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Butch Witkowski: Re-Investigation summary and results

Deckland

Skilled Investigator
This is an audit of the 2011 investigation into Sigmund S. "Butch" Witkowski undertaken after certain possible shortcomings were discovered in the previous inquiry. To establish a stable chain of evidence and prevent future link rot, documents linked below are being archived via Harvard Law Library's perma.cc service. All updates to the audit will be posted in the OP only.

SUBJECT: Sigmund S. "Butch" Witkowski​

CLAIM 1

Claim:

Sigmund S. "Butch" Witkowski was not a law enforcement officer with the Caernarvon, Penn. Township Police
Status of investigation:
  • Media review - complete
  • Records request with Caernarvon Township - in progress
Review of past evidence:
A 2011 investigation presented a letter from the Municipal Police Officer Education and Training Commission (MPOETC) of Pennsylvania in which the director of the MPOETC, in response to an inquiry, said Witkowski was "never a certified police officer under the Municipal Police Officers' Education and Training Commission." This was used to support the claim that Witkowski was not a police officer. However, on further investigation, no police officer commissioned in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania prior to 18JUN1974 (see here and here) is required to be certified by the MPOETC (nor are they prevented from seeking certification). The MPOETC letter is, therefore, irrelevant and a red herring.
Summary:
  1. Page 23 of the 26FEB1976 issue of The Mercury (a daily newspaper in Pottstown, Penn.) reports on a "Cpl. Sigmund Witkowski" of the Caernarvon Township Police having made an arrest the previous day in an article headlined "Policeman Stops Auto, Finds Stolen Equipment."
Conclusion, PRELIMINARY:
Based on #1, the preliminary conclusion is that the 2011 claim may be incorrect.
Conclusion, FINAL:
PENDING

CLAIM 2

Claim:
Sigmund S. "Butch" Witkowski only served in the U.S. Marine Corps for two weeks
Status of investigation:
  • Media review - complete
  • Personnel records request with National Personnel Records Center - in progress
Review of past evidence:
No documents have been presented to support this claim.
Summary:
...
Conclusion, PRELIMINARY:
PENDING
Conclusion, FINAL:
PENDING

CLAIM 3

Claim:
Sigmund S. "Butch" Witkowski is a convicted criminal
Status of investigation:
  • Media review - complete
  • Pennsylvania Unified Judicial System lookup - complete
  • Charging sheet request from Lancaster Court of Common Pleas - in progress
  • PACER search - complete
Review of past evidence:
The previous inquiry only looked at the UJS records which confirm a Sigmund Witkowski (DOB 1947) was convicted of ten counts of Theft by Deception in 1995. No further information as to the nature of the crime was provided and positive connection to Sigmund S. "Butch" Witkowski was not established. While this is probably "Butch" Witkowski, a second point of connection needs to be made to ensure it is not a person with an identical name since Witkowski is a relatively common surname in Berks County (the current head of Caernarvon Township's fire department, in fact, is named Witkowski).
Summary:
  1. A Lancaster County Court of Common Pleas docket sheet shows a Sigmund S. Witkowski (DOB 1947) having been convicted of ten counts of Theft by Deception in 1995.
  2. A PACER database search did not discover any criminal convictions at the federal level, however, did find a bankruptcy filing (case 4:1996bk21487) by a Sigmund S. Witkowski of Stevens, Penn. in 1996 (registered aliases: "Auto Car Center," "Butch's Recon," "Butch Witkowski"). The bankruptcy was closed in 2000. Another bankruptcy filing by a Sigmund S. Witkowski of Tucson, Arizona - owner of Mountainview Signs and Graphics - was made in 1989 (case 4:1989bk03177). Both the 1989 and 1996 bankruptcies are of the same individual (identical social security numbers). This Sigmund S. Witkowski cannot be positively connected to the subject of this inquiry. While it may be the same person, an identical name is not proof of identical personage.
Conclusion, PRELIMINARY:
Based on #1, the preliminary conclusion is that the 2011 claim may be correct.
Conclusion, FINAL:
PENDING
 
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USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
Okay, sounds like you're doing a thorough job, but I don't see what a bankruptcy has to do with anything shady. That happens to a lot of good people who have fallen on harder times or made some bad financial decisions. So I could care less about that. @Decker apparently reviewed Wikowski's service history, so maybe you could request that he forward those to you.

