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Christians and ufology. Overview


The Starman

Paranormal Maven
We are not authorized to deny that there are creatures in other stars that are completely different from ours.

Cardinal Nicolaus Cusanus (1401 - 1464)

In today's world, where every tenth becomes a prophet with all the followers of the crowd, and every third claims to have seen the UFOs who gave him the mission of saving the world, there is a need for Christians to talk about the UFO phenomenon. Who are those aliens ? What extremes are taking on the church in this matter? Let's try to look at what's happening in the world at the same time and how different Christian communities react, what they are talking about and what their current classmates are doing. Who are those aliens, also known as extrateriastrials? What extremes are taking on the church in this matter? Let's try to look at what's happening in the world at the same time and how different Christian communities react, what they are talking about and what their current "brothers and sisters" are doing.


A small brief on the UFO phenomenon


The UFOs - unrecognized flying objects, in 1947 the businessman and flyer Kenneth Arnold were "baptized" with flying saucers, as a phenomenon known to the public for a long time. Specific reports of light in the sky appeared in the media from the second half of the 19th century. but their opinion that references to flying saucers can be found in ancient art, starting with the signs of the Naska Valley and the Egyptian pyramid drawings and finishing with Renaissance paintings. There are also those who believe that the UFO is spoken in various cultures and scriptures, from the Bible to the Vedas and Talmud, not forgetting the legends of mystical Dogon tribes about the arrivals of Syria. It is not necessary to tell the story of the phenomenon itself or to go into the discussions as much as contacts with the extraterrestrials and the light in the sky are real.

The main strangeness is not that people say they've seen something or have been communicating with someone, but the news that the aliens come from outer space itself. It's usually messianic messages that are received, as witnesses say, directly or through astral contact. A frequent contact person feels an unceasing desire to announce to the whole world that the time of adversity is approaching or that the aliens have put their probe in their heads. As a rule, contact takes place like this: meeting, kidnapping, warning to mankind, the message of salvation or destruction, the contact person receives the mesmerizing task of reporting this "good news" to all humanity. So the contactees publishing "good news of the aliens" no worse than did Christians of the first centuries.

20th century In the first half, it was believed that space enthusiasts arrived from Mars or Venus, at least from there, was the radio station of the Herbert George Wells novel "The World Wars", which caused a universal panic in New York in 1938, when people fled from the city after the release of the show and hid for days on the outskirts of Mars Invasion. The testimony of contacts of that time is evidenced by the same. Later, after expanding to the astronomical knowledge of the universe, and especially after J. Gagarin, the alien homeland started to move away. Until recently, they separated from nearby or famous stars, mostly from sirius constellation, or from planets that were supposedly to those stars. At this time, aliens have moved to live in other galaxies or in star systems that our scientists simply do not know. Normally, such information can not be verified, and the one that is available is usually simply misinformation: the stranger's pawn is from the planet Parasirijus, which is located near the Earth and is about four light years away. What can the coordinates of the alien homeland say? Only so much that it is not known what the place is closer than the nearest star, the Kentauro Proxima. Such and even more misinformation occurs very often.

Another oddity, necessarily accompanying the UFO phenomenon, is conspiracy theories. The reader could certainly see some of them in the "X files" series. The most popular "theories" (Area 51, the Roswell catastrophe, men in black and others) usually reveal the basic idea that the government hides from the public the fact that aliens really exist and that contacts have long been established and various projects are being implemented using alien technologies. Sometimes these conspiracy theories are also mixed in by the fact that the Vatican goes with the government, because he really knows that there is no God, and that the aliens are prototypes of all gods, only to deceive us.


Paleocontact - Aliens become gods


The main idea of one of the most prominent supporters of paleocontact, Erich von Däniken, is already quite widespread among pseudo-archeology and pseudo-history, saying that the aliens had visited the Earth on an ancient day, people supported them, began to worship them, and thus religions, including Christianity, arose. Eduard von Däniken in one book, "Raumfarth im Altertum", describes quite well how the alienss contacted the archaic man, as the first representative of the homo-sapiens was probably not from the planet Earth. It is also mentioned that the description of the alien spacecraft is found in Ezechiel's vision. Unfortunately, various religious or pseudoreligic groups are also getting such ideas. Ufonoates, who have became messiahs of humanity, have taught and even created it, are often reflected in the 20th century. The founder of the first organization, called Rael, interacted with the alien who "scientifically" explained to him the Bible. The founder of the second organization, Vladimir Ivanovich Skubaev, shed "The Gospel according to the White Lotus", which describes an alternative world history, in which the incoming person from the same sirius constellation became a teacher of mankind. Let's not forget the followers of such titles as the Urantia Book and the Scientologists founded by Lafayette Ronald Hubbard who were also quite capable of teaching their Jesus-flying hand-held spacecraft, and yet the abundance of others. Christians find this funny or blasphemous.

