Abductions, Ghosts and Sleep Paralysis

[Hoffmeister]

So when I was a very young lad perhaps 13 or 14, our teacher was telling us a story about how he saw a ghost at the end of his bed once. Now at the time i didnt really give it much thought, but I do remember thinking how odd it was that almost everyone who see's a ghost always happens to be in bed. Indeed one of my friends at the time said he rolled over in his bed only to be confronted with the contorted face of a screaming woman.
Anyway, i barely gave it another thought for years. Then one day, probably when I was about 18, I was lying in bed and I felt a sharp pain in my right leg. I sat bolt up and as i looked at my leg a sort of contorted ghost like shape was emerging from my leg and screaming at me in the most horrific way, then all of a sudden it was gone. Bizzarely as soon as it was gone I went almost instantaneously from sitting bolt upright to lying flat on my back. It was truly the most terrifying experience I have ever had and I was 100% sure that I was awake at the time. It literally toook me about 30 minutes before I could move I was so scared.

However, I like to think of myself as a grounded person, and despite what i experienced, I put it down to the fact that I must have been in a wierd state where I was both awake and asleep at the same time, and then basically dreamed whilst being awake.

This theory of mine was further backed up when I had a similar experience a month or two later, only this time i was lying on my back awake, when suddenly the door flew open, light burst in to the room and I could see two greys standing at the door (it was kind of like the abductions in the Steven Spielberg series 'Taken' although this was before I had seen it). I turned onto my left in horror to look at them but then the next thing I knew they were gone and I was instantaneously lying on my back again.

So I thought to myself 'What are the odds of me seeing an Alien and a ghost within a few months?'...... very slim of course. Soon after that I read an article in the paper about Sleep paralysis (you will know about it if you have seen the Peter Jennings UFO documentary) whereby after doing tests scientists have basically claimed/discovered that most ghost sighting and Alien abductions are actually people experiencing what I did.

Now I don't mean to offend anybody, but I have to say 99% of people who think they have been abducted by aliens are just suffering from the same thing.
What do others think on this subject?

 

[Siani]

I suspect a lot of sightings of entities are down to witnesses being in an altered state of consciousness, due to the effects of sleep. But I don't think anyone can quantify exactly how many entity encounters are the result of lucid dreams, sleep paralysis, etc. Whether it's 99% or 0.9%, we simply don't have access to enough relevant data to be able to reach such a conclusion.

What about people who witness entities when fully awake? I've seen an apparition whilst wide awake - I was walking through a student house I used to live in, in the middle of the afternoon, when I saw her, and in fact, initially mistook her for a member of the household, when I saw her from the corner of my eye. Then, she vanished! Several of the other students at the house also saw this female apparition.

What about people who encounter non-human entities, who end up with scars, injuries, etc? I know it's possible to injure yourself in your sleep, and that some people may be less than honest about the source of their injuries. But some scars suffered by apparent abduction victims, seem a little too hard to explain away. That said, hypnogogic and hypnopompic hallucinations have probably been the source of many an entity sighting.

 

[Hoffmeister]

Oh dont get me wrong, when i said 99% i didnt really mean it as a hard fact figure, more a figure of speech. I'm also not saying that all ghost and abductions are down to sleep paralysis.
Once when I was about 15, me and my friend were walking down the stairs at my parents house. As we turned the corner to go down the second flight of stairs I saw someone walk past the door in my parents room (which is at the top of the stairs, to my right at the time). I looked at my friend and he was white as a sheet and said something to the effect of "f&*k me! did you see that?". He said that before I even mentioned anything so I know he saw it.
I still don't believe in ghosts and at the time I put it down to perhaps some sort of reflection of light which out of the corner of our eyes fooled us into thinking someone walked past.
Its interesting how you said you saw someone out of the corner of your eye as exactly the same happened to me...
I'm not saying I have all the answers or anything, it was merely a conversation piece. Listening to the people describe their alien abductions on the Peter Jennings show, they were almost identical to what happened to me.

 

[Siani]

Yeah, I know what you mean about figures of speech. The apparition I saw was initially glimpsed from the corner of my eye. I then turned and saw it full-on. She had her back to me, was quite tall, shoulder length brown, curly hair, and was dressed in some kind of dark blue/navy-colored jumpsuit type garment, which looked like work clothes or possibly some kind of uniform.

If only we did have all the answers, eh? Then again, I guess the fun comes from not having them .

