The Nightmares of Bruce Goldberg

[Woody Sideman]

Hm what is that system, if you don't mind my asking?

It would be off topic. Check your private messages

 

[Quantum Being]

Schticknz:

Per your point number 3 above, there have been some recent developments in math that lend support to the statement related to quantum physics that Goldberg made about how (I'm paraphrasing) "nothing happens until you observe it". Check out this link:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=paUniverse_sun14_parallel_universes&show_article=1&cat=0

I'm not defending Goldberg's outrageous claims, but I thought you might find this interesting.

 

[Quantum Being]

Sorry -- the link seemed to collapse when I pasted it. Go to this link:

http://www.breitbart.com/

and search for "parallel universes". You should see an article listed about the Oxford findings.

 

[Nightwatch]

Thank goodness we'll hear some sense in the next show with Paul Kimball. The last two episodes have been completely crazy. Its these kind of shows that put me off esoteric radio.

Anyway, Gene and David keep up the "usual" good work,

Clive

 

[Verum]

Auntiegrav wrote..

I was actually shoveling shit

So you're a politician, Auntigrav?!?!?

 

[auntiegrav]

Auntiegrav wrote..

I was actually shoveling shit

So you're a politician, Auntigrav?!?!?

No, I wasn't making the shit up. The chickens did that. They are the CIA. I just have to 'spin' it onto the compost pile and turn it into something sweet.
Kinda like a speechwriter, I guess.
A politician actually gets bribed to spread specific shit. I also don't have any pigs right now, so there's no pork involved.
Can an avatar get elected president? (Reagan did....
More importantly, what would the interns do with their time......?

 

[auntiegrav]

Schticknz:

Per your point number 3 above, there have been some recent developments in math that lend support to the statement related to quantum physics that Goldberg made about how (I'm paraphrasing) "nothing happens until you observe it". Check out this link:

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=paUniverse_sun14_parallel_universes&show_article=1&cat=0

I'm not defending Goldberg's outrageous claims, but I thought you might find this interesting.

"The Oxford team, led by Dr David Deutsch, showed mathematically"

The key word being "mathematically".
Mathematics is a tool we use to make models of the real universe that are very useful. However, drawing a picture of a horse does not mean that horses are made of paper and crayons, no matter how talented the child.
Regardless of how tasty the condiments piled on top, beware of the shit in the Shit Sandwich. Unfortunately, our System of systems is coprophagic.
Goldberg's Quantum Observer claims are not out of line with mainstream science, so being a bullshit artist is perfectly acceptable when mainstream science has an affinity for selling the middle of the bell curve to government sponsors.
However, if you want answers that haven't already been digested, you have to take a hard look at ALL of your assumptions, including the assumption that someone else is smarter than you.
Goldberg loves that assumption, because he rattles off bullshit really fast and furiously, knowing that few people can follow along with it and thoughtfully respond in such a short time frame (he may beeeleeev in everything he says, and be doing this out of habit, too). Much like Creationists love to do. Just keep spewing out half-truths and soundbites that are above MOST people's heads, and the rest will be intimidated by the mob that nods. (Isn't that a cool name for a rock band?"Mob That Nods")

 

[pixelsmith]

wow... you guys are right this guy gives me a headache too... i think he is on speed or something.

 

[schticknz]

Sorry -- the link seemed to collapse when I pasted it. Go to this link:

http://www.breitbart.com/

and search for "parallel universes". You should see an article listed about the Oxford findings.

Ok, thanks for that link ... I shall check it out. Quantum Physics is for ever in flux it seems ... always on the move, and never where you expect it to be .

Anyway, I shall have to brush up methinks on my QP ... although somehow I still have this feeling that quantum physicist types have no real idea of whats going on or have any clue about what they're talking about ... generally speaking

p.s. don't have nightmares ...

 

[derekcbart]

I'm actually very concerned about the people/patients he has done recovered memory/past life regressions with. It has been established over the past few years that any memories that are "recovered" during these types of hypnotherapy sessions are not real memories, but are actually false memories planted by the therapist. Sometimes knowingly, but mostly unknowingly. The brain is unable to distinguish memories created in this manner from memories of actual events. He has very likely damaged the psychology of many people.

Links to recovered memory:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recovered_memory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_memory_syndrome
http://skepdic.com/repress.html

Each of the above pages has links to additional pages on the topic.

-Derek

 

[Paul Kimball]

Thank goodness we'll hear some sense in the next show with Paul Kimball. The last two episodes have been completely crazy. Its these kind of shows that put me off esoteric radio.

Anyway, Gene and David keep up the "usual" good work,

Clive

Clive:

Actually, I had a bit of a cold, so unless Dave and Gene did a good editing job, I wasn't at my best...

... although I'll admit that is still better than the last two guests!

Paul

 

[Gene Steinberg]

Thank goodness we'll hear some sense in the next show with Paul Kimball. The last two episodes have been completely crazy. Its these kind of shows that put me off esoteric radio.

Anyway, Gene and David keep up the "usual" good work,

Clive

Clive:

Actually, I had a bit of a cold, so unless Dave and Gene did a good editing job, I wasn't at my best...

... although I'll admit that is still better than the last two guests!

Paul

You sounded great. Not to worry.

 

[schticknz]

I'm actually very concerned about the people/patients he has done recovered memory/past life regressions with. It has been established over the past few years that any memories that are "recovered" during these types of hypnotherapy sessions are not real memories, but are actually false memories planted by the therapist. Sometimes knowingly, but mostly unknowingly. The brain is unable to distinguish memories created in this manner from memories of actual events. He has very likely damaged the psychology of many people.

Links to recovered memory:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recovered_memory
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_memory_syndrome
http://skepdic.com/repress.html

Each of the above pages has links to additional pages on the topic.

