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BBC: The Great Global Warming Swindle

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musictomyears said:
Yup, that's basically the line of thinking people like Alex Jones propose. Isn't it rather strange that governments and corporations suddenly jump onto the global warming, scare-mongering bandwagon, after uniformly rejecting the idea for decades? It is as if they met up and decided, "Hey, let's not fight this idea anymore, let's use it to our advantage. Let's use it for increasing taxes and surveillance, and for sanctioning the odd "rogue" regime we didn't like anyway. Let's make people feel bad about using energy, let's make them feel really guilty and depended on our advice. Let's tell them we are going to save the world."
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That's pretty much my view.

All I see in this 'hurry to stamp out CO2' is protection of western 'markets' - don't get me wrong, I'm all for reduction of polution and those other 'green' activities, it just makes me sick to how they ignored this issue for decades until now when it suits them to try and stop China over-taking them as the worlds fasting developing nation.

Now, I'm not entirely stupid - if China does 'upset the apple cart' by under-cutting western manufacturers then it could trigger economic problems for the rest of us. But that danger is 'market forces' not 'global warming', but they wouldn't be able to count on the 'green' lobby for support if they admitted that they're more concerned about their bank balances than the environment...so instead let's say that we're 'saving the planet'.

Oh well, there's nothing more for me to say about this issue. I'll just sit back and watch the world events unfold - World War 3 by 2012, I reckon. Hey, this scare-mongering is really quite fun...

BTW, did you know that a human exhales about 1kg of CO2 per day - so the population of the planet exhales 6 million metric tons of CO2 *per day* or about 2.2 billion metric tons *a year*. Wow, how are we gonna reduce that one, especially since the population is growing year on year? It would suggest a 'coach potato' is 'friendlier' to the environment than say someone who jogs every day. Cool - I'm sooooooo 'green' :)
 
So it seems most of us agree,there is a need to be concerned about polluting the planet,(even though the biggest producers of CO2 are the oceans) but the Earth has been going through this process for millions of years,ice age's and tropical climates,it will happen again and there's not much we can do about that apart from adapt which I'm sure we will.
 
AJ38 said:
So it seems most of us agree,there is a need to be concerned about polluting the planet,(even though the biggest producers of CO2 are the oceans) but the Earth has been going through this process for millions of years,ice age's and tropical climates,it will happen again and there's not much we can do about that apart from adapt which I'm sure we will.
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Well, the alternative theory to the human-CO2 one is that increased solar activity warms the oceans which then (over a long period of time) release vast quantites of CO2. When the solar activity dies down to 'normal' levels the oceans cool again and *absorb* an equally large amount of CO2...

...there's very clear 'proof' of this happening in the ice core data. But it's an 'inconvenient truth' to the 'band-wagon' scientists, so they have taken the data for the last 30 years, which shows a slight warming in global temperatures and continued the line upwards and stated that we're heading for meltdown and it's all our fault.
 
It is rather heartbreaking and frustrating, all this. Humans seem to alternate between extremes, the concept of harmony is still pretty revolutionary to many.

And it isn't as if real, viable alternatives haven't been available for a long time. I noticed there are some threads about free energy on this forum. I have had some limited, personal exposure to very strange goings on, behind the scenes, stuff the general public will never hear about. All the public ever hears is that there was a need for sacrifice, new taxes, ridiculous carbon trading schemes (as if one could trade one's environmental sins for money), and dangerous "alternatives", such as nuclear power. The reality is, we could all live and prosper, with energy available in abundance. But try telling that the green lobby. Ugh!

BTW, congratulations for being so green! ;)
 
Oh the VANITY of human beings.

I don’t think that “Global Warming” is going is really the question. It’s the point about not only the reasons to why the issue is going on and more importantly the ideas to help resolve the problem.

The earth is heating up and it’s a normal cycle of our planet. The fact that the notion that human beings cause such a great effect on this planet we live on proves two things to me:

1.) Human beings are the most vain creature on earth.

2.) People enjoy getting lied to.

