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From The NY Times: The Pentagon's Secret UFO Program

Thomas R Morrison

Paranormal Adept
Truer words have never been written, while contemplating if the yolks are being saved for Mr. Bigelow’s appetite.
Haha - Bigelow: "I am the yolk-eater in this relationship, peons! You can have the whites tho."

In not following the story to the exclusion of my real life, I’d like to know if Elizondo first approached DeLonge, or, if DeLonge first approached Elizondo. In other words, the circumstances in which they first became acquainted.
I recall a little bit of info about that: DeLonge was working his way through various people he met within the government, and they knew about the AATIP, but they wouldn't use Luis Elizondo's name for some reason, so he became a rather mysterious figure for DeLonge. Apparently it eventually got to Mr. Elizondo that DeLonge would like to speak with him, and Luis Elizondo agreed, and at that point DeLonge learned his name and they had a meeting. I think DeLonge talked about this at the TTSA announcement event back in October (iirc), and perhaps on the Joe Rogan interview as well, but I've only watched those parts once so it's a little fuzzy.
 

uforadio

Paranormal Adept
Pentagon UFO Study - New Media Collection Report

Dear colleagues.
Here is the latest collection. I have also added some pieces from previous release merged with new ones for the sake of better continuity.

Media Index Page updated:
Pentagon UFO Study

2018-02-25 - Coast to Coast: Pentagon UFO Study: George Knapp interviews Luis Elizondo
(length around 80 minutes without commercials)

Secret UFO Revelations/ Opening the Blue Book Files - Shows - Coast to Coast AM

2018-02-07 - 60 Minutes with Luis Elizondo - former director of the AATIP) –
interviewed by Giuliano Marinkovic on January 15 2018 for Croatian TV (uncut version)


2018-02-24 - Interview with Luis Elizondo for the UFO Congress (36 minutes)

I-Team Series:

2018-02-01 - I-Team: Man Who Headed Up Secret Government UFO Study Speaks Out –
by George Knapp (Video embedded on the Link) - Knapp's Quadrilogy with Luis Elizondo - part 1

I-Team: Man who headed up secret government UFO study speaks out

2018-02-02 - I-Team: Secret UFO Program Recorded Encounters with Uknown Objects –
by George Knapp (Video embedded on the Link) - Knapp's Quadrilogy with Luis Elizondo - part 2

I-Team: Secret UFO program recorded encounters with unknown objects

2018-02-07 - I-Team: Understanding the Science of UFO –
by George Knapp (Video embedded on the Link) - Knapp's Quadrilogy with Luis Elizondo - part 3

I-Team: Understanding the science of UFOs

2018-02-07 - I-Team: Web Extra-Luis Elizondo Explains How Space-Time Distortion Work -
Knapp's Quadrilogy with Luis Elizondo - part 4

WEB EXTRA: Luis Elizondo explains how space-time distortion works

2018-02-20 - I-Team: I-Team-Bigelow Launches Venture to Manage Space Stations
by George Knapp (Video embedded on the Link)

I-Team: Bigelow launches venture to manage space stations

2018-02-20 - I-Team: Mystery Metal Studied in Las Vegas –
by George Knapp (Video embedded on the Link)

I-Team: Mystery metal studied in Las Vegas

I-Team Series by George Knapp (in Full HD version):
LUIS ELIZONDO + GEORGE KNAPP REPORTS


Misc:

2018-02-07 - UFO Congress Teaser - Interview Excerpt with Luis Elizondo

2018-02-21 - The Sun: (02:45 min Video Clip with Luis Elizondo embedded on the Link –
Short Excerpt from the UFO Congress Interview)

Baffled US intelligence officers leak UFO footage THEMSELVES to get help from unwitting public in IDing mystery objects, Pentagon 'X files project' chief claims

2018-02-13 - Former Blink-182 Member Launches UFO Research Academy
Former Blink-182 rocker launches UFO research academy

_____________________

Some leftovers and companion pieces:

2017-12-17 - ABC News: News Segment on the Pentagon UFO Study - Col. Stephen Ganyard Comments