I'm in no more of a position to verify your claims than anyone else's, but so far, if your facts are straight, then the MPOETC report would be irrelevant, and if that's the only evidence upon which to claim Witkowski never served as a police officer, then that claim must be called into question. However Don Ecker has also served and he is known for sticking-up for fellow officers ( in the armed forces or otherwise ) when they are legit. So for him not to come to Witkowski's defense tends to make me err on the side of caution.

Here's the Reddit link to a similar discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/UFOs/comments/1u8j8w
 
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Deckland

Skilled Investigator
You're right, the bankruptcy is irrelevant for verification of these claims. However, I came across it in my PACER database search and, in interest of full transparency, I'm not withholding anything.

This is an audit. Everything uncovered will be posted. (I have withheld posting scans of the PACER lookup since it contains partial SSNs, however, I have provided case numbers in case anyone wants to verify.)

I'm in no more of a position to verify your claims
Wrong.

You are in a position to verify each of them as I've provided solid sourcing. You can apply for access to PACER and lookup the case numbers I've provided. You can check the 26FEB1976 issue of The Mercury if you think I've forged that issue of the paper; I'm sure you have access to a library near you. Nothing posted, and nothing that will be posted, relies on secret information that a member of the general public could not access.

If you choose not to, that's your choice. And it's a perfectly legitimate one. But don't say I've made it impossible for you to check my work. Everything I've posted, and will post, can be reproduced and verified by anyone with a high school level education if you don't believe the authenticity of the documentary scans I'm uploading.
 
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USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
You are in a position to verify each of them as I've provided solid sourcing ...
As I said. I'm in no more of a position to verify. It's just not that important to me at this time. Still wondering what motivated you to take on this task?
 

USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
OP: This kind of hilariously autistic and pedantic post is an example of the pompous and self-important bullshit that plagues discussion of the paranormal. I'll just take one of your pretentious "points":

Really. Because the MPOETC site makes it VERY CLEAR that they DO certify those hired before 1974 saying that "individuals seeking certification must meet one of the following criteria":

This quote also strongly implies that at least some officers (or perhaps most) were REQUIRED to get such certification. You'll forgive me if I don't hold my breath for your sacred FINAL conclusions which I am sure that you'll type in the same faux-official style? I'm also sure you won't make the same kind of blunders there.

Just as my way of signing off, I'll say that this forum is dead precisely because of worthless input such as that offered by J. Randall Murphy above.
Geeze, nice to see you too Lance. I've noticed a lot of other forums have become inactive as well. I suppose it's because I never posted on them, so either way, it's gotta be my fault. Right Lance? If you have something to say please try to keep it constructive. If you can possibly manage that, you're welcome to come back and post whatever content you feel is relevant. We need friendly & constructive skeptics.
 
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Deckland

Skilled Investigator
Still wondering what motivated you to take on this task?
I already answered you once, but if you want me to retype it for emphasis I'm happy to oblige.

The Todd Sees "case" is one of the most vile instances of the the real-world consequences of Ufological obsession. It has primarily been promoted by two people, one of whom is Butch Witkowski. It can easily be discredited by highlighting the questionable background of its promoters. But only if done so accurately. If done inaccurately it only reinforces the veracity of the "case" in the mind of its believers.
 

