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Conspiracy Theorists Aren't Crazy


New World Order? Come on now...

I did get the joke there right? You have the "smoking man" avatar ... na ... of course, there's no new world order conspiracy going on ... here's a quote between him and Scully ...

The Cigarette Smoking Man: You're not being honest with yourself. Think back. There was a time when you feared for your future, for your career when you were first partnered with this man. I told you, I've studied you for years... and if you would permit me, I'd like to make an observation. You're drawn to powerful men but you fear their power. You keep your guard up, a wall around your heart. How else do you explain that fearless devotion to a man obsessed, and, yet, a life alone? You'd die for Mulder but you won't allow yourself to love him.

Scully: Wow. I'm learning a whole other side to you. You're not just a cold-blooded killer, you're a pop psychologist as well.

And just to raise the eyebrows of our omnicient FMs ...

Space Babe Vote Here:
https://www.theparacast.com/forum/threads/8883-Space-Babes?highlight=space+babes


j.r.
 
Conspiracy theories are twisted, occult versions of things that are happening in real life. "Mark of the Beast" without which you can't do business? Try renting a car or a hotel room without major credit, even if you have the cash. Bilderberg Group taking over the world? People like them have been engaged in a 75-year campaign to roll back the New Deal, reduce the U.S. middle and working-classes to debt bondage, and consolidate wealth into a small class of international investors who will no longer be accountable to any nation. Governments run by alien reptiles? Take a look at what so many governments do to their own citizens, much less to other countries -- humans wouldn't do those things to ourselves, would we?

I don't believe in conspiracy theories. Not because they're wrong, but because conspiracies are unnecessary -- there are things done openly that are monstrous enough.
 
Conspiracy theories are twisted, occult versions of things that are happening in real life ... I don't believe in conspiracy theories. Not because they're wrong, but because conspiracies are unnecessary -- there are things done openly that are monstrous enough.

What about the so-called "UFO conspiracy" though. It seems to me, having been in ufology for over 40 years, that those who are promoting it as a "conspiracy" are more the skeptics who cherry pick the fringe element and package it all in the same box, when in fact, researchers like Tim Good have made some real convincing presentations that clearly show that there has been and contiues to be a policy of disinformation and non-disclosure regrading the official investigation of UFOs by the major world powers. He calls it a "Cover-Up", Friedman calls it a "Cosmic Watergate". Leaving the isuue of MJ-12 out of it, these guys have shown us time and again that the official line and the reality of the situation don't match, and that even when presented with the actual information, the official line remains the same, as if ignoring the facts somehow justifies their position.

Then the skeptics climb all over the disinformation and point to the ones with the real facts and cry "conspiracy theorist!" ... he or she is crazy, or if they aren't crazy, don't worry it's just a psychological leftover from our primitive brain, as if there were some hard wired remnant in our modern evolved brain that facilitates "conspiracy theory mentality". It seems more like resorting to junk science than actually looking into the facts of the phenomenon.

j.r.
 
I did get the joke there right? You have the "smoking man" avatar ... na ... of course, there's no new world order conspiracy going on ... .


Ha yea, thats kinda what I was going for....although I do think the NWO stuff is complete bs
 

Angelo is a master baiter.


---------- Post added at 01:24 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:22 AM ----------




So Angelo what the heck was bush talking about then? he made 2 such speeches. You can find plenty from other world leaders too.

Lets see Angelo spin this one.

I have always taken this along the same lines that I take Kissengers comments. It is calling for a restructuring of financial dependancies and the recognition that the economy is truly global. Kissinger has always maintained that this could not happen until diplomacy was separated from the evangelical mindset of the west. I doubt the Bush administration would see that side of the argument but I do think that they could see that the state of the worlds economy reflects on the US economy and to a large extent vice versa. To me they are not talking about a secret cabal holding meetings in a hollowed out volcanic island someplace in the Pacific. Merely the recognition that we now find ourselves irreversibly linked to every other industrialized nation and that our decisions and their decisions have a direct effect on the stability of the current financial system.

But hay, I cant rule out the middle aged balding super genius stroking a persian cat and cackling silently to himself while trying to decide what happens in the world next.
 
Ha yea, thats kinda what I was going for....although I do think the NWO stuff is complete bs

Of course ... we're not really hearing the phrase "New World Order" in these clips. I don't know about fringe stuff like a reptilian cabal herding us all into their NWO, but there seems to be little doubt that there are powerful world leaders in industry and politics that are working together toward what they call a NWO.


