Ghost Sickness

[RenaissanceLady]

I've probably already mentioned this , but not long after I returned to Colorado, the new tenant in the casita I had been renting contacted me through Facebook after having found some of my un-forwarded mail. She wanted to know if I had experienced any "odd" happenings while I was living there. After we discussed our experiences, she told me she was going to break her lease and leave.

No one stays there for any real length of time.

Just before she left, she had decided to do a smudging inside the house and a burning of old leaves and branches outside. These were combined with a blessing. I've attached her photo of the burning, as it shows my old casita in the background. She mentioned that she was feeling some very "odd" energies as this was occurring, as if whatever it was didn't like her blessings.

The weird thing is, I really miss that part of New Mexico and still wish I could move back there. (With the death of my father two years ago and my sister-in-law's sudden death this past September, I'll most likely move to Oregon to be near my remaining family.) There is something enchanting about the state that is known as the "Land of Enchantment." Still, I'm genuinely scared about the area in and around Nambé. Others in Nambé to whom I have spoken seem to agree that the whole village is haunted. Seriously, when I left, I found a book entitled Witchcraft of the Southwest that had an entire chapter called "The Tragedy of Nambé". Discovering that felt like a punch in the gut. Let's just say that I now understand why that area is screwed-up.

Yes, it still affects me that I wrote my account the very night one my of closest friends unexpectedly died. I had spoken to him two days prior and he sounded fine -- though the call didn't appear on my Caller ID and the conversation was rather cryptic. Among his final words were that I needed to write my account.

 

[Burnt State]

Brief pieces of the Tragedy at Nambé can be read here: Witchcraft in the Southwest: Spanish and Indian Supernaturalism on the Rio ... - Marc Simmons - Google Books

 

[Polterwurst]

@Polterwurst: There is no one-size-fits all answer to your question. Native-American beliefs vary from tribe to tribe and the particular individual. Based on my limited knowledge on the subject, I would venture an educated guess and say that most (if not all?) Native American traditions include the concept of ghosts and spirits. Most also include traditions of "little people" and "thunderbirds" FWIW. It would stand to reason that the more traditional your upbringing, chances are the more likely you'd factor in the possible presence and/or influence of ghosts/spirits in your reality. Obviously, personal experience and familial history would also influence your personal belief systems in this regard.

Thanks for answering my question. I guess it stands to reason, then, that ghost sickness, as long as it's being reported by individuals who have believed in spirits and ghosts all of their lives, is more likely "just" a psychosomatic response to an imagined ghost threat than a condition brought on by a real outside entity. I'm still at a loss why this condition should mainly be reported from north american indians, though. Maybe this is just the one which got scientifically recognized as a psychological syndrom, while the same illness occurs in cultures all over the world, by many different names.

As for ghost sickness, I don't know for sure, but I must say that I personally experienced symptoms of extreme fatigue, headache, irritability and lethargy after what appeared to be a nasty close encounter w/ whatever-it-is that lurks beneath the "Sallie House" in Atcheson, KS. I've mentioned this on the show a few times... Two of the five of us that shared the experience were sick for almost two weeks, and Amy Allen (the psychic) was impacted for almost a month. Michael Esposito and I were only affected for about 20 to 30 minutes, but I'll never forget the sensation of what I can only describe as a cold hand slowly squeezing my heart! Out of all the investigations and real-time events I have experienced out in the field—20 years worth, this one was stand alone and the only time I actually experienced momentary fear for my personal safety.

I remember you talking about this. If my theory above holds any water, the fatigue, headache, irritability and lethargy could be the body's reaction to the extremeness of the feeling to be invaded or attacked, of being at the mercy of something incomprehensible. This probably takes away any feeling of security, which results in an uncontrollable reaction far beyond conscious reasoning (which might even be giving some false reassurance by explaining the event away), in the body itself.

I actually wanted to look into places like this myself and to have some kind of experience that would convince me that something extraordinary is going on. That's probably asking for trouble. Now I'll be glad if I never have to experience anything like this.

The question I'm asking myself now, is if I should give up on this research entirely. Lloyd Auerbach says it's not a good idea and I've heard Paul Eno warn people about not getting obsessed or even too concerned with this stuff, even or especialy if you think you have had some real evidence.

I have quite a stack of books that would be left unread and I guess I'd have to stop researching these topics and posting threads here.

 

[Burnt State]

I think it would be a total shame if you stopped posting here @Polterwurst . You are a pretty dedicated contributor to the space and you bring a lot of honest investigation to the discussion and a perspective from another part of the world that helps to keep this forum dynamic.

But if you feel that you are being physically affected or otherwise then it'a worth seeing your regular doctor to see what else might be up. If you think that it'a psychosomatic, and we do know that this phenomenon can have a way of staring back at you, then it's worth some personal reflection. If you ever feel like you're in touch with evil, then it's probably good to take a break for a while from dwelling in dark spaces; go for a walk in the park; breathe the fresh air and see what's what.

 

[Wade]

Lloyd Auerbach says it's not a good idea a

What's not a good idea? Going Cold Turkey and giving it up entirely?