Erich von Däniken's fellow friend Giorgio Tsoukalos, they both call themselves ufologists. They are well known in "ancient aliens" series.

In the world, religious sects appear daily. Perhaps the reader remembers organization the "Heavenly Gate" in the last decade of the last century. His chief Marshall Hertt Applewhitte said that the aliens had been sent to bring mankind to heaven because, in his view, Earth had to be eradicated in the year 2000. The organization of the visa expired in 1997 when Heilly-Bop Comets approached the Earth. The whole group of believers "flew away" in a spacecraft which was "hiding" on the comet's tail. Jesus himself piloted, in that occasion they took a lethal dose of barbiturate and putted plastic bags on their heads.

It is a pity, but there are always people who tend to rely on various strange, "scientific" or innovative Biblical teachings. The admirers of Däniken Paleocontact's mind-blowing ideas forget that their multiplication often distorts the facts and raises ideas that do not have a real confirmation, but only his personal guesses. One of the flagship statements could be the fact that the spacecraft, the captain of which was named Yahweh, appeared to the Jews. It is perfectly normal for such people that Moses, seeing the descending spaceship, thought for his misunderstanding that it was a burning bush, that Ezechiel saw the spacecraft at the Kebara River, forgetting that there was a crowd of people who did not see this spacecraft, and that Jesus ( spacecraft physician ) accidentally left on Earth. From then he is a , distributing dry food. The proponents of Däniken's ideas, Raelians, followers of Heaven's Gate and others often distort the Bible's text, distorts the text from context and ignore any historical critical approach, seeing aliens in any place. What to do? It you can't live without faith.

Usually such ideas are more dangerous for people who do not have a clear religious identity, even though such cases occur even when human pastors suddenly begin to tell how they interacted with the aliens and how they taught them the true faith. I am referring to the events of 1994 in Lithuania, when priest Petras Zabiela (renamed, but known to those concerned with the phenomenon of UFOs) has claimed to have been abducted by aliens who showed him his temple in 1992, explained that they live without sin . The priest spoke on television and in the newspapers. The message of the religious aliens has not spread to the world. Surprisingly, such contactees usually tend to to identify aliens within gods and without any paleocontact theory. For them, aliens become angels or equated with gods. Here is the danger to christian or other religions.

When the aliens become almighty gods, salvation becomes unnecessary, and religion is meaningless, because could some random spacecraft physician (Jesus), who did not know anything on the Earth, save the humanity, if his words were falsely conveyed?

E. Norman goes even further than Däniken. According to him, the UFOs are sent to earth in our time, in order to transmit God through them to tell truth about ourselves. The tendencies of both authors' affirmations are felt in many ufo-religious movements.

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Such pictures are often interpreted according to personal ideology

Such Bible interpretations have nothing to do with traditional education or traditional religion. Disregarding the historical and theological context, the facts are distorted, and the Bible is perceived as the author needs. Paradoxal, but not traditional Christians, writers of this kind begin, diligently study the scriptures.


Religion or science?


One of the mistakes made by Christians regarding the UFOs is to see this phenomenon only as a religious phenomenon or as a danger to religion as such, rejecting any other possibility. Usually Christians associate faith with aliens unequivocally with magic, occultism, and sects. This is evident in the reading of the popular Christian literature on this subject. Also feature films such as M. Night Shyamalan's Signs (2002) or Alex Proyas Knowing (2009) or Steve Spielberg's Close Encounters of the Third Kind (1977), which have a great influence on the alien beliefs and the recognition of religion, Spiritual issues are dealt with in one way or another. The Signs clergyman, played by Mel Gibson, fights with aliens, guided by the prophecy given to a dying wife, has a very bright eschatological and messianic mood. Spielberg's masterpiece has become almost a canonical icon of ufology experience.

Of course, we don't have to reject the fact that the UFO sects and even the manifestations of magic are quite common in ufology. Such sects appear quite often. Thanks to "God", not everyone ends as sadly as the Heavenly Gate Group. However, due to the fault of such movements, people who try to evaluate the phenomenon of UFOs more or less scientifically, are Christians in the same way as devilish sectants. Independent researchers such as Randles, B. Hopkins. His books tend to shake their research in any religious context. Again, the level of scholarship in their work is another issue, but we will not discuss it, emphasizing only that not everything related to the aliens and the UFO's is the object of religion.