 

[Ally]

If it is the Peter Jennings show you were talking about was first aired a few years ago I was not impressed.

When I was in the hospital for my tranplants I was given a drug that could make you hallucinate which I did. I saw about twelve peoole around my bed and a nurse. I watched as the people started to disappear one aby one except the nurse who was actually there. I was expecting her to disappear but instead she said are you OK. This did not freak me out but then again I had many drugs in my system.

I also have retina damage so sometimes very distant objects look like other things until I get closer to them. Your brain can and does make images. I have also seen images upon waking some of them not that pleasant.


Where I am going with this is that when I am confronted or interacting with another being/ghost/ET whatever the experience is quite different. When something grabs your feet and touched your hand and there is a distinct presence this feels real. I also have some scars,most have faded but a few are slightly visable and one scoop mark on my ankle that is quite viable that has been there for 10 years.

 

[Hoffmeister]

hm... i dont understand your point fully. Are you saying that you have been abducted by aliens and seen real ghosts? Sorry if i'm being stupid i just don't quite understand what you're getting at.
As for the Peter Jennings show, i personally thought it was excellent. I guess it depends where you sit/stand in relation to the fence. I am very skeptical about the topic but believe there definately have been visits (i've seen a flying triangle myself) but i am very skeptical about Roswell, crashed saucers, abductions and major government coverups (although they obviously arent telling us everything). All I know is that the sleep paralysis episodes i had seemed as real as anything, not like dreams at all, and I was filled with absolute terror.

I don't mean to offend anybody who thinks they have had a real abduction, and its not a personal attack on anyone, but when i go through any UFO topic in my mind I always try to use 'Occams Razor' - "All other things being equal (in this case no conclusive proof on either side), the simplest solution is the best."
The simplest solution for me is that people are suffering from sleep paralysis and are building other thoughts and co-incidences in the heads.... rather than they are being abducted by Aliens from another world/dimension/time.

On the other hand, in recent weeks I have started to think that the occams razor theory is now becoming almost proof that we are being visited because if there are billions of galaxies, with billions of stars, most of which have planets around them (see my thread in the other forums http://forum.theparacast.com/the-qu...ettle-the-zeta-riticuli-debate-forever-t2474/), many of which may be billions of years older than ours, it seems pretty simple and straight forward that they will have conquered the frontier of space (since the human race has conquered al other frontiers to date) and be whizzing around all over the place.

Its probably suitable for another topic really but I'm also starting to think that some UFO's might be just humans from the future.... it would explain why they dont really want to be seen.

Anyway, as you can see, i'm ranting again so i'll stop now

 

[Siani]

I guess the possibilities are endless. I often wonder if UFOs aren't, in fact, craft as such, but devices that enable beings to hop from one dimension to another. Who knows? I think some perverse part of me enjoys the not knowing, so the mystery can endure.

 

[Ally]

Hoffmeister,
You weren't being offensive. I have had several different types of paranormal phenomena. I have had the kind of classic abduction scene as well as felt ghosts. I do not know who or what the beings are in the abduction scenario. If all of these types of phenonena can be products of the mind, that is a possiblitiy too, then we have very powerful minds that we don't understand very well.

My earlier point that aparently didn't come across very well was that, at least to me and other experiencers, the difference between cetain kinds of known mind images such as hallucinations vs true experiences is qualitative. You said sleep paralysis feels very real as well. That is a good point but that does not disprove the abduction pheneomena to me. Does sleep parlaysis leave marks, cause PTSS, cause physiological changes? Have you ever woken up with you underwear and night cloths insideout or backwards from sleep paralysis?

 

[Hoffmeister]

Where I am going with this is that when I am confronted or interacting with another being/ghost/ET whatever the experience is quite different. When something grabs your feet and touched your hand and there is a distinct presence this feels real. I also have some scars,most have faded but a few are slightly visable and one scoop mark on my ankle that is quite viable that has been there for 10 years.