So let’s just say all the bunk science is right and we are causing this “global warming” and it’s not just a normal life cycle of our entire planet. So what is going to help this, what is going to save us? A global carbon tax. CO2 tax. Al Gore and the UN can tell you the boogeyman (we the people) are the cause of this but to try an spin the reasons to help us out of this situation is a GLOBAL carbon tax is the answer should send up a bright, red flag to any person who still has the ability to think for themselves. Stop being fools fellow human beings….
 
cottonzway said:
Oh the VANITY of human beings.

I don't think that "Global Warming" is going is really the question. It's the point about not only the reasons to why the issue is going on and more importantly the ideas to help resolve the problem.

The earth is heating up and it's a normal cycle of our planet. The fact that the notion that human beings cause such a great effect on this planet we live on proves two things to me:

1.) Human beings are the most vain creature on earth.

2.) People enjoy getting lied to.

So let's just say all the bunk science is right and we are causing this "global warming" and it's not just a normal life cycle of our entire planet. So what is going to help this, what is going to save us? A global carbon tax. CO2 tax. Al Gore and the UN can tell you the boogeyman (we the people) are the cause of this but to try an spin the reasons to help us out of this situation is a GLOBAL carbon tax is the answer should send up a bright, red flag to any person who still has the ability to think for themselves. Stop being fools fellow human beings....
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Have you read any of the previous posts in this thread? :confused:
 
cottonzway said:
.....The fact that the notion that human beings cause such a great effect on this planet we live on proves two things to me:
1.) Human beings are the most vain creature on earth.....
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That statement proves to me your delusional..
Human power to "heal" ecosytems is MEAK but our power to destroy is great.
Humans cause a huge effect on the planet (mainly) because of overpopulation. I'm not going to talk to the CO2 side of this but the human footprint is HUGE. Go take a look at google earth. We have raped and reshaped a very large portion of the surface of this planet in a microcosm of time humans have destroyed 42% of rain forests which had reached that size over tens of thousands of years.
 
The Hawk said:
That statement proves to me your delusional..
Human power to "heal" ecosytems is MEAK but our power to destroy is great.
Humans cause a huge effect on the planet (mainly) because of overpopulation. I'm not going to talk to the CO2 side of this but the human footprint is HUGE. Go take a look at google earth. We have raped and reshaped a very large portion of the surface of this planet in a microcosm of time humans have destroyed 42% of rain forests which had reached that size over tens of thousands of years.
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Are humans not part of the eco-system, then?

Do a plague of locusts sit around and discuss 'green' issues?
 
I understand your point. Though regardless of what the word actually means or doesn't; these semantics probably won't help get a message across.

"..dynamic and interrelating complex of plant and animal communities.."

Even a city is an ecosystem but it's so vastly different in scope and structure than one of the Earths natural (nonhuman influenced) ecosystems. Many of them evolved over hundreds of thousands or millions of years with a host of species interdependent on each other.
 
The Hawk said:
Even a city is an ecosystem but it's so vastly different in scope and structure than one of the Earths natural (nonhuman influenced) ecosystems. Many of them evolved over hundreds of thousands or millions of years with a host of species interdependent on each other.
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Well, you see, this is where my 'problem' lies - it suits the 'green' lobby to separate 'us' from everything else on the planet.

Do we have no positive effects on the environment?

Do you agree that some forest fires occur naturally and that a lot more forests would be wiped out if *we* hadn't stepped in with fire-breaks and fire-fighters?

Do you agree that a lot of vegetation wouldn't exists unless *we* had irrigated the land?

Are we not a product of nature? Will nature not find a way of balancing out our impact?
 
Rick Deckard said:
Do you agree that a lot of vegetation wouldn't exists unless *we* had irrigated the land?

Are we not a product of nature? Will nature not find a way of balancing out our impact?
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We'll probably get another ice age, or a comet impact, or a plague, or some very hungry aliens touching down in Central Park... Nature will find a way.

