bobodean
Skilled Investigator
But Chris..dont you think that all his "lack of evidence" hurts the cause just as much as the guy with the fake frozen bigfoot?
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J.C. Johnson January 26, 2014
- Thread starter wwkirk
- Start date
No, not at all. Apples & Oranges. Perhaps JC could use a more finely-tuned BS meter, but he's not out attempting to make $ promoting a circus sideshow of dubious providence. I'm still working on my BS meter (baby-and-the-bathwater, etc). Lance (and his ilk) set their conservative BS (none of it can be true) meters in stone long ago. I contend that as soon as you think you know it all, invariably the trickster will set you straight—if you are open enough to receive and learn from the lesson/wakeup call...
DaveM
Paranormal Adept
I seem to recall when Ardy Sixkiller Clarke was on the Paracast. She was asked to provide proof to her stories of Native American paranormal/ufo events. When she couldn't she was dismissed as basically a storyteller and little else. JC Johnson wasn't even asked to provide some video/photographic proof to his stories. In all that time spent in the wilderness, he should have something to show for his efforts. I don't remember him offering such proof.
ZenBug
Paranormal Novice
What Lance said.
Also, @Christopher O'Brien, what if I did know J.C.? How would that change anything? "He presents no evidence of his claims, but he's a real good guy, so maybe his claims are true!"?
His character has no bearing on anything. All that matters with extraordinary claims is evidence, and it's not that his evidence is dubious, it's that he doesn't have any!
And don't forget that it's not always about deception. People can also be victims of hoaxes, or simply mistaken.
Also, @Christopher O'Brien, what if I did know J.C.? How would that change anything? "He presents no evidence of his claims, but he's a real good guy, so maybe his claims are true!"?
His character has no bearing on anything. All that matters with extraordinary claims is evidence, and it's not that his evidence is dubious, it's that he doesn't have any!
And don't forget that it's not always about deception. People can also be victims of hoaxes, or simply mistaken.
Perhaps I should have provided the caveat, "aspiring" field investigator. I have constantly emphasized to JC the importance of biological evidence. But, let's face it: JC is a people person—he's also an aspiring sociologist/anthropologist. He goes out into the field and people open up with him. I contend that even if what they say is fraught by misidentification, front-loaded belief, etc it's culturally noteworthy. If we get some killer samples to analyze, that's frosting.
Yeah, and take some frickin' pictures while yer at it!
bobodean
Skilled Investigator
And shoot a bigfoot. A body would be the best proof.Perhaps I should have provided the caveat, "aspiring" field investigator. I have constantly emphasized to JC the importance of biological evidence. But, let's face it: JC is a people person—he's also an aspiring sociologist/anthropologist. He goes out into the field and people open up with him. I contend that even if what they say is fraught by misidentification, front-loaded belief, etc it's culturally noteworthy. If we get some killer samples to analyze, that's frosting.
Yeah, and take some frickin' pictures while yer at it!
ZenBug
Paranormal Novice
Don't worry - Rick Dyer has one, right??
Burnt State
Paranormal Adept
"field researcher," @lancemoody , is often a self-titled, and freely bandied about moniker, and i don't think anyone takes that very seriously.
BTW there are many folk who sit in the magician's audience who believe that they must have made a deal with the devil to do the things that they do. Don't we all want to see the impossible, the forgery, the tightropewalker and wool being pulled over our eyes, whether they say that that's what they're doing or not? Humanity craves magic of all kinds in music, art, cryptids, ghosts and UFO's. We don't take it all seriously. We like to experience a sense of wonder. While i greatly appreciate people like yourself who take research very seriously, even into obscure, socio-cultural fields like Ufology, that's not all who is in the audience. Consequently, everyone's money and attention is the same. It makes no sense to berate them or spawn ill will amongst those who are being fascinated/entertained/doubtful. It's all the same crowd. Everyone is barking at the same tree.