Do you not trust yourself by staying involved at least ( but not researching ?) Do you think that you wouldn't be able to keep up any wall or barrier to keep you from getting sucked in? If you do think your symptoms are caused by ghost sickness perhaps all you need is a little moderation.

 

[RenaissanceLady]

Thanks for answering my question. I guess it stands to reason, then, that ghost sickness, as long as it's being reported by individuals who have believed in spirits and ghosts all of their lives, is more likely "just" a psychosomatic response to an imagined ghost threat than a condition brought on by a real outside entity. I'm still at a loss why this condition should mainly be reported from north american indians, though. Maybe this is just the one which got scientifically recognized as a psychological syndrom, while the same illness occurs in cultures all over the world, by many different names.



I remember you talking about this. If my theory above holds any water, the fatigue, headache, irritability and lethargy could be the body's reaction to the extremeness of the feeling to be invaded or attacked, of being at the mercy of something incomprehensible. This probably takes away any feeling of security, which results in an uncontrollable reaction far beyond conscious reasoning (which might even be giving some false reassurance by explaining the event away), in the body itself.

I actually wanted to look into places like this myself and to have some kind of experience that would convince me that something extraordinary is going on. That's probably asking for trouble. Now I'll be glad if I never have to experience anything like this.

The question I'm asking myself now, is if I should give up on this research entirely. Lloyd Auerbach says it's not a good idea and I've heard Paul Eno warn people about not getting obsessed or even too concerned with this stuff, even or especialy if you think you have had some real evidence.

I have quite a stack of books that would be left unread and I guess I'd have to stop researching these topics and posting threads here.

I'd hate to see you no longer posting here, but you also need to know what is best for your own situation.

Personally, I still post on different forums and listen to all the podcasts, but I no longer seek out some of the high strangeness. In some ways, I'm still coming to terms with what all happened during that one particular time of my life.

If you ever want to chat, you can PM me here or I can send you my e-mail. Please take care of yourself.

 

[Christopher O'Brien]

I don't see the connection between posting here, reading books and staying at home and any of the physical manifestations such have been described. If you think there is a direct relationship (and you are NOT out investigating at some spooky site) perhaps what you are experiencing could be psychosomatic in nature? Personally, I don't see any cause and effect connection/relationship, etc... My prescription would be: a stein of good lager, a blood sausage w/ sauerkraut and mustard and a nice cozy fraulein cuddled by a warm fireplace... but leave the ouija board in the closet.

 

[Polterwurst]

But if you feel that you are being physically affected or otherwise then it'a worth seeing your regular doctor to see what else might be up.

That's what I've been doing for years now. Two surgeries and the chronic inflammation keeps flaring up, with symptoms that affect the whole body. Two physicians have said that it should have healed long ago and they can't explain why it doesn't. Unless it's some unknown virus, the only other "explanation" is that is has become chronic (which actually doesn't explain anything, it just means that the body just seems to keep it going by itself).

Do you not trust yourself by staying involved at least ( but not researching ?) Do you think that you wouldn't be able to keep up any wall or barrier to keep you from getting sucked in?

I was thinking that I was doing exactly that, but I'm afraid I've been fooling myself there. Actually I think that staying involved can't be avoided. It's too fascinating.

If you think there is a direct relationship (and you are NOT out investigating at some spooky site) perhaps what you are experiencing could be psychosomatic in nature?

I think it's exactly that (psychosomatic) and one of the physicians has already resorted to the the same conclusion, although I think he's a pretty hard-core materialist otherwise. Although I didn't tell him anything about my interest in this stuff (especially reincarnation), he once rather arrogantly joked around that maybe I should try lighting incense cones in a buddhist temple. I had to restrain myself from shooting back something along the lines of that'll probably be at least as much help as what I got at his place. He's actually a luminary in his field, and it's obvious he hates not being able to get a grip on this.

My prescription would be: a stein of good lager, a blood sausage w/ sauerkraut and mustard and a nice cozy fraulein cuddled by a warm fireplace... but leave the ouija board in the closet.

Thanks, doctor . I'll be sure to follow that prescription by the letter

Thanks to all of you for your concern. No way I'm giving up on the forum entirely. The discussions here are priceless and the people, personal stories and threads are too interesting, unconventinal and all-round wondrous.

What I meant was not that I'll stop posting altogether, but I'll probably start less threads of my own.

 

[Wade]

What I meant was not that I'll stop posting altogether, but I'll probably start less threads of my own.

And keep those questions for the guests coming i should hope.

 

[RenaissanceLady]

I have been enjoying a series on The Epoch Times asking if certain people could be "allergic to ghosts." I'm thinking those articles may be useful to this thread.

From the first article:

Emily is a travel writer who believes she has a special sensitivity to places that are supposedly haunted. She says she’s been “overly empathetic” her entire life, such that if someone with a bad headache walks into a room she’s in, Emily may get a headache herself, or if someone has pulled his back, her back will begin to ache the moment she makes eye contact. Emily used to suffer from irritable bowel syndrome and now suffers from fibromyalgia. When her chronic pain is flaring, she says, that’s when her psychical sensitivity is highest. She feels emotional energies in houses she’s never been to before, has witnessed radios and other objects moving about in her presence, and believes that she’s encountered spirits. Could there be a connection, Emily wonders, between her longtime sensitivity and these bizarre experiences?