Deckland

Skilled Investigator
lancemoody said:
OP: This kind of hilariously autistic and pedantic post is an example of the pompous and self-important bullshit that plagues discussion of the paranormal. I'll just take one of your pretentious "points":

Really. Because the MPOETC site makes it VERY CLEAR that they DO certify those hired before 1974 saying that "individuals seeking certification must meet one of the following criteria":

This quote also strongly implies that at least some officers (or perhaps most) were REQUIRED to get such certification. You'll forgive me if I don't hold my breath for your sacred FINAL conclusions which I am sure that you'll type in the same faux-official style? I'm also sure you won't make the same kind of blunders there.
Nothing you've posted contradicts what I've said.

Here's the link to what you posted: Municipal Police Officer Certification

Act 120 requires MPOETC certification for any police officer commissioned in Pennsylvania after 18JUN1974. It neither prevents nor requires certification of grandfathered officers. Indeed, if a grandfathered officer were going to lateral transfer to another department he would almost certainly need certification as a condition of the hiring agency.

It is highly doubtful Witkowski was ever employed by an agency other than the four-cop Caernarvon police and ergo would ever have had reason to pursue a certification he was not required to obtain. We know he was employed by Caernarvon PD in 1976 and, by 1989 at the latest (and probably well before), he was living in Arizona based on the bankruptcy filing that was (probably) his.

This isn't "pedantic." This is basic attention to detail. This is basic investigatory competence. Waving your arms in the air and yelling "close enough!" is how the slipshod, ham-fisted original investigation got to where it is. Yelling "close enough - you're just being pedantic!" is the rallying cry of Quantum Mystics when faced with actual science.
 

USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
I already answered you once, but if you want me to retype it for emphasis I'm happy to oblige.

The Todd Sees "case" is one of the most vile instances of the the real-world consequences of Ufological obsession. It has primarily been promoted by two people, one of whom is Butch Witkowski. It can easily be discredited by highlighting the questionable background of its promoters. But only if done so accurately. If done inaccurately it only reinforces the veracity of the "case" in the mind of its believers.
Thanks. I missed the connection there. I don't pay any attention to Witkowski so I'm not aware of what his role is in the story.
 

USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
This isn't "pedantic." This is basic attention to detail ...
That's just @lancemoody. He's picked up a few bad habits from the arch-skeptic side of the fence. If he could just stick to the objective and constructive, he'd probably have an easier time getting through to people. You two might even make a good team. He outed Phil Imbrogno's fake credentials, and he values truth. That's why I'd be fine with him participating here again more often if we could just manage to stay friendly and fair-minded in our debates.
 

Deckland

Skilled Investigator
That's just @lancemoody.He outed Phil Imbrogno's fake credentials
Ah, understood. Bulls do get mad when other Bulls enter the pen. This is Ufology, though; I'm sure there are enough Heifers for both of us to impregnate.

It was actually kind-of funny. He PM'ed me and said something like "Don't you know who I am? GOOGLE MY NAME!" I obliged and the first thing that came up was his (?) LinkedIn profile that said he was a call center rep at something called 24/7 InTouch. So I'm not sure, exactly, how I was supposed to react but whatever way I did was apparently the wrong way because it made him even more hysterical that I didn't realize he worked at the 24/7 InTouch call center (if that's what I was supposed to have known; I'm still confused).
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
As I write this, it’s 2:30 AM in Arizona.

I think it’s about time we drop this thread unless someone has something significant to contribute.

I’m sure that, in the not-too-distant future, Butch Witkowski still won’t help us solve the UFO thing.

Of course, Don Ecker is welcome to chime in before I put this thread to rest.
 

wwkirk

Paranormal Adept
As I write this, it’s 2:30 AM in Arizona.

I think it’s about time we drop this thread unless someone has something significant to contribute.

I’m sure that, in the not-too-distant future, Butch Witkowski still won’t help us solve the UFO thing.

Of course, Don Ecker is welcome to chime in before I put this thread to rest.
I can't fathom why you would want to close this thread. It may be a controversial topic, but it's not offensive. Deckland has steadily contributed new information even if I am not convinced by it. What's wrong with having threads that don't interest everyone? Those who are not interested can just ignore them.

