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Politics of Global Warming

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Free episodes:

Neil and Bill Talk Climate Change | StarTalk
TEXT: "Published on Oct 23, 2015: Neil deGrasse Tyson and Bill Clinton discuss the current perception of climate change versus the way the vast majority of scientists view it."
 
Climate Change with George Monbiot and George Marshall | Guardian Live
TEXT: "Published on May 14, 2015: Despite the overwhelming evidence, the majority of us have become increasingly adept at ignoring or side-lining climate change. Most of us recognise the danger is real and yet we do nothing to stop it. As the Guardian sets out on its own climate change journey, George Marshall, one of the most eminent thinkers in the world on climate change talks to George Monbiot at a sold-out Guardian Live event on 13 May 2015 about why we are in denial and what we can do to stop it before it's too late."
 
Read internal memos and interviews with experts, including former Exxon Mobil employees, in part two of the Los Angeles Times investigation: "In an internal draft memo from August 1988 titled 'The Greenhouse Effect,' a company public affairs manager laid out what he called the 'Exxon Position.' Toward the end of the document, after an analysis that noted scientific consensus on the role fossil fuels play in global warming, he wrote that the company should 'Emphasize the uncertainty.'”

How Exxon went from leader to skeptic on climate change research
By KATIE JENNINGS, DINO GRANDONI AND SUSANNE RUST - OCT. 23, 2015
LINK: How Exxon went from leader to skeptic on climate change research
 
I used to believe in Global Warming in the way it is portrayed nowadays. I also had a friend who also posted walls of text and he eventually convinced me it was all bullshit.

The earth is cyclical and weather, as everything else cycles and is transient across its surface.

That's really the whole thing summed up in one sentence.
 
aNorthernSoul said:
I used to believe in Global Warming in the way it is portrayed nowadays. I also had a friend who also posted walls of text and he eventually convinced me it was all bullshit.
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Read the science - directly - not interpreted. It's pretty persuasive. Far from BS.
aNorthernSoul said:
The earth is cyclical and weather, as everything else cycles and is transient across its surface.
Click to expand...
Your statement as such is accurate, but is not relevant to Climate Change or the issue of CO2. Weather is cyclic and local. Climate is across longer arches of time. The impact of CO2 - and the origin of the increased CO2 - is science fact.

You are dismissing the science, I wonder why? Do you dismiss the science that brings you your iPad, or your cell phone, or your television? How about the science of dentistry? Pick a science - do you dismiss the science of nuclear energy? of GMO's? of x-rays? Do you dismiss the science of space craft? of the space station? of the Hubble Telescope? The same science that brought you all the foregoing, is bringing you the news of Climate Change and CO2 - and that you dismiss. Interesting choice.
aNorthernSoul said:
That's really the whole thing summed up in one sentence.
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Far from being summed up in a sentence about weather being cyclic. What you prove is how successful has been the disinformation campaign the oil companies set in motion in the 1990's. Very sad.
 
Not long ago there were papers and papers of well written scientific research discrediting the idea of human contribution to climate change (as it isn't global warming.) Those vanished in the past couple of years. Interestingly, not too long ago, many scientists (some anonymously) claimed that they have recently "changed their views on scientific topics for non scientific reasons." I wonder what topic is at the forefront of such a claim. Follow the funding...
 
Activism on-line to place Exxon under investigation.

Investigate Exxon: Earlier this month, reports revealed that Exxon has known about the threat of climate change since the 1970s and 80s.
LINK: Investigate Exxon.
 
The important thing here to note is how you (and he) didn't address anything brought up, they just straight out attacked without addressing any of the points raised.

And for my own benefit, Bill Nye is not a real scientist, he is a celebrity. I quoted an actual scientist.

So, address it for real or concede that you are full of crap, wall of text poster. If you can't speak for yourself, you and your quotes mean nothing.
 
Tyger said:
The following is why engaging in a dialog with a denier merely eats up time - though it is a good demonstration of what is taking place: the 'politics' involved.