_____________________

JEREMY CORBELL COLLECTION (PENTAGON UFO STUDY & THE USS NIMITZ UFO INCIDENT)

2017-05-11-Coast to Coast with Jeremy Corbell
PERSPECTIVES + TIC TAC UFO CASE

2017-11-29-Bizarre States with Jeremy Corbell
CORBELL INTERVIEW + BIZARRE STATES

2017-11-29-Desert Oracle with Jeremy Corbell
DESERT ORACLE RADIO + JEREMY CORBELL

2018-01-19-Bizarre States with Jeremy Corbell
CORBELL INTERVIEW + BIZARRE STATES

2018-02-16-Stuff They Don’t Want You to Know with Jeremy Corbell
STUFF THEY DON'T WANT YOU TO KNOW

2018-02-20-Fade to Black with Jeremy Corbell
CORBELL INTERVIEW + FADE TO BLACK

_____________________


Companion Pieces (Articles & Videos):
Bigelow Aerospace Collection from KLAS-TV (Knapp’s TV station):


2002-02-23-Hotel Owner Has 'Spacey' Dreams
Hotel Owner Has 'Spacey' Dreams

2004-05-27-NASA Las Vegas
Exclusive: NASA Las Vegas

2007-04-10-Exclusive Las Vegas Businessman Prepares for Another Space Launch
Exclusive: Las Vegas Businessman Prepares for Another Space Launch

2007-08-16-I-Team-Bigelow Aerospace Makes Giant Leap Towards Commercial
I-Team: Bigelow Aerospace Makes Giant Leap Towards Commercial Space Travel

2011-02-04-I-Team-Bigelow Aerospace Begins Big Expansion
I-Team: Bigelow Aerospace Begins Big Expansion

2011-02-05-Bigelow Aerospace May Get Module on Space Station
I-Team: Bigelow Aerospace May Get Module on Space Station

2011-02-05-NASA Rep. Visits Bigelow Aerospace
NASA Rep. Visits Bigelow Aerospace

2011-06-15-Las Vegas Inventor's Ideas Take Shape
I-Team: Las Vegas Inventor's Ideas Take Shape

2012-05-11-I-Team Space Capsule Test Brings Strange Sight to the Desert
I-Team: Space Capsule Test Brings Strange Sight to the Desert

2013-05-23-I-Team-NASA, NLV Aerospace Co. to Explore Space Together
I-Team: NASA, NLV Aerospace Co. to Explore Space Together

2013-05-23-I-Team-NLV Aerospace Company to Announce Space Deal
I-Team: NLV Aerospace Company to Announce Space Deal

2014-04-30-NLV Company Gets Closer To Building Space Stations
NLV company gets closer to building space stations

2016-03-28-After Glitch, NASA Plans to Reinflate Habitat
After glitch, NASA plans to reinflate habitat

2016-04-07-Bigelow Aerospace Awaits Friday Launch
I-Team: Bigelow Aerospace awaits Friday launch

2016-04-09-SpaceX To Send Expandable Habitat To ISS
SpaceX to send expandable habitat to ISS

2016-04-11-Bigelow Aerospace To Make A Big Announcement At 3 p.m
WATCH: Bigelow Aerospace to make a big announcement at 3 p.m.

2016-05-26-I-Team-Bigelow's Expandable Module Put To The Test In Space
I-Team: Bigelow's expandable module put to the test in space

2016-08-12-Las Vegas Company Among NASA Picks For Deep Space Habitats
Las Vegas company among NASA picks for deep space habitats

2017-10-17-Bigelow Sets Sights on the Moon
Bigelow wants NASA to use inflatable habitats to make ISS a lunar base

--- end of report ---

Best wishes
 

Realm

Paranormal Adept
I’d like to know if Elizondo first approached DeLonge, or, if DeLonge first approached Elizondo. In other words, the circumstances in which they first became acquainted.
This is Elizondo's latest version from that UFO Congress video:
My decision to leave the US government was before I ever knew anything about TTSA. My initial plan was to frankly fade off into the sunset, take a job working something that I could enjoy that was completely unrelated to the US government and if you will, like I said, fade off into the sunset. It was actually TTSA that found me through some colleagues of mine in the intelligence community once they found out that I was leaving had suggested that maybe I should talk to some of the folks at TTSA who were interested in talking to me.
So according to that, he decided to leave, and fade off into the sunset, and TTSA found him "through some colleagues" "once they found out" he was leaving.