Scientific research projects such as SETI (Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence) are often forgotten, which, although some scholars are skeptical about being condemned to failure or meaningless, are based on purely scientific methods and are engaged in life forms, especially those who think on other planets , searches. The SETI program is fully committed to isolating itself from the UFO phenomenon, and does not fully grasp what might be happening in the Earth, and they are interested in the distant cosmos. Programs such as SETI have already made a number of discoveries. In 2007 Gliese 581 C was discovered for Earth-like planet, and more planets would be discovered in future (just a guessing). There are already hundreds of planets circling around other stars that have already been found. Perhaps Giordan Bruno was right in the 16th century. saying that on other planets there are also intelligence creatures?


Demonization of extraterrestrials


The real or false alien invasion of the planet of the Earth has affected most of humanity. This phenomenon was studied by special services, investigated by scholars, described by fantasy writers, and was also debated by theologians of various Christian denominations such as Presbyterian Barry Downing or Evangelist Billy Graham. The first aliens considered the divine act of baptism, the second thought that the UFO's were nothing else but the angels' way of appearing to man of this age. By the way, the same other authors also talk about demons. Such theological sophism raised the idea that the UFO's appearances are one of the signs of eschatological times. Angels - the aliens became prophets of the end of time, so the end ir near... Of course, then there were also opposing opinions. Christian fundamentalists, claiming that the Bible no longer mentions the civilizations of other planets, began to assert that the nature of aliens can only be demonic. So the UFO's and the aliens are reunited with eschatology, only this time they prophesy not the quick coming of Christ, but of the Antichrist.

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Some aliens species often claim to be evil, for example "little greys".

The demonization of the aliens has been accompanied by this phenomenon since the "cause" has been named, that uncertain light in the sky is the manifestation of aliens from space. Current ufologists also see UFOs' manifestations in the old fashion and the old texts, but the people of that time considered various light in heaven as demonic and divine signs, the current Christian tends to see only demonic manifestations in it. This comes not only from the perception of the phenomenon itself, but also from the denominations , demonology and various teachings of spiritual theology. One Church takes over from one another, and the original idea seems to be worshiping with a growing force of Christianity. The main demons of the alien phenomenon are a large part of Protestant denominations, such as the well-known Word of the Faith. By the way, the Orthodox Church holds the same opinion. The Roman Catholic Church is also at the same time undergoing some of the ideas of alien demonism, although it is often only the insights of individual priests. There are published books in which the UFO phenomenon is uniquely associated with magic and occultism. An example of such literature could be the Enzo Bianco brochure Magic. Although it is not true, but I believe, "which essentially discusses the phenomenon of magic, but one section is dedicated to the UFO cult. Such books are usually relatively poor, both Catholic and Protestant. As a rule, such publications tend to recall the propaganda literature of Soviet times with a great deal of inaccuracies, attacks and personalities. As far as it is to be noted, the hierarchs of the Catholic Church on this issue are not inclined to make such bold conclusions by attaching demons to the aliens. However, various types of ufologists quotes these texts with various enchantments. It is, of course, strange that churches that disagree on the Bible and the questions of Christ's teaching become so united and identical in the mind of an enemy, unknown or real.

Since the Revelation of Aliens does not speak, so the Bible, translated through personal insights, becomes the main criterion for evaluating the question of UFO sightings and abductions. In principle, Christians, in an attempt to support the demonicity of aliens in the Bible, behave in the same way as those who are trying to prove the UFO's reality. The main arguments are often quite abstract, but for some theologians this is enough to see the similarities between the aliens and the demons of both types of subjects: night, confusion, distancing from belief, depression, fear, revelations manifestly contradictory to the Bible, violence from aliens / demons, sexual intercourse relationship with succubus/aliens. To a large extent, all these contacts can really be found in the biblical texts, but in this way we can stray into sofism and complete miss-interpretation of texts, and then we would act in the same way as the pseudo-scientist Erich von Däniken. But the path of lies is not a good Christian choice.

Anywa... on the aliens question are interested some Christian denominations. In 1980, the United States established the Church of the Movement for Resistance to Aliens near the famous Roswell Town. It is a Protestant fundamentalist community that provides psychological and spiritual assistance to victims of aliens. Interestingly, members of the community teach their clients how it is possible to interrupt abductions by means of prayer - this can be done by ordering Jesus' name.


Of course, opposition to resistance is not only among the Christians. Among the interested ufologists, a well-known person is V2 who, for free, distributes anti-Tactical stickers depicting an alien's head, crossed red. V2 invites all humanity to connect on Earth againt the aliens. The Savior identity is not known.