Think about it, Gene. You're playing into the hands of people who say you are killing this forum.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
People who say that about me are a little shy of having their full marbles.

I just think Witkowski isn’t worth the attention. And some of the comments are getting too personal.

But if it can continue in a civil fashion, and keeps some people out of trouble, fine with me.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
Speaking of call centers: One of my riders the other day works at the AT&T Customer Retention center. That's where they try to bribe a customer into sticking with the service when they want to cancel.

His attitude? 85% of the people he talks to just want something for nothing.

Anyway, welcome back Lance.
 

Deckland

Skilled Investigator
he doesn't address the duplicity I outlined above since
Interesting. I did write a detailed post explaining how off base you are but it was removed.

Between the selective removal and editing of my comments by the site admin and the threats to shut down the thread it seems there's no point in continuing to post results of the audit of the Witko investigation here. It will be edited to ensure the authors of the original slipshod investigation save face.

I'll take this off site. If anyone sees this post before it's removed and would like to continue following the additional doc pulls PM me and I'll send you a link, at least until my account is deactivated by Gene.

Bye.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
You are going overboard. I didn't threaten anything. I said that I was thinking of closing the thread because it was going off the rails.

It takes a lot more before we pull a membership.

Just go on please.
 

Deckland

Skilled Investigator
Here is the preserved version of the inquiry results, which will be updated in real-time as new documents become available:


To clarify, the version in this thread has been deprecated to ensure security of the archival record. Some content in it has been modified by persons other than me. Nothing in it should be presumed accurate.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
To be fair: We don't delete content willy nilly to hide facts.
But when a thread gets a little personal or otherwise violates our Terms and Rules, we will react appropriately. Indeed, we are far more lenient than some forums.

That said, the content you've posted here will remain as it is.

With minor edits, our Terms are identical to other forums that use XenForo as the front end. But some forum admins don't care about hate speech, lies and defamation, even though they use the same basic Terms.

That's why some forums will not be mentioned here, because they do not deserve any publicity.
 

Gene Steinberg

Forum Super Hero
Staff member
And one more thing:

When the questions about Witkowski's credibility and credentials arose back in 2011, I invited him to come on the show and clarify the issues so we'd have both sides of the picture.

He declined to do so. In the years since then, I heard very little about it, until I read that he had more or less resurfaced.

Here's the email I received on New Year's Day 2011. Make of it what you will:

Hello Gene
Don't bother calling. As this is the second time my research has been challenged and my background in the last three years and last month my family was pestered by someone regarding cases I've never worked on. I've made up my mind I'll take the hits but will not allow my family to be badgered by some jerk. This research will continue but on a more private basis.

Thank you for your time in this matter
Butch


Note: Just to make this clear, I have no skin in the game. If he's real, that's fine. If he's not, then he should be regarded appropriately.
 

Deckland

Skilled Investigator
And one more thing:

When the questions about Witkowski's credibility and credentials arose back in 2011, I invited him to come on the show and clarify the issues so we'd have both sides of the picture.

He declined to do so. In the years since then, I heard very little about it, until I read that he had more or less resurfaced.

Here's the email I received on New Year's Day 2011. Make of it what you will:

Hello Gene
Don't bother calling. As this is the second time my research has been challenged and my background in the last three years and last month my family was pestered by someone regarding cases I've never worked on. I've made up my mind I'll take the hits but will not allow my family to be badgered by some jerk. This research will continue but on a more private basis.

Thank you for your time in this matter
Butch


Note: Just to make this clear, I have no skin in the game. If he's real, that's fine. If he's not, then he should be regarded appropriately.
Clearly his biography is a mix of reality and unreality. The 2011 investigation got some things right and others wrong. Both the Watchers and the Watchmen are to blame here. The audit uncovering what occurred in 2011 will continue to be updated as documents become available at the Tumblr site where it can be independently secured from funny business or a sudden 2 a.m. deletion.
 


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