BTW there are many folk who sit in the magician's audience who believe that they must have made a deal with the devil to do the things that they do. Don't we all want to see the impossible, the forgery, the tightropewalker and wool being pulled over our eyes, whether they say that that's what they're doing or not? Humanity craves magic of all kinds in music, art, cryptids, ghosts and UFO's. We don't take it all seriously. We like to experience a sense of wonder. While i greatly appreciate people like yourself who take research very seriously, even into obscure, socio-cultural fields like Ufology, that's not all who is in the audience. Consequently, everyone's money and attention is the same. It makes no sense to berate them or spawn ill will amongst those who are being fascinated/entertained/doubtful. It's all the same crowd. Everyone is barking at the same tree.
Oakenwulf
Paranormal Maven
It was a fun episode period! I'm more into cryptids and weird beasts than hardcore UFO research anyhow (I'm sure its all tied someway, somehow), I loved listening to JC and it really does make you think about this subject. it seems like the world of cryptos eludes us even more than ufos do, it feels like they intentially go out of their way to remain in the shadows until we get that one hint of something then its a hoax blended in with a real hoax.
as far as lance, I even have yet to produce one good form of evidence in any of my investigations ( I have many evps, unexplainable things recorded,etc) Yet all my good "evidences" I have "seen" or "heard" , there is no way I can record or replicate or even really want to due to the fact how scary it is. Im in the same boat as the others..still like JC, I personally would love to hear more encounters from him and other people similar to him, cant just knock it down even if their is no evidence and it hasn't been proven fiction yet either.
as far as lance, I even have yet to produce one good form of evidence in any of my investigations ( I have many evps, unexplainable things recorded,etc) Yet all my good "evidences" I have "seen" or "heard" , there is no way I can record or replicate or even really want to due to the fact how scary it is. Im in the same boat as the others..still like JC, I personally would love to hear more encounters from him and other people similar to him, cant just knock it down even if their is no evidence and it hasn't been proven fiction yet either.
Paleontologist
Skilled Investigator
I finally finished this episode. Speaking as a paleontologist AND a Southwesterner, I'm confident that JC Johnson falls into that delightful category of Teller of Tall Tales. He has zero evidence, of course, because that's the point. In his stories he's had plenty of opportunities to collect evidence, but he didn't. Fine for campfire chatting. What steams me, though, is the image he presents of a bumbling hidebound scientific establishment. One example close to me: Supposedly a group of University of New Mexico paleontologists traveled to cast some fossil dinosaur tracks and were shown first recent tracks of living theropod dinosaurs in a wash. They stood there with all their casting equipment (and cameras, presumably) and did NOTHING with these modern trackways, passing up evidence that would overturn just about all we know about dinosaurs and their history. There is no way any paleontologist would walk away from this, including the crew at UNM (a very small set of people we can contact, by the way -- but that's right, they're afraid to overturn the paradigm). So, tall tales for the credulous. What I don't understand is a common response like that from Chris: "If only 2% of what he claims (and he claims others claim) is true ..." And what would this 2% look like? Is it the dog-men that are real? The centaurs? The Bigfoot pooping in the trees? The mini T. rex? The cult of human sacrifice? That desperate hope to cling to some fraction of these fantasies as "true" is what keeps someone like JC Johnson employed in the classic Western tradition of pulling the legs of tenderfeet.
Han
piscator ψ
As usual I am split down the middle on this one:
In defence of MR Johnson, even if 100% of what he says is untrue, how much harm is it doing in comparison to others in the paranormal field? I think that just like Santa, Bigfoot is fairly harmless.
My biggest problem is:
MR Johnson decided to "attack" DR Sykes (as I stated in a previous post) although I do not know DR Sykes personally, I am aware of some of his work regarding Bigfoot, and in my opinion if MR Johnsons attitude is representative of the "paranormal field" in general, it will become increasingly difficult to attract much needed Scientific investigation into such matters, not that it’s not nearly impossible now.