So, any fight against aliens is essentially a recognition that they exist. Christians, who have come to such a battle, often do not even suspect themselves of it, announce an alien good news.



Vatican and the aliens


After the Second Vatican meeting in the Catholic Church, when a charismatic renewal movement emerged, quite a large part of the faithful laymen and clergy began to interpret many aspects of the functioning of the Holy Spirit based on Protestant theology. Such a lack of practical theology in the Catholic Church has influenced a relatively large part of the Catholic view of the UFO phenomenon. These believers, like Protestant communities, have become unequivocally demons from other planets. However, a significant proportion of Catholic theologians and hierarchs do not lead to the demonization of UFO's. By evaluating this phenomenon in the light of revelation, they also do not forget scientific access to the question. Quite often, one or another representative of the Church speaks of extraterrestrial forms, but this is usually only their personal opinion; the media bubble is blowing it up, as happened in 2008 by the Director of the Vatican Observatory Jose Gabriel Funes S.J., expressing his opinion on extraterrestrial forms of life, and the media conveying it as the official position of the Vatican.

To this date, one of the most prominent personalities among the Catholic hierarchs is the Pontifical theologian and exorcist monsignor Corrado Balducci, who, unfortunately, died a couple of years ago. He was a Vatican's affiliate on UFO issues. This is most often quoted by theologian in ufologist's works. Father Balducci often spoke on ufology issues on television or in the press. Many times, a statement was made from his lips that the Church closely monitors the UFO phenomenon in the world and is trying to find out what that is. Balducci categorically opposed the demons of aliens, based on the fact that not all phenomena are inexplicable. Some of them are mere meteorological or psychological phenomena, but another part that can not be reasonably explained in any way is not necessarily spiritual. So, in order for the Church to speak in authoritative in the issue of the UFO's, it needs to know what it takes to deal with, because attacking the demonization of an unaccountable phenomenon is unlikely to happen, but the second witch hunt wave may begin.

There are quite a few serious theologians in the Catholic Church who are trying to reflect on the UFO phenomenon on the basis of today's academic achievements and theology. One of them is the Polish theologian Jacek Salij OP. Such theologians are often guided by the New Testament quotation saying: "He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation, for it creates all that is in heaven and earth, whether visible or invisible, or thrones, affinity, or principality, or authority - all created through him and for him. "(Col. 1.15-16). These words of Paul show them that there is a possibility that God, being a great Creator whose wisdom and power are infinite, could have created the inhabitants of other planets, including those who intelligent.

Thus, although there is no official teaching on the in the Catholic Church, it is a matter for concern. Of course, any theological reflection on the morality of the aliens and the possibility of being baptized is still only at the level of fantasy novels, but if it ever happens that extraterrestrial life forms has actually visited/visiting all this time on Earth, then some kind of foundation will be laid for future theologians.
 
Why Believing in Aliens Is Religion in Disguise | Michael Shermer

More like demonization disguised as skepticism. Typical Shermer :rolleyes: . Back in high-school we did a study on religious symbolism in The Old Man and The Sea ( Hemingway ). What's the point? Basically, parallels can be drawn between religion and almost anything, and there tends to be an attitude among atheists that religion is deserving of criticism and undeserving of belief, so anything that can be associated with religion therefore becomes bad. Just plug-in your target subject matter, run a comparison, and presto! The subject is demonized. In this case it's people who believe UFOs are real. It's not fair-minded or unbiased.

To make it really obvious just ask him if he knows a single ufologist who believes the aliens are going to come down and save humanity? I don't. I don't think he does either. Maybe then ask him if if he knows of a single instance when God was tracked on radar and pursued by military jets? I doubt he can think of any instances there either. He's just using a stereotype that appears to have been created by skeptics without any actual supporting evidence, specifically for the purpose of ridicule. It's an intellectually dishonest tactic. But Shermer doesn't seem to mind taking part in it.
 
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More like demonization disguised as skepticism. Typical Shermer :rolleyes: . Back in high-school we did a study on religious symbolism in The Old Man and The Sea ( Hemingway ). What's the point? Basically, parallels can be drawn between religion and almost anything, and there tends to be an attitude among atheists that religion is deserving of criticism and undeserving of belief, so anything that can be associated with religion therefore becomes bad. Just plug-in your target subject matter, run a comparison, and presto! The subject is demonized. In this case it's people who believe UFOs are real. It's not fair-minded or unbiased.
I do not intend to answer for him, will comment only I on your thoughts.

Ufos exist (unidentified flying objects), there is no doubt about that. The only problem is that nobody has any indisputable evidence about fluttering cigars or flying saucers.