My post of the Bill Nye video was in direct rebuttal to your claim that he thinks there are 'serious flaws in global warming logic and/or science'. The video - which I chose at random btw - refutes your claim about his views. I have heard Bill Nye express his views on Climate Science and Global Warming and I have never heard him state what you say. Point made unless you can come up with a direct quote from Bill Nye to the opposite view.
EDIT NOTE: I just realized that you were connecting your comments to Freeman Dyson, not Bill Nye. The way your post was written it was confusing (to me). Hence my posting the Bill Nye video - which still stands as a worthy video imo.

You are also massively misunderstanding Freeman Dyson. Dyson was scientist having arguments of degree with fellow scientists but he was not positing that AGW does not exist. He simply has a different view of prognostications being made, to which he is entitled. Take a gander at wikipedia (no less) for some insight into how Dyson's thinking went.
"Friends and colleagues describe Dyson as shy and self-effacing, with a contrarian streak that his friends find refreshing but his intellectual opponents find exasperating. "I have the sense that when consensus is forming like ice hardening on a lake, Dyson will do his best to chip at the ice", Steven Weinberg said of him. His friend, the neurologist and author Oliver Sacks, said: "A favorite word of Freeman's about doing science and being creative is the word 'subversive'. He feels it's rather important not only to be not orthodox, but to be subversive, and he's done that all his life."​

We have more regarding his views on Climate Change.
"Dyson agrees that anthropogenic global warming exists, and has written that "[one] of the main causes of warming is the increase of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere resulting from our burning of fossil fuels such as oil and coal and natural gas."

"[Dyson] notes that "[m]y objections to the global warming propaganda are not so much over the technical facts, about which I do not know much, but it’s rather against the way those people behave and the kind of intolerance to criticism that a lot of them have."

"In 2008, he endorsed the now common usage of "global warming" as synonymous with global anthropogenic climate change, referring to "measurements that transformed global warming from a vague theoretical speculation into a precise observational science."

"He has argued that political efforts to reduce the causes of climate change distract from other global problems that should take priority."​

'Dyson wrote: "I'm not saying the warming doesn't cause problems, obviously it does. Obviously we should be trying to understand it. I'm saying that the problems are being grossly exaggerated."​

Nye was speaking to the issues that make debating deniers a problem. Did you listen to the video? I suspect not - because Nye actually does get into the science - your 'the points raised'. If you cannot be honest in your conversation, you cannot expect anyone to take you seriously.

Bill Nye is a science educator who is well known - the way Isaac Asimov was. I suspect Bill Nye has more of a grasp of physics than most of the lay public. He knows physics. He and Dyson are different breeds of scientists, but Nye is no slouch: LINK: Bill Nye - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia But this is exactly what Nye's point was in that video I linked to - denier's deflect with 'credentials'. Fact is, even Dyson acknowledged that he did not have command of the technical facts of global warming but he did not pretend that AGW was not occurring. Dyson was objecting to other - human behavior - factors that he did not like.

I do address it 'for real'. How many scientific papers on global warming have you read in the last month? or in the last 12 months?

'Wall of text poster"? I am posting articles - does the amount of text intimidate you? there are some people who cannot link to an article - and sometimes links go defunct. In both cases the text is preserved because I have copied-and-pasted the text here. A reader is not obliged to click on a link unless they want to.

And as for being 'full of crap' - that doesn't compute. You have said you admire 'real scientists' - so I would assume you would admire Climate Scientists. Even Freeman Dyson respected the Climate Science. He may have disagreed with various ins-and-outs of it - being the contrarian he was - but he never dissed it. Your 'full of crap' dismissal is just more of the denier stuff when confronted with the undeniable facts.

Curious statement. :confused: Not sure what to make of it. I am providing articles for amusement and edification. Make of them what you will. Many here are enjoying the read. Those who aren't don;t come on the thread. Simple.
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But Bill Nye hasn't the same credentials so it becomes a bit of a moot point. Do I shrug off the thoughts of a mechanic because an autobody expert says that my transmission is fine? No, I don't.

And, I meant that I want to hear your words. Walls of text is a little impersonal.
 
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