Oh just regarding this, it felt pretty damn real to me to. The pain in my leg I mentioned when the apparition came out was still there for about 30 minutes after the incident, i could hardly walk.
I am really just playing devils advocate here because thats the way my mind works. If anyone says they have been abducted, i never call them a liar or dellusional. But i do base every opinion i make solely on a non-personal basis using the most likely facts.
One person may have put their clothes on inside out before they went to bed without knowing it and then had a case of sleep paralysis, that is still a more simple explanation than alien beings. Hell i went to the pub last night with a load of mates and only noticed 3 hours into the night that i had my leather jacket on insde out!! LOL, safe to say i felt rather silly.
Anyway, as I said, I'm not saying i dont believe you if you say you have been abducted, and its certainly nothing personal.... but i live by the rule that when you're talking about the biggest revelation ever in the human race.... my brain just tells me that I need nothing short of 100% proof for me to be a full believer. That and the fact that the simplest answer has the highest percentage chance of being the correct one...

 

[Ally]

Oh and just regarding this, it felt pretty damn real to me to. The pain in my leg I mentioned when the apparition came out was still there for about 30 minutes after the incident, i could hardly walk.

Why do you discount that it could have been a ghost /entity or have you?

 

[Hoffmeister]

Why do you discount that it could have been a ghost /entity or have you?

Well really because of the reasons explained in the original post.
1. The chances of me being attacked (or whatever it was) by a ghost and having aliens bust in to my room in a matter of months are just too slim for me.
2. Following this, and using Ockhams Law - The simplest answer is most likely to be the correct one - its a much simpler answer that I was just having sleep paralysis, and that perhaps the ghost one was started by the fact that I already had a pain in my leg from some other non-mystical reason (like i banged it in my sleep for e.g.) and this caused me to awake from deep sleep, inducing a case of sleep paralysis.

One thing I cannot stress enough though was how scary the incidents (particularly the ghost one) were, i was literally nearly in tears and i'm usually not that easily shaken.

 

[Ally]

I guess we just view this differently. I think that having two paranormal events very close together makes more sence to me than sleep paralysis.

Many people who experience UFO's, ET's whatever you want to call them ALSO experience other kinds of paranormal events. It is almost like one opens the door to the other IMO.

As far as how scared you were during your leg experience I actually do understand.

 

[Hoffmeister]

Yeah i guess you're right. The world would be a lot more boring if we all thought the same things and the discussion boards would be a lot quieter!

 

[Anubis]

[EDIT]

Sorry... For whatever reason I did not see Ally's post above when I hit reply. I basically said the same thing she did, that the events could have been directly related and it is your interpretation/memories of them that is a little askew.

 

[Vomitor]

Interesting things here for sure. I'm assuming this is the official sleep paralysis related thread on the forums? I can add a little experience of my own, which although not including any entities still scared the H. out of me.

It was about 4 years ago, a bit after new years and i was in an really stressy period of my life. I was just a few days away from my 1st major exam at university, after a long break since high school, so everything was new and epectations a bit high. I remember i fell asleep to a particular record, of which i dont remember the name of the band right now but it will come back to me...but it was some kind of dark ambient/atmospheric S&M soundtrack kinda thing (not into SM, just always liked to fall asleep to ambient music back then, and this happened to be some darkroom soundtrack thing). At some point during the night i suddenly, i "wake up" to a flash of bluish-white light coming through the blinds of my bedroom filling the whole room in light so i could see details of things almost perfectly. There is also a very eerie kind of droning sound, while at the same time i hear the sound of bottles and other stuff rolling around my apartment, as though it was a ship on high sea going side to side throwing things around. Then i hear a simultaneously a very light female voice, almost whispering, and a deep dark growling sound, that most people would probably understand as what a classic demon sounds like in a horror movie...really damn creepy, not unlike the voice in the end of the old Entity movie. At the same time i was struggling to get out of bed and get away from it, but of course i was paralyzed and couldnt. But i really felt that i had to do this or something bad would happen.

Its impossible to say how long this struggle lasted, but when i finally woke op to my everyday state i could immediately feel that i had been tense for a pretty long time, cause my muscles and jaw was sore from clenching together. I noticed immediately that as soon as i closed my eyes again, i was beginning to get sucked right into it, and had i wanted then i probably could have lived out a full fledged episode with all kinds of weird creatures and whatnot that many others have experienced. But it was so damn scary just to think about, that i just kicked out of bed and stayed up for the rest of the night. Interestingly, the cd i was hearing was on repeat, so it had been playing through a great deal of times during my sleep! Im sure that this had some part to play in why i ended up like this.