Do Some People Sense the Unseen? (Part 1)

Ghost sickness? It's a little more food for thought.

For the other articles, please see:
Do Some People Sense the Unseen? (Part 2)
Do Some People Sense the Unseen? (Part 3)

 

[Polterwurst]

I don't see the connection between posting here, reading books and staying at home and any of the physical manifestations such have been described. If you think there is a direct relationship (and you are NOT out investigating at some spooky site) perhaps what you are experiencing could be psychosomatic in nature? Personally, I don't see any cause and effect connection/relationship, etc...

I think it's exactly that (psychosomatic)

... but to be honest, that's only true around 95% of the time. Sometimes (like when I opened this thread) an exarcerbation gets so intense and, frankly, weird (in that it includes the whole system, body and mind) that I can't help but wonder "yeah, psychosomatic, but whose psyche is it, anyway?". I'm reluctant to describe all of the bodily symptoms here, because they may sound more worrying than they are those 95% of the time. I guess during the other 5 I have a hard time telling myself this is "just" me (my body) making me sick.

And while I'm not doing any investigations of spooky places, there is one quite spooky place I have to go to nearly every day, namely the office I work in. Not spooky in the sense of old and decrepit but more along the lines of strange gusts of wind, unexplained technical failures, furniture moving in the upper floor when you're positive you're the last fool working overtime, that kind of stuff. There's even a big Hugh-Crane-style painting of the deceased company founder looking right at you. People have told me that they think the place might be haunted, without my telling them I'm interested in this stuff beforehand.

 

[Burnt State]

... but to be honest, that's only true around 95% of the time. Sometimes (like when I opened this thread) an exarcerbation gets so intense and, frankly, weird (in that it includes the whole system, body and mind) that I can't help but wonder "yeah, psychosomatic, but whose psyche is it, anyway?". I'm reluctant to describe all of the bodily symptoms here, because they may sound more worrying than they are those 95% of the time. I guess during the other 5 I have a hard time telling myself this is "just" me (my body) making me sick.

And while I'm not doing any investigations of spooky places, there is one quite spooky place I have to go to nearly every day, namely the office I work in. Not spooky in the sense of old and decrepit but more along the lines of strange gusts of wind, unexplained technical failures, furniture moving in the upper floor when you're positive you're the last fool working overtime, that kind of stuff. There's even a big Hugh-Crane-style painting of the deceased company founder looking right at you. People have told me that they think the place might be haunted, without my telling them I'm interested in this stuff beforehand.

Feeling haunted is a curious thing, especially when you are alone in a space or think you're alone. As a horror fan, and someone who enjoys the rush of brief, fun, fake horror, i can't say I appreciate the sensation of dread. Dread causes a cascade of sustained emotional intensity. It's very stressful, which is literally a build up of stress hormones in the body, and these hormones dramatically affect our immune system and sugar system, making it harder for your natural insulin to do what it does, at least these are the things i've learned about how a diabetic lives. One should not be stressed too often, certainly not at work, so maybe that's a place to try to shift for yourself and create a bit more ease? The painting sounds terrible, and it's an interesting cinematic reference in terms of how you feel about the place. Can that be changed and is solo overtime work a necessity?

 

[Polterwurst]

One should not be stressed too often, certainly not at work, so maybe that's a place to try to shift for yourself and create a bit more ease? (...) Can that be changed and is solo overtime work a necessity?

It was during the first 10 years or so, but nowadays there isn't any solo overtime anymore. But stress is a daily factor, I'm afraid (we have to meet deadlines). I guess I have already managed to create some space and more ease for myself, though. Thanks for your concern.

The painting sounds terrible, and it's an interesting cinematic reference in terms of how you feel about the place.

The similarity ends with the guy having been a self-made man and a bit of a ruthless entrepreneur (from what I've heard). But I doubt he ate little children for dinner.

 

[AlienEsq]

I've probably already mentioned this , but not long after I returned to Colorado, the new tenant in the casita I had been renting contacted me through Facebook after having found some of my un-forwarded mail. She wanted to know if I had experienced any "odd" happenings while I was living there. After we discussed our experiences, she told me she was going to break her lease and leave.

No one stays there for any real length of time.

Just before she left, she had decided to do a smudging inside the house and a burning of old leaves and branches outside. These were combined with a blessing. I've attached her photo of the burning, as it shows my old casita in the background. She mentioned that she was feeling some very "odd" energies as this was occurring, as if whatever it was didn't like her blessings.

I'm very sorry to hear about your friend. A friend of mine passed last summer and it was also unexpected. Although I can't say I noticed anything strange in particular at the time, in hindsight I recall some of the warning signs associated with his overall deteriorating condition (myloma). He was very interested in old gravesites and antiques, and your story makes me wonder if his interests extended to the paranormal.

Again, thank you for sharing.