Now having said that, I'm not convinced that a NWO is necessarily a bad thing. For example:

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one


This "freedom generation" sentiment was something that to me sounded pretty good. A united world, living in peace. We saw the fall of the Berlin wall and that was a ray of hope that more walls, both real and figurative would fall, but the anti-NWO movement would have us build more walls and divide us all instead of unite us. They say the NWO isn't really about freedom but about ultimate power and control resting in the hands of a few ... maybe that would be part of the administrative structure, but it doesn't necessarily mean it's bad or evil. The bad stuff happens if in the pursuit of the NWO, the NWO advocates forced conversion or assimilation of other nations. There has to be voluntary agreement for it to work, and it isn't likely that all the little chiefs and warlords are going to want to give up their tiny little piece of the pie to satisfy the NWO advocates. In fact they see the NWO as their enemy and they are responsible for a good portion of the anti-NWO propoganda.

j.r.
 
do a search for NWO quotes. it is not BS

So vague quotes by politicians mean a massive conspiracy exists? The key word there is politician...

Also, if there was a NWO why would Bush mention it in passing during his speech. Why would he mention it at all?

In the end, there are plenty of men behind the curtains doing things we don't know about BUT I have a hard time believing its as big a conspiracy as the NWO.

Angelo is right, its paranoia.
 
Brian Dunning does a great analysis of the mind of conspiracy theorists on this week's Skeptoid.

Conspiracy Theorists Aren't Crazy


Today we're going to descend into the darkest depths of the human mind to learn what makes a conspiracy theorist tick; or, as some would put it, to learn why his tick seems just a bit off. Is there anything we can learn from the conspiratorial mind, and is there a method to its apparent madness?
The human brain evolved in such a way as to keep itself alive to the best of its ability. For the past few million years, our ancestors faced a relatively straightforward daily life. Their job was simply to stay alive. Like us, they had different personalities, different aptitudes, different attitudes. This was borne out in many ways, but the classic example that's often used is that something would rustle in the tall grass. Some of our ancestors weren't too concerned, and figured it was merely the wind; but others were more cautious, suspected a panther, and jumped for the nearest tree. Over the eons, and hundreds of thousands of generations, the nonchalant ancestors were wrong (and got eaten) just often enough that eventually, more survivors were those who tended toward caution, and even paranoia. In evolution, it pays to err on the side of caution. The brains most likely to survive were those who saw a panther in every breath of wind, an angry god in every storm cloud, a malevolent purpose in every piece of random noise. We are alive today as a race, in part, because our brains piece random events together into a pattern that adds up to a threat that may or may not be real. As a result, we are afraid of the dark even though there's rarely a monster; thunder frightens us even though lightning is scarcely a credible threat; and we perceive the menace of malevolent conspiracies in the acts of others, despite the individual unlikelihood of any one given example.
Conspiratorial thinking is not a brain malfunction. It's our brain working properly, and doing exactly what it evolved to do.
So then, why aren't we all conspiracy theorists? Why don't we all see conspiracies all day long? It's because we also have an intellect, and enough experience with living in our world that we are usually able to correctly analyze the facts and fit them into the way we have learned things really work. It is, exactly as it sounds, a competition between two forces in our head. One is the native, instinctive impulse to see everything as a threat, and the other is our rational, conscious thought that takes that input and judges it.
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Let's look at two examples that illustrate the ends of the spectrum. David Icke is a British conspiracy theorist best known for his claim that most world leaders are actually reptilian aliens wearing electronic disguises. When you pause a video, he points to the compression artifacting and asserts that it's a glitch in the electronic disguise. However, he's out in the world, he tours, he writes books, he has a family and is a member of his community. He's not locked in an asylum as we might expect from hearing his theory. The reason is that he's probably not mentally ill at all. His brain is doing exactly what it's supposed to. He sees a group of powerful men, and the instinctive part of his brain suggests a sinister purpose. Imagine yourself seeing the ministers of the G8, or some similar collection. A thought passes through all of our minds, something like this: "I bet they all know something I don't know. I'd love to hear what they were talking about. They're up to something." That's the same thing David Icke thinks. It's exactly what our brains evolved to do. Our brains all want to go there.
And then the intellect receives this warning, and analyzes it, based on its knowledge. We all have different knowledge built from different experiences. One who has had negative experiences with authority is likely to gauge this situation differently than one who has not. David Icke probably has some past experience that makes his intellect properly — if incorrectly — assign more credence to the threat than is necessary; overtly so, in his particular case. Most of the rest of us have rarely seen a news story where a secret collusion among world leaders was discovered, so our intellectual understanding of the world has good reason to reject this particular instinctive threat as being improbable. Thus we conclude that it's probably just a group of businesspeople doing what they have to do. We all fall somewhere along that spectrum, and all perspectives are the result of our brains properly doing their job.
Take another example, this time of the Big Pharma conspiracy. Our brains see a group of huge, profitable companies in the same industry, and the pattern is obvious. Instinct throws up its warning flag. They're up to something evil, they are a threat. That is the brain's normal and expected first response. Next comes the intellectual filter to evaluate the reality of the threat. Only this time, many more of us match the threat to things we've seen in the news. There are genuine conflicts of interest in the pharmaceutical industry. Sometimes the rules for getting drugs approved have been bent. Drugs have been taken off the market after initial findings of safety, many times. In fact, the average person on the street probably knows little about the pharmaceutical industry except for examples of such cases making it into the news. In this case, the knowledge that many people's intellect uses to drive its conspiracy filter is likely to give this one a score of "Plausible". Let's look at the results. Suspicion toward Big Pharma is fairly widespread, while suspicion of reptoid aliens controlling the world is quite limited. Most other conspiracies fall somewhere in between these two.
Whether it's David Icke seeing reptoids or your coworkers and neighbors shunning government approved drugs, it's the same thought process, and it's the brain doing its job properly. Like a classroom of students who all honestly studied hard yet still got varying scores on the test, our brains are going to be right sometimes and wrong sometimes. But they're all following the proper steps to get there; conspiratorial thinking is not necessarily, by itself, indicative of psychiatric illness.
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To determine when a person is over the line and should be treated, psychiatrists often look closely at the context. Does the conspiratorial belief integrate harmlessly with this person's life, or does it dominate? Has it caused problems: loss of job, loss of spouse, loss of security, or caused sociopathic behavior? These are the types of things that differentiate a belief system from what we call an illness. A person who thinks Barack Obama's birth certificate is fake is not ill, but a person who obsesses over it to the point of driving away their friends and family could well be.
The diagnosis is often delusional disorder. It must be a primary disorder, which means that it's not a symptom of some other condition the patient may have, it has to be the primary psychopathology. There are six types:

  1. Erotomanic, usually seen when the patient believes some famous celebrity is in love with them.
  2. Grandiose, claiming to be famous or ingenious, sometimes claiming to be a real famous person who is actually an impostor.
  3. Jealous, when they believe their partner is unfaithful when it's not true to the point of irrationality.
  4. Persecutory, when they believe they're being spied on by the government or some evil force, often filing frequent police reports or making confrontations.
  5. Somatic, when they believe they have some undiagnosed or unique medical condition.
  6. Mixed, some combination of the above with none predominating.
Such people could benefit from treatment, usually a combination of drug therapy and psychotherapy. However, as we've discussed before on Skeptoid, getting them to agree to treatment at all is often the primary barrier. They believe their delusion is real. They will present their evidence to prove it until the cows come home. It's often impossible to get them to consider the possibility that the reality of what they perceive might be due, in any degree, to psychopathology.
But if you've had a conversation with a conspiracy theorist — and almost all of us have — you've met people who do not display symptoms of delusional disorder far more often than those who do. The ordinary conspiracy theorist is an intelligent, sane, and generally rational person. They are, in fact, unsettlingly less different from you than you may have thought.


Not all detection of purposeful agency sees something evil. For example, we now know that the sun, moon, planets, stars, and constellations are simply other bodies floating through space and doing their thing, much as our Earth does. But early human cultures, who lacked better knowledge, suspected them to be purposeful entities that existed only to influence humankind on this one particular rock. This brain function that kept our species safe from threats also formed the basis for pagan religions, the great polytheistic European cultures, and astrology. Note that astrology still thrives today. Astrology is psychologically similar to conspiratorial thinking. Both represent the healthy brain's perception of purposeful agency in ordinary phenomena, but one sees danger while the other sees comfort. All of our brains naturally take us there, and it is only our learned intellect that reins us back. We're all hard wired to experience a deep-rooted excitement at the thought of opening a fortune cookie, though most of us have learned to put little stock in the fortune. And if handed today's horoscope, few can deny that their brain will go straight to their own zodiac sign to see what it says. There is no need to be embarrassed about doing either of these. It's one of the things your brain is supposed to do.
So, embrace your inner conspiracy theorist. Learn to identify and understand your own conspiratorial thinking, and you'll be better prepared to comprehend the position of the next conspiracy theorist you talk with. When you dismiss someone as paranoid or crazy, remember: it might be you who's wrong.

Angel, I hate to say it because I think I understand spirit of the article -but the author's understanding of the evolution of consciousness as well as human psychology and psychopathology in general is woefully inadequate. Perhaps I'll get into it sometime, but... Really, this reflects very poor insight into the human psychological complex. My guess is Mr. Dunning skipped psych 101 in pursuit of his writing for film and TV degree.
 
Angel, I hate to say it because I think I understand spirit of the article -but the author's understanding of the evolution of consciousness as well as human psychology and psychopathology in general is woefully inadequate. Perhaps I'll get into it sometime, but... Really, this reflects very poor insight into the human psychological complex. My guess is Mr. Dunning skipped psych 101 in pursuit of his writing for film and TV degree.

I think Dunning is a computer guy. I know he would make a great Paracast guest. He and Gene would agree about Macs for sure!
 
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