To make it really obvious just ask him if he knows a single ufologist who believes the aliens are going to come down and save humanity? I don't. I don't think he does either. Maybe then ask him if if he knows of a single instance when God was tracked on radar and pursued by military jets? I doubt he can think of any instances there either. He's just using a stereotype that appears to have been created by skeptics without any actual supporting evidence, specifically for the purpose of ridicule. It's an intellectually dishonest tactic. But Shermer doesn't seem to mind taking part in it.
Psychedelic alien experiences or aliens in flying saucers with no evidence are in the same ballpark. Do ufologists believe that aliens abduct people by using parapscyhology powers (even sometimes levitation) ? do they believe that aliens somehow "erase" memories ? it's all supernatural skills, that's why aliens qualify to supernatural beings. Believing without evidene in supernatural things is one of the most important foundations of any religion.
 
I do not intend to answer for him, will comment only I on your thoughts. Ufos exist (unidentified flying objects), there is no doubt about that. The only problem is that nobody has any indisputable evidence about fluttering cigars or flying saucers.
It appears that you're conflating the word origin for the term UFO ( e.g. from the acronym unidentified flying object - 1952 ) with the word's meaning ( e.g. alien craft, flying saucer ). That is a common mistake. To elucidate: The meanings of acronyms aren't always simply the same as the literal meaning of the words that form them, e.g. the word radar doesn't mean detecting radios and herding livestock. For an accurate definition of a word ( particularly acronyms ), the history and context must be taken into account. I wrote a rather extensive article on this issue for the USI website. To summarize: Based on analysis of the word history in combination with contemporary usage and dictionary definitions that use terms like "flying saucer" or "alien craft" as part of their definition, plus thesaurus synonyms for the word "ufo" or "UFO"; the word "ufo" or "UFO" is overwhelmingly used as label ( noun ) for alien craft, generically reffered to as flying saucers. Now that you know this, I'm sure you'll appreciate that intentionally equating a UFO with a simple unidentified object in the sky is misinformation.
Psychedelic alien experiences or aliens in flying saucers with no evidence are in the same ballpark.
That depends on whether or not you're the one who experienced the event. In that case, a drug hallucination and unimpaired sensory detection are two entirely different classes of experience. Additionally it would be unfair to simply lump unimpaired witnesses into the same group as drug users. However if one is successful at making someone think such a comparison is fair-minded ( when it's obviously not ), then that further erodes the credibility of the subject ( which appears to be the agenda of certain skeptics ).
Do ufologists believe that aliens abduct people by using parapscyhology powers (even sometimes levitation) ? do they believe that aliens somehow "erase" memories ? it's all supernatural skills, that's why aliens qualify to supernatural beings. Believing without evidene in supernatural things is one of the most important foundations of any religion.
I guess the answer to that question depends on which ufologist you talk to. They cannot all be lumped into the same basket any more reasonably than all doctors can be lumped into the same basket. Some are quacks, some are frauds, some are honest researchers trying to find answers. One thing that most ufologists will tend to agree on ( in my experience ) is that the phenomena leading to their interpretations exists. In other words, some people are experiencing what they genuinely believe to be the types of things you mention, even if those things may not be what's actually happening.
 
It appears that you're conflating the word origin for the term UFO ( e.g. from the acronym unidentified flying object - 1952 ) with the word's meaning ( e.g. alien craft, flying saucer ). That is a common mistake. To elucidate: The meanings of acronyms aren't always simply the same as the literal meaning of the words that form them, e.g. the word radar doesn't mean detecting radios and herding livestock. For an accurate definition of a word ( particularly acronyms ), the history and context must be taken into account. I wrote a rather extensive article on this issue for the USI website. To summarize: Based on analysis of the word history in combination with contemporary usage and dictionary definitions that use terms like "flying saucer" or "alien craft" as part of their definition, plus thesaurus synonyms for the word "ufo" or "UFO"; the word "ufo" or "UFO" is overwhelmingly used as label ( noun ) for alien craft, generically reffered to as flying saucers. Now that you know this, I'm sure you'll appreciate that intentionally equating a UFO with a simple unidentified object in the sky is misinformation.

UFO is 3 words abbreviation for "unidentified flying object". Now we can talk about definition, different organizations uses different explanations.

For example : USAF (United States Air Force) UFO -Anything that relates to any airborne object which by performance, aerodynamic characteristics, or unusual features does not conform to any presently known aircraft or missile type, or which cannot be identified as a familiar object.

Most important, in what context you are going to use UFO.