-Derek

Thats what I meant about Dr Goldberg being the common link between all of his patients. Human brains are very susceptible to suggestion ... so did he knowingly or unknowingly plant false memories into his patients by asking pointed questions of them under hypnosis?? Would be interesting to see video/transcripts of his patients sessions ... if he kept any??

 

[Wulfi]

i'm not gonna kick this guy in the nuts. he's down for the count already. all i wanted to add is, and sorry if this was mentioned in another post in this thread, just too many pages to read thru, is that you should hear this guy when no one asks him any tough questions. i first heard him on a show called the paranormal cafe. the host just went "hmmm" "really" and goldberg just spun a tale of how great the future is gonna be. it was so rosey i was seriously thinking is he a gov. disinfo agent for all the saps out there that need reassurance that everything will be fine in these trying times. google it, i think you'll be amused.

 

[BrandonD]

I'm actually very concerned about the people/patients he has done recovered memory/past life regressions with. It has been established over the past few years that any memories that are "recovered" during these types of hypnotherapy sessions are not real memories, but are actually false memories planted by the therapist. Sometimes knowingly, but mostly unknowingly.

You are vastly oversimplifying this subject. Very few in the paranormal fields actually research hypnosis apart from its involvement in ufology. I've done so because it's a very interesting subject to me in its own right, and it's been clearly established that real and verifiable memories can be perfectly recovered through hypnosis.

One example that pops to mind: On a BBC documentary on hypnosis, they interviewed a man who was arrested and put in jail for a murder he didn't commit. While in prison, he was told by another inmate the names of the real culprits of this murder.

Years later, he was speaking to a lawyer and he said that he had been told the names of the killers, but he couldn't remember them because it was so long ago. He was placed under hypnosis, and he was able to accurately recall the names. The real murderers were caught and he was set free, entirely because of hypnotic recall.

I think it's obvious that fake memories can be implanted through hypnosis. Yes, we all know it, it's been drummed into our heads. But I find it very odd that no one in this field is aware of the fact that hypnosis is actually effective in retreiving completely forgotten memories, if properly utilized.

Rather than disregarding hypnosis as is the current fashion, we should learn about the proper protocols that minimize fabrication and elaboration.

 

[derekcbart]

One example that pops to mind: On a BBC documentary on hypnosis, they interviewed a man who was arrested and put in jail for a murder he didn't commit. While in prison, he was told by another inmate the names of the real culprits of this murder.

Years later, he was speaking to a lawyer and he said that he had been told the names of the killers, but he couldn't remember them because it was so long ago. He was placed under hypnosis, and he was able to accurately recall the names. The real murderers were caught and he was set free, entirely because of hypnotic recall.

I agree with your example. The difference is that the subject knew something and could not fully remember it. Hypnosis has been shown to be effective at helping people remember items that they cannot quite remember otherwise, but when "memories" are discovered during a hypnosis session that relate to things that the person had no previous memory of then they are more than likely to be false memories.

 

[schticknz]

My favourite resource for all things ... resource-y, Coast to Coast has something to add to Dr Bruce Goldbergs nightmares. See here:

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page2302.html?theme=light

(And I know thats supposed to be a grey and everything ...) ... but why has Dr Goldberg got no nose???

hmmm actual cartoonist with something of a sense of humour??? ... you decide.

schtick out

 

[Aaron LeClair]

My favourite resource for all things ... resource-y, Coast to Coast has something to add to Dr Bruce Goldbergs nightmares. See here:

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/gen/page2302.html?theme=light

(And I know thats supposed to be a grey and everything ...) ... but why has Dr Goldberg got no nose???

hmmm actual cartoonist with something of a sense of humour??? ... you decide.

schtick out

Yeah, I saw that today, though I didn't bother clicking on it. There's a interesting article there on reading paralyzed people's minds/brains I clicked on instead.

 

[BrandonD]

...but when "memories" are discovered during a hypnosis session that relate to things that the person had no previous memory of then they are more than likely to be false memories.

That's an assumption and isn't considered proven by any means. But it may be true.

Regardless, consider this scenario: A couple is driving home, and then they "wake up" in their parked car an hour later. They have no memory of what occurred, and yet there is missing time during which something happened. Since it's unlikely that they just skipped across time, there is probably a legitimate memory that can be retrieved.

Consider also a person who forgets something and then recalls it at some future date. It was obviously being "kept" somewhere, and yet for a long period of time that person could not access it.

This area does delve into memory and exactly how and where it is "stored". Since this is an area that is very far from understood, I think it's reasonable to allow for the possibility that memories can be retrieved for which a person has no conscious recall.

 

[Poi]

I have to agree with that, Brandon. But I'm referring to the scientific study, the one that doesn't exist, to my knowledge anyway, of hypnosis. We know it's a real phenomenon. It's generally accepted that a subconscious exists. But no one really bridges the gap between the two other than one camp saying memory retrieval is bunk and the other endorsing it. So many gray areas to deal with! Some people just prefer the black/white construct. Bad news, that.

But I'm in the camp of the non local mind, a place where memory and fantasy, unfortunate in this instance only, are not so very distant. Until Western science accepts that premise, that we are not completely individual in our capacity to experience and create, a study of memory vs. fantasy (which is really a gray term too) or that of hypnosis, will remain nonexistent. That's a shame because we might very well be able to determine the difference if we learn the territory of the non local mind. It's also a shame because there is real power in knowing oneself, not the grubby-gimme kind of power but the kind that drastically reduces human frailty. Ain't easy, but it's worth the try.

I don't think Dr. Bruce is capable of non-interference with his subjects though. He's invested in outcomes favoring his opinions. Doesn't qualify as science, not by a long, long shot.