I would like to post a documentary about Bigfoot, which featured DR Sykes, but sadly people outside the U.K. won't be able to watch it, it was called "Bigfoot Files" and was in three parts Yeti, Sasquatch and Almasti. Anyway what surprised me was that DR Sykes was more "open" to the idea of Bigfoot being a "living" creature than I am! And he is a (and this is not an understatement) a "World renowned" genetic Scientist. I was left with the distinct impression that MR Johnson felt that because none of the samples tested yielded the results he "desired" that DR Sykes was responsible and had been complicate in a conspiracy to conceal the "truth", which I find insulting at best.
Also there has been suggestion that it would be a good idea to attempt to "shoot" a Bigfoot, my opinion is that is not a good idea, and would most likely result in injury to yourself, or others around you.
In defence of MR Johnson, even if 100% of what he says is untrue, how much harm is it doing in comparison to others in the paranormal field? I think that just like Santa, Bigfoot is fairly harmless.
My biggest problem is:
MR Johnson decided to "attack" DR Sykes (as I stated in a previous post) although I do not know DR Sykes personally, I am aware of some of his work regarding Bigfoot, and in my opinion if MR Johnsons attitude is representative of the "paranormal field" in general, it will become increasingly difficult to attract much needed Scientific investigation into such matters, not that it’s not nearly impossible now.
I would like to post a documentary about Bigfoot, which featured DR Sykes, but sadly people outside the U.K. won't be able to watch it, it was called "Bigfoot Files" and was in three parts Yeti, Sasquatch and Almasti. Anyway what surprised me was that DR Sykes was more "open" to the idea of Bigfoot being a "living" creature than I am! And he is a (and this is not an understatement) a "World renowned" genetic Scientist. I was left with the distinct impression that MR Johnson felt that because none of the samples tested yielded the results he "desired" that DR Sykes was responsible and had been complicate in a conspiracy to conceal the "truth", which I find insulting at best.
Also there has been suggestion that it would be a good idea to attempt to "shoot" a Bigfoot, my opinion is that is not a good idea, and would most likely result in injury to yourself, or others around you.
I think you meant her saddle.
nope i mean mean bareback.
dyingsun
Paranormal Adept
Who wouldn't..(not speaking for Han here, but I think he'd be on the same page). After the 2012 craze (and I admit, I was worried for/about that one, simply because so many people believed in it), some have to come up with new stuff. Through the grapevine, I heard the 6 of June 2016 will be the end of the world, the Zombie outbreak, just started in China.
Han
piscator ψ
Because in my opinion its a bit like trying to shoot a ghost or similar entity, hot lead will have 0 effect, and could hit a "bystander" or ricochet and hit you. Alternatively you could be so fearful that you had annoyed it by firing at it (without effect) that you run away and break a leg or worse, which may sound minor, but in the "woods" this can be fatal.
bobodean
Skilled Investigator
Or, it could be like shooting a flesh and blood animal...like a bear. You hit it once or twice in the pumper with a large caliber rifle and it drops. Boom. You have PROOF that bigfoot exists.
People hunt all the time and bystanders arent hit(Dick Cheney not withstanding).
As for the running away AFTER shooting at it...couldnt the same thing apply if you come across one and you arent armed and cant shoot it?
These stories seem to always lack the part that makes them credible. The part where the story teller says,"Then I raised my lever action Marlin 45/70" (or my SW500 mag or my 7mmRem Mag or something of equal or greater foot/lbs of energy out the wazooo) "and I fired repeatedly"....
Then and only then will we actually know if BF is bulletproof, ethereal, or flesh and bone.
Everyone if free to do whatever they want if/when they come across a BF. Run, cry, attempt to communicate, or poop your pants. But me, I am shooting the crap out of it.
Burnt State
Paranormal Adept
Just watch out for the big guy. You know how he likes to stay one giant step ahead of us all the time. I think shooting BF is just like trying to take a picture of him. Like UFO's, Bigfoot is starting to move away from the nuts and bolts, or meat and bone, hypothesis. Instead they have become just as elusive as vampires, centaurs, smoking dog-faced men, skinwalkers, UFO occupants, leprechauns and mermaids.
