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February 14, 2016 — Whitley Strieber

Discussion in 'Talk About the Show' started by Gene Steinberg, Feb 14, 2016.



  1. Han

    Han piscator ψ

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    This is a very difficult situation, I want to help, but I really don't know how. This is not the first time I have seen this type of situation.

    My opinion is that although it wouldn't be possible to prove a crime had taken place the trauma suffered by the abductee could.

    If we imagine that the same type of trauma was inflicted in a non-paranormal scenario, even if no one could or had yet been prosecuted for inflicting the suffering, the victim should be given support.

    I care little if the events in an abduction are "real" or just "imagined" the consequences are just as devastating either way, and it could even be argued that because UFO's are not "real" the repercussions are more profound.

    I think what I am trying to say is that if it was up to me I would treat victims of abduction as if a crime has taken place, and by this I don't mean a police investigation, I mean that the victim should have the same right to "victim support services" (counseling etc).

    If the abductee was based in the UK they would be able to access existing healthcare services with a referral, but I don't know how it works elsewhere.

    This has all reminded me of what I find to be one of the most disturbing aspects of "pop culture" UFO's, and that is the absolute disregard and lack of respect that "victims" are shown.
    I could go into a big tirade about how it is not just in UFOlogy, I mean look at all the "real" crime shows, but as this is about abductions I will stick to that: I find it tragic that people are payed to recount what must have been or continue to be absolutely horrific experiences in front of a paying crowd, lest we forget they used to sell tickets to visit bedlum or to watch a life changing operation.
    What I mean is: that if your claim to fame is that you are a victim of a famous criminal, and then you are payed to speak and relive that experience to a paying audience, that must be a very lonely place.

    I think that if you removed the paranormal element it would be impossible to imagine a similar situation in today's society, or at least without serious moral objections from Joe Bloggs (John Doe US) and academics alike. to clarify what I am getting at:

    How many people here would pay a victim of a heinous crime recount it in lurid detail?

    There is a time, place and context for discussing such traumas, and yes in some cases speaking publicly can help in terms of both prevention and awareness, but that doesn't seem to be the goal in the case of UFOs.

    It is very easy to critisise but I genuinely feel that an organisations such as "MUFON" and others should take much more responsibility in helping victims of abduction, the last thing I am suggesting is that they should be care givers, rather that they should take a much more active role in helping victims find the services they require.

    But academia also needs to do more, it is easily demonstrable that a perceived crime can be as damaging as a "real" one, and the consequences are just as drastic.
     
  2. marduk

    marduk quelling chaos since 2352BC

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    The whole experience is very liminal. Meaning it's a boundary condition, between two states. On the threshold of something.

    Once you push it through the boundary, it seems to vanish. Slides away into the dark.

    Even calling it trauma maybe puts a label onto it, that maybe detracts from what it is.

    I'm struggling to define what I mean, I recognize this. I think this is part of the problem.
     
  3. mike

    mike Administrator Staff Member

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    I had that same feeling during my experience. Ive been in plenty of real life, life threatening situations. None have elicited the response i had that night.
    All rational reason was lost, it was pure animal terror.
     
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  4. marduk

    marduk quelling chaos since 2352BC

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    Exactly.

    It's like your neocortex goes away.

    It literally strips you of yourself. You are only instinct.

    That was more terrifying than anything else. To be frank, that's about all I remember: the terror and the emptiness.

    I was left with a deep sense that we aren't rational thinkers in a body. We are animals with a thin veil of self-awareness and illusion of self control.
     
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  5. mike

    mike Administrator Staff Member

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    Mine had the added twist of shame.
    I've been married 30 years which speak's to the deep connection we have.
    But during this incident i remember thinking take her, not me.
    I've put myself in harm's way to save her from danger on a few occasions, and had no qualms about doing so.
    But they were my last thoughts before the terror took me, peaked and i fainted with fright.
     
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  6. blowfish

    blowfish Whittingham

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    Agree with the comments and never said it's not real rather see medical practitioner or medical professional counselor. Agree PTSD / Sleep Paralysis etc seems to give a clue to this horrid experiences . Real horror from the unknown as mentioned before a cloaked type object which walked on our outdoor area. The machine like action and leaving pressure marks as it walked across and disappeared as it moved while sounds of electrical in nature. Yes I was outside wide awake and heard this strange wind and noise prior to the event. It jump into something sound and wind motion and flew across the garden area (I had walked under the clothes line and it hovered over and disappeared. Storm appeared two nights later. A helicopter flew over the house for awhile next day and what hell was it who known our technology or ? Few nights later in early morning a large triangle flew over "Massive" lights in diamond formation. No loud sound just a very low hum. like late Author John Keel has mentioned in great works. I received a odd phone a gentleman from some group who never gave name or contact details and untraceable number called then telling me to drop looking into the subject of UFOs.
     
