June 28, 2015 — Richard Dolan

[Orville]

I stated them all above

 

[Orville]

Great. I'm always willing to learn about the flaws. Please provide the details if possible.

Im sorry I didn't mean any disrespect just getting tired, could you tell me what you mean by human causes and explanation? do you mean that all phenomenon can be explained by human causes, are you saying that it is our own tech that is creating these accounts or that they are simply just made up? im just trying to get feel for where you are coming from?

 

[DissectionStalker]

I stated them all above

The fundamental ET flaw well beyond smoke screen "need to know" Roswell Human crashes:

Any advanced intelligence with similar abilities and interests in the Universe will have long since discovered life on our planet. We would have been explored by probes or other means within the last billion years or so. But is that very likely? Here are some good reasons to consider that it probably never happened... Will it ever happen? Maybe not...

Don't forget and keep in mind there is no reason intelligent life necessarily has to follow down a path we Humans have taken. We've had millions [or billions?] of life forms on our planet and only one came into being by sheer accident that does what we do. We are EXTREMELY rare on our planet. The odds are astronomical against Human intelligence happening.

We may be far more unique than most people believe. We needed Jupiter, our moon, and asteroids or comet impacts to create the conditions for Humans to come into existence. The odds are astronomical against an intelligent life form like ours existing just on our planet. It will be the same everywhere else assuming life generates easily enough on planets like ours. Meaning, it will never happen on most life giving planets. Btw, I don't think we've found a match yet in our galaxy of any planet being near identical to ours, nor have we found it within a protective solar system either.

Something tells me we are far more astronomically unique than we are being led to believe. Another "mythology control" objective that aids the PTB and MIC too? Certainly The Storytellers are telling us we are not alone, but are they telling us the truth that intelligent life does not exist as we do? The odds were astronomical against Humans taking form on our planet, and all other millions or billions of life forms here had no need to do what we do. We are likely very alone in the Universe with few intelligent life forms more advanced than we are if we consider what it took to produce Humans on planet Earth. We may even wipe-out our species soon if we can't protect our planet from impacts and the coming ice ages or self-destruction. At the rate we're going we may only have a slim chance of succeeding. We'll be lucky to colonize the Moon and Mars.

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear O

Yes, all are explainable by human designed tech which includes things like the God Helmet, HAARP and Omega Stations which can implant a thought or vision in your mind almost as well as ancient shamans did a million years ago.

I know there are very advanced craft in Nevada. I have talked with back engineers from Tonopah government installations and the head of research at the Skunk works - yes, S4 has what looks like alien craft. Some are damaged and some are not.

Nothing I have seen or heard is not explainable. Trans en Provence, England, Mexico or seen by pilots trained to observe. Vimanas, death rays -whatever; the Ark in Indy Jones - just name it. I have seen a few near AFBs in Arizona near Snowflake and other places.

 

[Orville]

Dear Orville

Your history is flawed. The people in America had libraries galore, hanging gardens and absolute paradises galore before the Plague was intentionally spread to almost wipe them out. The bark of trees in Central America was ready to write on, they invented the wheel, the mathematical concept of zero knew the Earth Energy Grid better than we do today (built every Maya urban center on it). I can go on to include smelting, the atl-atl which lead to cross bows better than a WWI Lee Enfield rifle etc.

Then you say these words.

I mean to say that how could anyone possibly assume that their technology is by any means completely in capable of failure? I would assume that they could potentially run in to unforeseen circumstance just as any sort of technology we have could. just look at how the sun could completely knock out the worlds entire electrical grid with a single EMP burst. something that could potentially happen that was completely unforeseen by the creators of all sorts of different electronics. A craft could potentially have crashed either do to an unforeseen circumstance or simply "Pilot Error" which I do not think is completely out of the realm of possibility.

In physics and engineering if you can get through space (other than dimensional travel which is unlikely to occur with anything but a robot) you cannot crash. The many suns you have passed are bigger and more able to take your ship apart with EMP bursts. Unforeseen is a lot like imaginary - and what we can do is no where near to what is required. Pilot ERROR - come on. We have computers driving cars in urbane areas, and we are talking about advancements way beyond that which are necessary just to get to Mars.

I think that you misunderstood my point, I am by no means saying that the Native people were less advanced or by any means, just not technologically as advanced at the time. they most certainly had many advancements that the Europeans did not, but when it came to weaponry they obviously could not compete. I was just using the Native peoples as an example to show that it is entirely possible for us to recover a downed craft. Also that we are going on the assumption that ET's Technology is completely omnipotent, which I personally do not think is the case. the whole argument that ET's Technology cant ever malfunction is an assumption that I don't think anyone can prove, like wise I cant for sure prove that it its, therefor I don't think that we can rule it out of the realm of possibility

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear O

Who is saying anything cannot malfunction? It just would not get here if it was that poorly engineered. And for there to have been hundreds of such errors is beyond even needing a response. THINK!