That depends on whether or not you're the one who experienced the event. In that case, a drug hallucination and unimpaired sensory detection are two entirely different classes of experience. Additionally it would be unfair to simply lump unimpaired witnesses into the same group as drug users. However if one is successful at making someone think such a comparison is fair-minded ( when it's obviously not ), then that further erodes the credibility of the subject ( which appears to be the agenda of certain skeptics ).
I'm not sure if we are talking about the same thing. What is your argument ?

I guess the answer to that question depends on which ufologist you talk to. They cannot all be lumped into the same basket any more reasonably than all doctors can be lumped into the same basket. Some are quacks, some are frauds, some are honest researchers trying to find answers. One thing that most ufologists will tend to agree on ( in my experience ) is that the phenomena leading to their interpretations exists. In other words, some people are experiencing what they genuinely believe to be the types of things you mention, even if those things may not be what's actually happening.
It is not hard to spot bad science in any field and destroy his opinion or work, every field has it's own fundamental laws (which don't change as time passes). For pseudoscience is a different story, it has no limits and laws.

Because there are no rules, in ufology majority interprets on how they feel or think in that moment. There are no scientific concrete to where start from or certain scietific methodology fo follow. Every ufologist has it's owns rules and can act without consequences. You don't need train, learn or graduate, you don't need scientific methodology, have work ethics, resposibility to community, pass exams or tests to become self proclaimed ufologist. That is why ufology can't get out of pseudoscience field and won't until someone actually publishes unquestionable evidence.
 
UFO is 3 words abbreviation for "unidentified flying object".
Not exactly. The word UFO began as an acronym, which is markedly different than a simple abbreviation. For a complete exposé I suggest you lookup the article on the USI site ( link in signature line ).
Because there are no rules, in ufology majority interprets on how they feel or think in that moment.
I find that approach to be rather subjective and self-serving. That's not to accuse you of endorsing that approach. It's a problem in the field that I find particularly irksome. In contrast I don't agree that opinion = truth even if everyone holds the same opinion.
There are no scientific concrete to where start from or certain scietific methodology fo follow. Every ufologist has it's owns rules and can act without consequences. You don't need train, learn or graduate, you don't need scientific methodology, have work ethics, resposibility to community, pass exams or tests to become self proclaimed ufologist.
I hear what you're saying but what is being overlooked is that truth ( correspondence with the facts ), and critical thinking can be applied to ufology the same as anything else. These tools can assist in the analysis of issues when material evidence is unavailable for scientific study. This is the method that I use when discussing issues in ufology, including the issue of what the word "UFO" or "ufo" means, and the result is a view that carries more weight than unsubstantiated or weakly substantiated opinions, regardless of how many others hold a weaker opinion. In other words. A false consensus belief in my view is worthless regardless of how many people believe it.


You've made an important point in quoting of one of the official USAF definitions, which clearly differentiates UFOs from mundane objects. And there's much more to it that that as well. As I already said: Based on analysis of the word history in combination with contemporary usage and dictionary definitions that use terms like "flying saucer" or "alien craft" as part of their definition, plus thesaurus synonyms for the word "ufo" or "UFO"; the word "ufo" or "UFO" is overwhelmingly used as label ( noun ) for alien craft, generically referred to as flying saucers.

So let's not perpetuate the idea that vague lights off in the distance are UFOs. They're not. They're just vague lights off in the distance.
That is why ufology can't get out of pseudoscience field and won't until someone actually publishes unquestionable evidence.
The issue of pseudoscience isn't connected to the issue of evidence. It's connected to specific types of claims, study, and presentation.
 
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Men in black locker scene does the job for me. It encapsulates the 'prison planet/cargo cult' experience for all humans facing unresolved outside interventions.


cargo-cult.jpg


If I wanted to somewhat shape or influence the evolution of a sentient race... I'd occasionally try to sprinkle it with some decode-able bacon.
 

Why Believing in Aliens Is Religion in Disguise | Michael Shermer

What are your thoughts on his opinion ?

It can be religion in disguise for some... but for rational peeps like 'yours truly', its a simple question of math. Our own solar system only formed 4 billion years ago (14 billion year context).
So... any civilization that appreciated our planet's potential for life and wanted to shape it's future or experiment with it had an opportunity to do so.... as we potentially will ourselves do onto other planets in the future.

Why?.... because we can.

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Not exactly. The word UFO began as an acronym, which is markedly different than an abbreviation. For a complete exposé I suggest you lookup the article on the USI site ( link in signature line ).