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  7. marduk

    marduk quelling chaos since 2352BC

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    Mine, too.

    My ex blamed me for the event, of which neither of us remembered anything except waking up screaming and frozen, knowing something happened.

    She also blamed me for not protecting her from whatever it was. She was my wife, I would have gladly put my life on the line for her. But in this spot, I was as frozen as she was.

    Then you're left with the shame of that, and no answers for whatever it was. It's just a blank spot with some heavy duty emotional content. No meaning.
     
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  8. Linda Moulton Doty

    Linda Moulton Doty Skilled Investigator

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    I think you have to be an idiot to hear some people tell these stories and not think something is going on. And I think if somebody is not presenting as a psychotic or as a liar, anybody with any empathy would feel for these people, including the ones on this thread. But what an absolute clusterf*ck human life is that this can happen to you, and then the waters will end up hopelessly muddied by either psychotics or lying hoaxers. Or worse, other categories like Strieber who probably had some real experiences, but who turned into a pathological storyteller. What a mess.
     
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  9. kanakaris

    kanakaris Paranormal Adept

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    Strieber started as a horror writer, that says it all. Remember what Anne Strieber once said : It's all in his head.
     
  10. Linda Moulton Doty

    Linda Moulton Doty Skilled Investigator

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    Do you just sort of chime in, wait twenty replies, and then chime in again with the same thing?
     
  11. kanakaris

    kanakaris Paranormal Adept

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    Sorry , i'll go.
     
  12. Linda Moulton Doty

    Linda Moulton Doty Skilled Investigator

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    Not for me to say who comes and goes, but good grief. We know he was a horror writer for a minute back in the 'eighties. Other horror writers could have experiences, write about them, and not end up a pathological storyteller like Strieber.
     
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  13. beyondthestargate

    beyondthestargate Paranormal Adept

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    In 2010 I had what could be called a nervous breakdown. I had such severe anxiety and depression that I could not leave the house and got to a point where I was literally ripping off my teeshirts. I believe inherent issues were invoked leading to this state by a long course of CIPRO, which impacts about 1% of its "victims" in this way. The real kicker is that even after you stop taking the medication, the anxiety and depression can last indefinitely, ruining your life!

    I went to one of the top 10 psychiatrists in the USA per peer review. I was lucky to simply live in a large city where he practiced. He put me on psychotropic drugs to stabilize my condition. This allowed us to embark on 3 years of psychotherapy. Along with a life time of mundane but traumatic experiences, my alien abductions were revealed and discussed. I must emphasize that the abductions were NOT the focal point of the 3 year therapy. Nonetheless, my experiences were accepted with respect and discussed for their traumatic impacts. I lucked out because this traditional Freudian psychiatrist was also a ufo buff, so I got professional assistance from a medical doctor who was sympathetic to my claims. However, again I must emphasize that my claims in this area were not the focus of treatment. The treatment was to reveal to myself the underlying issues that caused the extreme chronic anxiety and depression, thereby helping to alleviate them. This treatment worked and I credit this doctor for saving my life. However, I do not feel comfortable sharing his name with you because I don't think he would appreciate being known as the alien abduction psychiatrist. My point is just that such people are out there. Unfortunately, he did not accept insurance for his services since he refused to get involved with the entire medical-insurance industry system of care. Being so famous, he also could pick and choose patients who were willing to pay. So after 3 years I was essentially broke (about $30,000) and had to stop treatment for financial reasons. Welcome to the American health care system!

    P.S. After years of treatment, I see the psychiatrist every 6 months for a Medicines Check-in. I take PAXIL and probably will for life. I little pill a day. Big deal. He also gave me an anxiety benzo medication but helped me wean off it after treatment. So, yes, such doctors may give you medication, but it may be necessary to stabilize your mind so that proper treatment can continue. This medication can later be weaned off slowly. My life now is perfectly normal emotionally and physically. Medication saves lives. To the people who have never suffered the intensity of extreme depression and anxiety, I have a message. Don't you dare proclaim that such sufferers should not take medications. This is an outrageous thing to say. Medication may be the only life line back to normality. But chemical balancing of the mind should always be combined with interactive therapy. In some cases, you would see a psychiatrist for medications and also work with a psychologist for interactive therapy. In my case, the psychiatrist did it all. One stop shopping.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  14. marduk

    marduk quelling chaos since 2352BC

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    Did they also help you integrate the experience?
     