So you think the invaders of paradise had superior weapons? If so why did they use the Plague? There were 70 million people in NA before De Soto wandered around spreading the plague. Look at his route! Why did he stay so long among the highly advanced Alabamans - remnants are the Cherokee who are Iroquoian and DNA shows are white. The Cherokee then taught the filthy white people about corn, indoor plumbing and a lot more. By the time Columbus finished with dogs and trinkets (neither of value for trade in China) there were only 2 million left. His journals say the Taino on Cuba were "In - deos" or 'with God'. He had three sets of journals for different master's eyes. Not one Taino survived those flea-bearing dogs with Plague.

Further south you should know Pizarro and his men would have died if the Inca (White leader or Sun-King) had not told his people to lay down their arms and these white people were prophesized in the spiritual heavens. Pizarro met this leader many moths before and the agreement still exists. A few women could have tilted a few rocks and caused the end of those 167 men who grew arm weary hacking the 7,000 warriors to death on the next day.

 

[Orville]

The fundamental ET flaw well beyond smoke screen "need to know" Roswell Human crashes:

Any advanced intelligence with similar abilities and interests in the Universe will have long since discovered life on our planet. We would have been explored by probes or other means within the last billion years or so. But is that very likely? Here are some good reasons to consider that it probably never happened... Will it ever happen? Maybe not...

Don't forget and keep in mind there is no reason intelligent life necessarily has to follow down a path we Humans have taken. We've had millions [or billions?] of life forms on our planet and only one came into being by sheer accident that does what we do. We are EXTREMELY rare on our planet. The odds are astronomical against Human intelligence happening.

We may be far more unique than most people believe. We needed Jupiter, our moon, and asteroids or comet impacts to create the conditions for Humans to come into existence. The odds are astronomical against an intelligent life form like ours existing just on our planet. It will be the same everywhere else assuming life generates easily enough on planets like ours. Meaning, it will never happen on most life giving planets. Btw, I don't think we've found a match yet in our galaxy of any planet being near identical to ours, nor have we found it within a protective solar system either.

Something tells me we are far more astronomically unique than we are being led to believe. Another "mythology control" objective that aids the PTB and MIC too? Certainly The Storytellers are telling us we are not alone, but are they telling us the truth that intelligent life does not exist as we do? The odds were astronomical against Humans taking form on our planet, and all other millions or billions of life forms here had no need to do what we do. We are likely very alone in the Universe with few intelligent life forms more advanced than we are if we consider what it took to produce Humans on planet Earth. We may even wipe-out our species soon if we can't protect our planet from impacts and the coming ice ages or self-destruction. At the rate we're going we may only have a slim chance of succeeding. We'll be lucky to colonize the Moon and Mars.

So are you a proponent of Intelligent Design? I ask because I have heard very similar arguments from IT crowd.(which is cool if you are)

and from what I understand(which admittedly is very limited) I have always thought given the unimaginable vastness of space that it was most certainly teeming with life. that because of the vastness that in all "Probability" there is life out there.

and they have found many planets in the habital zones of stars
Eight New Planets Found in "Goldilocks" Zone2015-04 | www.cfa.harvard.edu/
Kepler Finds 1st Earth-Size Planet In 'Habitable Zone' of Another Star | NASA

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear O

Yes, we know and have a thread addressing habitable zones etc. Most are not habitable because they are too close or have weather we could not survive because they are facing their sun all the time. I quoted the Kepler one as the best so far, UFOLOGY argued and gave source for many more. I looked at the source and found it faced the sun and had a 28 day year. None are close, and they are not inhabited (to make DS and his point clearer).

He is not into Intelligent Design - I am; and it does not apply in any proof of Alien Craft reaching Earth. It has much to do with why we are not Hybrids and such however. I have shown Dembski and Tegmark take out each other's laundry.

 

[Orville]

Dear O

Who is saying anything cannot malfunction? It just would not get here if it was that poorly engineered. And for there to have been hundreds of such errors is beyond even needing a response. THINK!

So you think the invaders of paradise had superior weapons? If so why did they use the Plague? There were 70 million people in NA before De Soto wandered around spreading the plague. Look at his route! Why did he stay so long among the highly advanced Alabamans - remnants are the Cherokee who are Iroquoian and DNA shows are white. The Cherokee then taught the filthy white people about corn, indoor plumbing and a lot more. By the time Columbus finished with dogs and trinkets (neither of value for trade in China) there were only 2 million left. His journals say the Taino on Cuba were "In - deos" or 'with God'. He had three sets of journals for different master's eyes. Not one Taino survived those flea-bearing dogs with Plague.