But you surely are aware that the impact of human activity on Earth has been, so far, nothing short of disastrous. Irrigation, for example, is only necessary because humans cut down most of the thick forests that used to cover all continents. Europe in its entirety was covered with forests, so was Africa, New Zealand, and so on. People, from the time of their arrival, started chopping trees for firewood, and later for building houses and boats. Spain, for example, and Italy, were completely covered with trees, which were later used to build the infamous fleets. New Zealand Kauri trees were used to build much of San Francisco.

To all intents and purposes, humans are a right pest. We only have a chance of survival as a species, if we recognise this fact, and change great many of our habits, and general outlook on life.
 
Rick Deckard said:
Well, you see, this is where my 'problem' lies - it suits the 'green' lobby to separate 'us' from everything else on the planet.

Do we have no positive effects on the environment?

Do you agree that some forest fires occur naturally and that a lot more forests would be wiped out if *we* hadn't stepped in with fire-breaks and fire-fighters?

Do you agree that a lot of vegetation wouldn't exists unless *we* had irrigated the land?

Are we not a product of nature? Will nature not find a way of balancing out our impact?
Click to expand...

RD,

Some thoughts regarding your post...

- Humans are self-centered viruses with shoes. The idea that we have a "positive effect" on the environment makes me chuckle - we use this planet as a pantry, playground and toilet. Take a drive through Elizabeth, New Jersey, and show me where we've done good to the Earth.

- The cycle of fires in the forests existed before we got here, and will be here after we're gone.

- Our irrigation of the land is to our own ends - I'll go out on a limb, and say that the lushness and diversity of the flora of this planet have decreased since humans began their stay here. Mono-culture crops are placing much of the plant life on this planet in jeopardy, and that's directly related to our activities in trying to influence nature in a way that fulfills economic agendas exclusively.

- We are indeed a product of nature, and when humans become too troublesome for this planet, the self-regulating systems of nature will get rid of us in a jiffy.

Human vanity will be our downfall.

dB
 
Rick Deckard said:
Have you read any of the previous posts in this thread? :confused:
Click to expand...

Honestly, only skimmed it. I was just giving my opinion on how vain humans are and how they are willing to get scammed.
 
I just watched The Great Global Warming Swindle and it was extremely ratrional and informative, not even close to being as propagandistic as Gore's movie. It even has members of the IPCC responisble for that UN report speaking in opposition to the idea the human CO2 is causing global warming. I'm listening to these scientists, it is the sun that actually causes global warming acting in cycles. Its not our fault, im not falling for this guilt complex.

Pollution should be curbed, and all efforts should be made to be less dependent upon oil and all that, but that doesnt have to do with global warming.
 
cottonzway said:
Honestly, only skimmed it. I was just giving my opinion on how vain humans are and how they are willing to get scammed.
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Yep, I agree with you there, which is why I was puzzled by your post - it looked like you were 'putting us all straight' when the reality is that some of us are in total agreement with you and had previously posted as much. :)
 
David Biedny said:
RD,

Some thoughts regarding your post...

- Humans are self-centered viruses with shoes. The idea that we have a "positive effect" on the environment makes me chuckle - we use this planet as a pantry, playground and toilet. Take a drive through Elizabeth, New Jersey, and show me where we've done good to the Earth.

- The cycle of fires in the forests existed before we got here, and will be here after we're gone.

- Our irrigation of the land is to our own ends - I'll go out on a limb, and say that the lushness and diversity of the flora of this planet have decreased since humans began their stay here. Mono-culture crops are placing much of the plant life on this planet in jeopardy, and that's directly related to our activities in trying to influence nature in a way that fulfills economic agendas exclusively.

- We are indeed a product of nature, and when humans become too troublesome for this planet, the self-regulating systems of nature will get rid of us in a jiffy.

Human vanity will be our downfall.

dB
Click to expand...

Bill Hicks or Carlin for president please. Bill's dead and will do a better job than the current viruses in office:) "We're viruses with shoes, and I can prove it on an etch a sketch".
 
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