  15. Burnt State

    Burnt State Paranormal Adept

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    Or better, if you are willing to share, have you personally integrated the experience and if so was it done in a way that the experience has since been laid to rest?

    What do you make of this experience many years later (assuming no other similar experiences have taken place in your life) - do you define those events as classic alien abductions still or do you look at that part of your life in a different way now?
     
  16. Linda Moulton Doty

    Linda Moulton Doty Skilled Investigator

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    Not to be a thread Nazi, but wouldn't this topic be better served on its own thread?
     
  17. beyondthestargate

    beyondthestargate Paranormal Adept

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    In brief, the experiences to my knowledge stopped in the mid 90's after a dramatic encounter. Therefore, I have had a lot of time to integrate the experiences since they seem to be in the rear view mirror of my life. I put the entire alien encounter scenario in the same basket as other paranormal experiences in my earlier life. Looking back, I am astonished at what I have been through, but it seems long ago and far away, so to speak. Perhaps what helped me the most to integrate all of this were the works of Jacques Vallee, who saw this as not a literal Exopolitics Space Opera, but instead as a mysterious type of paranormal contact and control system. I have no idea if this is true, but nonetheless it helped me to keep from being sucked into one of the various warring camps of ufology. My personality was never structured to seek answers off-the-shelf, so I have always remained skeptical of all the "experts" pontificating about Pleiadians, Zeta's, Demons, and a Midsummer's Night's Dream of various encounters and entities. I live contentedly without a personal answer. I accept the reality of what occurred, but unlike many I seem able to peacefully live with the ambiguity surrounding it. I do not expect to know what it all means in my life time. Frankly, I am just relieved it is over.

    While this is certainly not a well-thought out answer that you may seek, I can offer you again a document I wrote last year detailing all my experiences. I believe I made some editorial comments about the nature of all this there. I certainly do not come to sites like this for "Da Trooth" (copywrite pending). There were times in the past that the events were so terrifying that I threw out every book on the topic that I owned (this was in the pre-eBay period). But now the fear has subsided and I abide with the unknown quality of all this rather well actually.

    Anonymous Woo Woo Files.pdf
     
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  18. beyondthestargate

    beyondthestargate Paranormal Adept

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    Regarding psychiatric therapy, we discussed my entire life and the various themes that could be seen from a higher perspective. We honestly did not integrate paranormal experiences in a special way, but integrated all life experience. I do honestly think that I integrated the specifically paranormal experiences myself over time. I love to write, and have always since childhood used writing to analyze and deal with my thoughts. Of course, if you are not in touch with your inner reality, you may just be lying to yourself with this method. But overall it helped me a lot to go through the process of expressing my feelings and thoughts and then (with modern tools) arranging these thoughts in a logical way for review. I believe this helped me greatly along with daily meditation.

    One thing I will add for anyone wanting to follow up on this idea, which has been suggested by some researchers in this area. I was emotionally and physically abused all through childhood. I had to see brutal acts, such as my dad punishing me by smashing in my cat's head with a shovel, making me watch. I could feel myself go numb inside, pushing the normal emotions down deep inside, since reacting emotionally would have just gotten me beat up. Then when I came to the realization that I was gay, I went through all the societal hatred of the time period. When I went to the psychiatrist, he administered some tests and validated from our discussion early on that I had the classic symptoms of PTSD. Consequently, he treated me for PTSD. But getting back to the original thought, some researchers have suggested that being abused as a child can in some cases open a channel for the paranormal, for abductions and other strange experiences. Are these parasites hitching a ride on a person with a damaged energy field? Who knows?

    But you can see how it was not necessary or possible to parse out my alien abduction experiences from the overall PTSD invoking experiences from my brutal childhood and a life as a gay man who had a ton of religious guilt and societal disgust, which I took very seriously for many years (there was no such thing as Gay Pride back then).

    Perhaps the main point is that there are professionals out there who can help you. I would NOT recommend going to a hypnotist or anyone associated with ufology. There are so many frauds out there (like David Jacobs) who have no authority to practice any form of psychotherapy. Wasn't he a history professor? My psychiatrist refused to use any hypnosis with a client. He said hypnosis was subject to confabulation and totally out-of-line for my treatment or anyone with such issues.
     
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  19. marduk

    marduk quelling chaos since 2352BC

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    That is exactly where I'm at. Well said.
     
  20. marduk

    marduk quelling chaos since 2352BC

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    Wow, are we similar.

    Ok, you're changing my mind about looking for help from others here.

    I'm sorry what happened to you, man.
     
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