Further south you should know Pizarro and his men would have died if the Inca (White leader or Sun-King) had not told his people to lay down their arms and these white people were prophesized in the spiritual heavens. Pizarro met this leader many moths before and the agreement still exists. A few women could have tilted a few rocks and caused the end of those 167 men who grew arm weary hacking the 7,000 warriors to death on the next day.

I'm not saying anything about population, obviously if you have 70 million people and I have 1 million and we go to war you are going to win every time, even if I have guns and cannons, and yes I am absolutely saying that the Europeans had superior weaponry to the NA. Im sorry I just don't see how you can equate any sort of cross bow to a cannon? Again I am not saying anything against Native people. I am not saying they were Dumb or Unintelligent in any way. I was using an example, and some how this has turned into some sort of racial debate between Native Americans and Europeans as to which is superior which is a stupid argument on either side

 

[DissectionStalker]

He is not into Intelligent Design - I am; and it does not apply in any proof of Alien Craft reaching Earth. It has much to do with why we are not Hybrids and such however. I have shown Dembski and Tegmark take out each other's laundry.

Do you have a thread that explains this in intelligent design concepts? Connecting the dots...

 

[Robert Baird]

The cannon were no match for the few Indians left. It was not even something they had at first. Just a few ship mounted contraptions which blew up and could not travel to any place of value in war. You have to get your era fixed, time wise. Pizarro had no cannons, Cortez had some but stayed clear of Monteczuma until disease had run it's course, and he could fulfill a prophecy earlier Romans had given the Aztecs along with those ghastly blood rituals. He arrived on the first day of wheat to fulfill that prophecy negotiated earlier - and the Roman terracotta head is a 99% archaeological certainty according to Professor Emeritus David Kelley who also broke the Mayan Code with Coe and others.

Coe said the Mayan Code would give more to humanity than space colonization and the human genome project.

 

[DissectionStalker]

and from what I understand(which admittedly is very limited) I have always thought given the unimaginable vastness of space that it was most certainly teeming with life. that because of the vastness that in all "Probability" there is life out there.

Since you posted this above, it makes me think you do not understand the point of my post. You need to read it carefully for its main point, which is certainly not the point you're making.

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear DS

I have it in my book Mystical Physicists and maybe in Integrating Soul and Science. The debate on ID did not hit until I was near the end of writing. And as I have said - I only have a few copies of the ones available through Ingram which Amazon says are no longer available. It might be in other books at Lulu but I am pretty sure it is in I S & S.

Although I could quote the book it is no big issue. It would take a day or so of typing. They both say things that you can interpret to mean the same thing. The Christians abuse the meaning to suit their sick theories. Baylor University has another Robert Baird of that ilk.

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear O

Yes, the universe is probably teeming with more advanced sentient creature than we are. And there may be other universes. When we thought there was no water anywhere in our solar system other than our planet I had major debates on and Astronomy website and Physics websites with Professors and engineers.

At that time they would not even accept the meteors with microbes that President Clinton touted as proof about Mars, or one found in the Yukon (I am old and some details may be off a little). At that time exobiologists working on the theory that water is key to other life in universe, said they thought 100,000 other lifeforms more advanced that we are were probably alive in our universe. I forget the level of acceptance for other universes at that time - probably not high like now. You can multiply that 100,000 by a geometric variable due to water on Mars, Saturn's moons, Pluto and others.

And all this we know and still say - NO WAY they came here and if they did there is no proof.

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear O

And yes, you can do a wiki search and not find the truth such as this.

Sardinia's castles in the era before Rome and as far back as the Hyksos rule in Egypt had cross bows and could defend every inch of the large island. No explanations forthcoming from academia. In fact you'll hear more about alien intervention than such facts. I say "pluck yew" (which is the derivation of the phrase often heard 'f*ck you') to those who think modern weapons up until the second world war were significantly better than the ancients.

"Its size suggests that it was one of the most powerful bows of its era. Historical texts indicate that its firing range could have been up to 2,600 feet, according to Huashang Newspaper, which is double the range of an assault rifle, which is about 1,300 feet.

 

[Randall]

The fundamental ET flaw well beyond smoke screen "need to know" Roswell Human crashes:

Any advanced intelligence with similar abilities and interests in the Universe will have long since discovered life on our planet. We would have been explored by probes or other means within the last billion years or so. But is that very likely? Here are some good reasons to consider that it probably never happened... Will it ever happen? Maybe not...

Don't forget and keep in mind there is no reason intelligent life necessarily has to follow down a path we Humans have taken. We've had millions [or billions?] of life forms on our planet and only one came into being by sheer accident that does what we do. We are EXTREMELY rare on our planet. The odds are astronomical against Human intelligence happening.

We may be far more unique than most people believe. We needed Jupiter, our moon, and asteroids or comet impacts to create the conditions for Humans to come into existence. The odds are astronomical against an intelligent life form like ours existing just on our planet. It will be the same everywhere else assuming life generates easily enough on planets like ours. Meaning, it will never happen on most life giving planets. Btw, I don't think we've found a match yet in our galaxy of any planet being near identical to ours, nor have we found it within a protective solar system either.