The question for me since this, has been - in realtion to abduction scenarios -is this some kind of dream state that the "aliens" can feed upon, induce or both? Or is sleep paralysis just a totally isolated phenomena. Or maybe in family with each other, like a camel and a lama is...similar but different. I dont know it, but perhaps there just exists this state between dream and waking which we can access if we want, and which others who cant appear to us in "the real world" can access as well, or even induce. I realize of course that these arent new thoughts, but they are always intersting to think about...if perhaps i was a victim of some kind of intrusion taht i somehow managed to stop. In any case, i really dont want to experience it again, and i really really emphasize with people who have these experiences, whatever they are, in extreme degrees.

But interesting, it sure is

 

[Tom From Hong Kong]

Hoffmeister & Vomitor, I personally do think there is something genuine to the abduction phenomena given the facts reported by credible researchers (e.g., consistency of accounts across diverse cultures, same symbols/writing observed on craft, third party eyewitness viewings of UFO's at the time of abductions, awakening the following morning with other people's clothing on/your clothing inside out, physical markings in odd or structured patterns). Also, perhaps some select group of people are 'better tuned' to observing other dimensional phenomena such as ghosts, and perhaps this is heightened in/around the time of sleep for whatever reasons. As powerful as some claim the human mind is, I doubt I could make my own leg ache in a particular spot for 30 minutes just but thinking about it. Ultimately, your gut instinct will tell you what is likely going on, not trying to find a reason that fits pre-conceived notions (. . . . my gut generally leads me to the right answer while my brain plays catch up).

 

[Vomitor]

I agree, there definetely has to be. I mean look at that whole scenario in Hopkins book "witnessed". However way you interpret it, there are so many physical aspects seen by multiple peoples. I also particularly was very impressed by jeff ritzmann's story about the drive where he got lost from his family and ended up so far away as to being impossible to have just blundered behind the wheel.

No there's definitely something to it, but perhaps this something can only operate with people who's minds are tuned into a particular kind of state - or manipulate certain people into this state. i.e. that fuzzy state between dream and being awake, and that from here it can somehow operate and make physical changes in the real world as we know it.

 

[Drew UK]

I remain convinced that most of these events are independently driven by the witness.

However, I also think that there are clues left behind in the case of a real event in a minority of cases.

You mentioned that the CD was on repeat - was this intentioned or conincidental or unusual?
There is a strong argument that electrical devices malfunction or are altered in some cases, one of the most insightful pieces of evidence is discoloration (similar to "electro" magnetic influences) on a typical cathode ray TV - it would be interesting to know how common this is amongst the abudctee audience.

 

[Vomitor]

It wasn't on purpose that it was on repeat, i used winamp and it had a tendency to sometimes switch on by itself or easily. I remembered the other day what the cd i heard was by the way, it was Haus Arafna - Butterfly Haus Arafna Discography at Discogs

some disturbing music right there...

In regards to what you say about music affecting your sleep state drastically, i can add that it isnt the first time that i accidently had an album on repeat, and consequently woke up in a weird state. Although not nearly as hardcore as the sleep paralysis incident, i clearly remember once i fell asleep to aphex twins ambient works 2...i felt damn strange waking up with that still playing. Also i seem to rmemeber some other event where i woke up in a confused state, where a cd had gotten stuck apparently, and playing the same part of a song again and again...i think it was the solaris soundtrack by cliff martinez

Indeed i think it has a lot to say, maybe your onto something there with the electromagnetic frequency thing...interesting

 

[Tom From Hong Kong]

My wife has a friend -- a professional (physician) Asian woman who lives alone -- who seriously claims that she is 'hugged' every evening while she falls asleep by a spirit residing in her apartment. She really doesn't seem that disturbed by it. Also, quite comically, she says that on four or five occasions when she arrived home from her office her television was on and a particular disc of "Grey's Anatomy" was playing (same disc each time, removed from the box). She is one of the more serious individuals my wife knows. (Needless to say my wife refuses to visit her at her apartment).

It is also rumored that the Grand Hyatt in Taipei, Taiwan is haunted (it was constructed on the site of a Japanese prison camp). I have a good friend (partner at a well known management consulting firm) who has been awakened several times in the middle of the night by the bathroom faucet open full throttle. His TV has also turned on/off. This all occurred in multiple rooms during multiple stays (for some odd reasons he doesn't mind staying there to get the points). I have another friend (investment banker) who woke up one night at the hotel to find someone sitting in a chair in his room -- the figure disappeared once he asked what it was the [ ] it was doing there.

Maybe there is something to it? I have heard other stories from other credible witnesses, but these are two of the more entertaining ones.