First of all, you are making a grammar mistake and false fact including "flying saucer" in UFO, only if you make an abbreviation it is possible to use more words from sentence
and it shorten to 3 letters. Best example would be : "i saw unidentified flying object shaped like saucer' - context can stand for UFO. An acronym is a stand-in for a string of words, usually an organization name, slogan, or something else equally wordy. Unlike abbreviations, they aren't shorter spellings of words—they're made up of the words' initials. I searched and did not find nothing like it in layman's terms, that suggests it is acronym not abbreviation besides your interpretation.

"Unidentified Flying Object, a title created by the USAF for an object that is typically airborne and doesn't appear to be a known natural or manmade object or phenomenon, or is the subject of a UFO report." From where did you get that ? Where USAF officially states that ?

I honestly hope, whole introduction of "Compendium of Ufology" was not your job.

I find that approach to be rather subjective and self-serving. That's not to accuse you of endorsing that approach. It's a problem in the field that I find particularly irksome. In contrast I don't agree that opinion = truth even if everyone holds the same opinion.
I'm still holding the same opinion on this one. Let's agree to disagree.


The issue of pseudoscience isn't connected to the issue of evidence. It's connected to specific types of claims, study, and presentation.
Emphasis is not on meaningful, controlled, repeatable scientific experiments. Instead it is on unverifiable eyewitness testimony, stories, tall tales. Genuine scientific literature is either ignored or misinterpreted. Pseudoscience shows an indifference to criteria of valid evidence. If it is not about issue of evidence, why certain pseudoscience branches, can't develop to science ?
 
I do not intend to answer for him, will comment only I on your thoughts.

Ufos exist (unidentified flying objects), there is no doubt about that. The only problem is that nobody has any indisputable evidence about fluttering cigars or flying saucers.

Sorry... this time the ball is in the other court. You need to debunk the 'indisputable evidence' that's now available.

We have a few documented 'tictacs' on gun camera film along with a couple of navy pilots that dream of flyin' em. Not to mention the matching radar tracking and multiple witnesses.

The demonstrated flight characteristics are unmatched by disclosed aircraft in the US inventory not to mention that we don't have the physics to actually explain the flight behavior. The demonstrated space/time displacement capabilities are a quantum leap from our meager 150 year flight experience. Based on the disclosure, an obvious conclusion would be: we're either witnessing a breakaway civilization (from earth) or we have long term visitors firmly and stealthily established here.

The shape of any flying object is irrelevant, the documented physical abilities beyond the current human comprehension of the laws of nature is the real focus of this phenomenon.

Regardless of who visits us, this disclosure brings in a new paradigm, new rules to decode. Without any technological perspective this paradigm would always end up in the 'angels and demons' basket.

IMHO, the first civilization able to decode the rules wins, so it's no wonder that this subject would be classified beyond the atom bomb. The interesting question is... why disclose that documented event now and through the TTSA initiative?

One possible reason could be that religious lobbies in the USA are strong enough to push the paradigm back into the 'angels and demons' basket and, while he still could, Luis Elizondo offered us the last rational glimpse of a subject that will be locked for at least 50 years. Seeing how the Supreme court of the USA is being shaped right now this becomes a very very safe bet.

Interview at 4:12 will give you best hint as to the real battle behind closed doors. (Hint: its a religious one)

 
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I honestly hope, whole introduction of "Compendium of Ufology" was not your job. I'm still holding the same opinion on this one. Let's agree to disagree.
Yes. The USI website is one I created. If you can create a better one, be my guest. It will only make the field a better place. In the meantime this has obviously become an argument ( debate ), and I'm not the sort to 'agree to disagree" in a debate. I value the Dialectic Method. Therefore if you can substantiate your position better than I have, I have the wherewithal to admit that I need to rethink my position, and what's more, will thank you for helping to improve our understanding of the issue. However at present, your position remains comparatively unsubstantiated and your objections aren't sufficient to outweigh the reasoning in the article.
Emphasis is not on meaningful, controlled, repeatable scientific experiments. Instead it is on unverifiable eyewitness testimony, stories, tall tales. Genuine scientific literature is either ignored or misinterpreted. Pseudoscience shows an indifference to criteria of valid evidence. If it is not about issue of evidence, why certain pseudoscience branches, can't develop to science ?
The issue of pseudoscience isn't connected to evidence because the various definitions of pseudoscience hinge on the idea that pseudoscience is something that either claims to be a science, or presents itself in a manner that leads people to believe it's scientifically valid, when in actual fact, it fails to meet the standards of the scientific establishment, particularly those of scientific skeptics. So the evidence itself might be perfectly good. But unless it's analysis is done in accordance with established scientific methodology, it doesn't count as being scientifically valid. Therefore pseudoscience is more about methods and presentation than evidence.