Something tells me we are far more astronomically unique than we are being led to believe. Another "mythology control" objective that aids the PTB and MIC too? Certainly The Storytellers are telling us we are not alone, but are they telling us the truth that intelligent life does not exist as we do? The odds were astronomical against Humans taking form on our planet, and all other millions or billions of life forms here had no need to do what we do. We are likely very alone in the Universe with few intelligent life forms more advanced than we are if we consider what it took to produce Humans on planet Earth. We may even wipe-out our species soon if we can't protect our planet from impacts and the coming ice ages or self-destruction. At the rate we're going we may only have a slim chance of succeeding. We'll be lucky to colonize the Moon and Mars.

One might counter that if the odds are so astronomical against intelligent life forming here on Earth, that since it happened anyway, it must have had a little help along the way. After all, that would greatly increase the odds wouldn't it? And since you recommend playing the odds, it should make some sense to you as a possibility.

 

[DissectionStalker]

Yes, the universe is probably teeming with more advanced sentient creature than we are.

Intelligent life that explores Space is highly unlikely given that only one life form on Earth can do it out of billions of life forms that were/are here, and many other life forms here were/are intelligent too. This is sadly anthropomorphic thinking, and why most ET's look similar to Humans. It's all wishful thinking and highly religious too!

Our Human existence was never predestined to be. It took trillions of chance occurrences just for Humans to exist within the variety of life forms here, and it took many extinction events to even make it possible. We are one of a kind to do what we do, so it is NOT realistic to believe many planets will have life forms that can explore space.

I would not be surprised if we are alone in our Galaxy as space explorers, assuming other intelligent life forms too, unless we are the offspring of another ET race.

 

[Robert Baird]

Dear DS

The experts who are scientists and not all deluded or PTB clones, say MORE advanced than we are. Earth is many billions of years younger than many parts of universe, and who knows about other universes.

Here is a little more on Intelligent design.

A Guest expert at World Mysteries like myself has written about Intelligent design in this link.

I come from a more Gaian or ancient point of view including Mandelbrot Sets, Phi in Nautilus shells and the pyramid, Fibonnaci, the Pentagon Dodecahedron, Emotu's water crystals, Tiller's Acts of Creation, epigenetics, attunement of shamans etc..

World Mysteries - Guest Authors: Daniel Neiman - Evolution and Consciousness

 

[DissectionStalker]

The experts who are scientists and not all deluded or PTB clones, say MORE advanced than we are. Earth is many billions of years younger than many parts of universe, and who knows about other universes.

My point was addressing what is likely in each galaxy. Maybe one intelligent life form that leaves their home planet to explore space per galaxy, or maybe one in ten galaxies.

Traveling between galaxies and multi-universes is theoretical. Ask any scientist in the know just how plausible it is, and you will understand there are no practical ways to do it. Why? Because even the theoretical FTL concepts require infinite amounts of energy without any understanding how to do it or survive such travel either.

Yes, Mr. Kaku/Kuku is a media mouthpiece for the PTB, imo. I can't stand some of their BS, because he has no problem being insanely outlandish theoretically with what he will spout off.

Most scientists would never agree with all the BS KuKu [and his ilk] spouts as being practical and doable with FTL, so I do NOT think there are many deluded scientists EXCEPT for a very few handful of theoretical physicists that get off being outlandish on SyFy Science channels. They're discussing philosophical concepts of UNKNOWN and UNPROVEN multi-dimension and multi-universe concepts. They admit this, and they admit there is no way to confirm such theories "to test" the validity of such ideas. It is pure mathematical concepts, so it is speculation.

Also, until experimental findings are peer reviewed AND duplicated then you can NOT claim it is true. Verification is ALWAYS required.

 

[Robert Baird]

I will agree with that if it makes any difference.

Kaku definitely got overused and was weak in Futurescape. I like him and I think he gets it right about "know-nothing" scientists.

I can claim anything is truth. Peer review is usually proven wrong (all science needs to get real and know this, but all scientists are not leading edge either). If you said I cannot claim it is accepted as true - I would agree. There is always the debate about Ayer's Law v. Occam's Razor and the garbage fomented by Shermer/Randi. It is a fruitless dialectic.

When atom-mysticists such as Crookes began letting the genie out of the bottle they were ridiculed. When the Wright Bros (including Orville - he-he) flew we had Scientific American saying it was not possible for years.

Some examples of proofs which science still does not accept are mentioned in my oft quoted Re-discovering the Mind which has the Nobel Laureates in all disciplines agreeing with the mystics. Today we have Metaphysics being proven as the only reality by Gravitational Wave theorists.