severe nerves etc with laughter. I know in some funny situations (funny weird, or serious) I may have laughed but there is no humour to it.

If even one of these deaths was some fake, all of them would have to be, and one of the children had an English parent. I have seen that parent interviewed and since a bit of his background has been broadcast, I would think people would know him here in the UK. It's undeniable that lives were taken at a school. The whole town knows that school exists, it wasn't just conjured up, so surely all the kids who escaped and their parents, would know if something fishy was going on surely?
There could conceivably have been something to do with the shooter himself maybe, but as for fake victims and families - it would be easier to fake a moon landing!

 

[5tomidnite]

Unless you have some monopoly on grief - or are the only one of us who has ever lost a young family member (you aren't by a long shot), all you're saying is that YOUR grief, in one particular circumstance, was different than another person's grief in an entirely different circumstance. You didn't have the anxiety of being on a television interview - which may have contributed to nervousness or even near hysteria prior to discussing a tragedy. You didn't have your personal tragedy become international news, adding a different level of emotions to an already horrific set of circumstances. You don't know what effects exhaustion, trauma, anxiety, or anything else played on this parent, or every single thought that can enter a mind during tragic times.

I don't care to get into a pissing contest with you over "My grief is greater than your grief, because..." It's irrelevant. Neither of us are the parents in the video. Neither of us lost children during this massacre and neither of us know anything about these people. Try showing a bit of compassion for someone who has just lived his worst nightmare and come to the realization that good, sane and decent people can react differently under different circumstances. It's the mentality that "I would NEVER act a certain way during times which I've never had to live" that has given us people who stalk the rescuers of Sandy Hook.

WOW!!! I so must have miss worded what I intended to say. I was only trying to say that grieving over the loss of an adult is different from grieving the loss of a child. I'm sorry if it came across as me trying to initiate a pissing contest about whose grief is worse. It wasn't my intention. I had no intention of belittling anyone's grief but if it came across as that I truly apologize. I offered my "nephew"'s death to show that I was speaking from some experience and nothing else was intended by it.

 

[Burnt State]

Forums only verify that our ability to communicate tone and intention is very limited when up against the feelings and beliefs of others. One can ony ask, is it the fault of language or how we use it?

Good to see so many using it to amend instead of break.

 

[5tomidnite]

Forums only verify that our ability to communicate tone and intention is very limited when up against the feelings and beliefs of others. One can ony ask, is it the fault of language or how we use it?

Good to see so many using it to amend instead of break.

I would say that my problem lay in the wording.

 

[Richard Hawkins]

My point is that this

Strikes me, and a great many others as an odd look, for someone who has just learned his little child has been shot and killed.

I made a choice not to have children, but whenever ive lost a beloved pet, my face never looked like that.

What a load of total bollox to suggest sandy hook was anything but mass murder by a nut case and that a lot off innocent people died.
People who use photographs to match their conspiracy theories disgust me
There is an answer to all this Let America be like the majority of the rest of the world and ban guns.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Logic and reason doesn't always work unfortunately.

 

[Richard Hawkins]

Logic and reason doesn't always work unfortunately.

How true Gene.