In other words, a real alien craft in the hands of analysts who think they're doing valid science, but fail to use established scientific methods to verify its authenticity will still produce pseudoscientific results. That is why I suggest that any scientific analysis be done by real scientists at arms-length from the field according to established scientific standards. That's not to say that
citizen science cannot contribute. It just needs to meet the standards of the scientists tasked with the formal scientific analysis.

Example: Suppose something assumed to be a ufo ( alien craft ) lands in a field someplace. The most that UFO investigators should attempt to do before any independent scientists get there is establish a perimeter and take pictures and notes. Anything else is likely to contaminate the scene leading to accusations that because of improper methodology, the evidence cannot be considered scientifically valid. From there, ufologists should focus on the responsible non-scientific presentation of the the various facts, opinions, and valid scientific results. In this way the scientific establishment and ufology can work side by side rather than in competition.

Anyway, this is getting off the topic of the thread, so perhaps you should carry on with more about Christians and Ufology.
 
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You need to debunk the 'indisputable evidence' that's now available.
I'm really not a debunker. You can try here Metabunk.

USI Calgary.
J. Randall Murphy, from Calgary Canada
I think we came to the point where we are going in circles, there is no ending. Since i did not have much time in last half year i've abandoned all news about ufo and ufology. Right now i'm reading about Luis Elizondo and that government project, also there is most recent famous UFO inccident. Anyway, i really enjoyed our talks from last week or two (don't remember when it started) ? Let's move on with our different opinions and see where it will take us.
 
I do not intend to answer for him, will comment only I on your thoughts.

Ufos exist (unidentified flying objects), there is no doubt about that. The only problem is that nobody has any indisputable evidence about fluttering cigars or flying saucers.


Psychedelic alien experiences or aliens in flying saucers with no evidence are in the same ballpark. Do ufologists believe that aliens abduct people by using parapscyhology powers (even sometimes levitation) ? do they believe that aliens somehow "erase" memories ? it's all supernatural skills, that's why aliens qualify to supernatural beings. Believing without evidene in supernatural things is one of the most important foundations of any religion.
That kinda odd, so your asserting that aliens are erasing memories rather then our own minds doing it, the model suggested by Freud, regarding screen memories. Dude your allegedly a psychologist are you not? Psedoscience , you need to be more logical Mr. Psychologist

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That kinda odd, so your asserting that aliens are erasing memories rather then our own minds doing it, the model suggested by Freud, regarding screen memories. Dude your allegedly a psychologist are you not? Psedoscience , you need to be more logical Mr. Psychologist

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Mr. Whatever,

Please, don't quote me when you write nonsense about me, keep it to yourself.
 
The upcoming episode with Greenfield is of some relevance to this thread. On the ATP I asked him about his connection to Gnosticism and that led us down a path to discussing the nature of reality and Christ. Gene derailed it because it seemed like he felt it was getting too far into religious territory. But Christ has more than one connection with ufology. I think Raël of the Raëlian Movement claimed he was taken onboard a UFO and transported to a planet where he met with Jesus and several other prophets and religious icons.
 
It's not really nonsense, iv watched as you have debated people including myself, and one thing always pops up"therefore psychology" or that's psedoscience, well whatever you say guy, thats an opinion and one i respect and even agree with in mqny caese,but you need to get your facts straight and your damn right I'm gonna call you out for it. Because not only is it me, but alot of other people you get real offensive with and you turn into a douche, infact you more or less insulted me a couple times, so I'll quote you as much as I'd like if we are gonna be a jerk, Mr.psychologist. I'm just stating some facts for you about the psychological nature of a human being

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Religion is ones choice and no one should push there own ideology instead listen and choose for yourself. The same in learning about the paranormal with some use frontloaded material entwined with their own theories on what the he'll causing the phenomena. Like others who experience odd encounters with label of paranormal it actions and its abilities to use camoflague and physical force does change your world view. Some theorist suggest co-creation while others suggest more sinister covert operators. Anything is possible in this World of learning and whatever it is "demon", fairies, ETH or unknown force its here .
 
The upcoming episode with Greenfield is of some relevance to this thread. On the ATP I asked him about his connection to Gnosticism and that led us down a path to discussing the nature of reality and Christ. Gene derailed it because it seemed like he felt it was getting too far into religious territory. But Christ has more than one connection with ufology. I think Raël of the Raëlian Movement claimed he was taken onboard a UFO and transported to a planet where he met with Jesus and several other prophets and religious icons.
Where can i find that episode ? Where should i look for ?


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:confused:
 
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