One of the authors of that original NYT has provided this account:
The journey began two and a half months ago with a tip to Leslie, who has long reported on U.F.O.s and published a 2010 New York Times best seller, “UFOs: Generals, Pilots and Government Officials Go on the Record.” At a confidential meeting Oct. 4 in a Pentagon City hotel with several present and former intelligence officials and a defense contractor, she met Luis Elizondo, the director of a Pentagon program she had never heard of: the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program.
...
Leslie also learned that Mr. Elizondo had just resigned to protest what he characterized as excessive secrecy and internal opposition — the reason for the meeting.
...
She spent hours with him reviewing unclassified documents
...
A few days later Mr. Elizondo and others there — including Harold E. Puthoff, an engineer who has conducted research on extrasensory perception for the C.I.A. and later worked as a contractor on the program, and Christopher K. Mellon, a former deputy assistant secretary of defense for intelligence — announced they were joining a new commercial venture, To the Stars Academy of Arts and Science, to raise money for research into U.F.O.s. Leslie wrote it up for the Huffington Post with scant details of the program.
...
I had known Leslie for years, and she told me this looked like a story for The Times. I agreed. Leslie and I met with Mr. Elizondo in Philadelphia on Oct. 31. Three days later, I emailed the executive editor, Dean Baquet, about “a sensational and highly confidential time-sensitive story” that I said “involves a senior U.S. intelligence official who abruptly quit last month” exposing “a deeply secret program, long mythologized but now confirmed.”
...
Helene met with a Pentagon spokesperson on Dec. 8 for a response to the information we had gathered. The answer came swiftly. There had been a program to investigate U.F.O.s, but it ended in 2012 after five years, the Defense Department insisted.
On the Trail of a Secret Pentagon U.F.O. Program

That "several present and former intelligence officials and a defense contractor" sounds like Semivan, Mellon and Justice and/or Puthoff to me, with possibly someone outside of TTSA too. Those were likely the aforementioned "some colleagues". Note that Semivan and Puthoff joined TTSA already in May 2017, way before that announcement event.

So according to that article, Kean spent hours with Elizondo, looking at unclassified documents. Seems like there's plenty they have kept for themselves. Kean has given a similar account, and specifically mentions those videos were shown to her:
We spent three or four hours together and Elizondo, you know, talked to me and I was shown documentation, I was shown the videos that were eventually released with our story and ... told all about Harry Reid, I was shown documents about Harry Reid's involvement and just the story was kind of laid out for me at this meeting and I realized at that point that it was a New York Times level story given the documentation that was available for the program and for the people involved and everything else.

Interestingly Elizondo has apparently stated something like this in a new C2C interview:
Luis cannot say how NYT got it's copies of the videos, one would have to go to they NYT to get that answer, but Luis did not release the videos.
Lots of Interesting New Info From C2C Luis Elizondo Interview (Live Updates) • r/UFOs

So is he hiding something?
 

Realm

Paranormal Adept
If we're going to go after anybody, it should be the people keeping these secrets, not the people bringing them out, y'know?
Remember that Elizondo was among those people who kept those secrets, for years, and by his own words, was originally planning to fade into the sunset (with those secrets). He has also made it pretty clear he is not planning to reveal anything classified but rather keeps it to his grave.

He has also increasingly emphasized how we others should demand additional information from the government, so there's really not much that indicates he is planning to have an active role in getting things released, more like it's our FOIAs that matter. And again, remember that the one case that has some context to it was leaked years before Elizondo did anything.

He has even sort of asked our help to identify what those videos actually show:
“There are experts I would submit now that are out there, perhaps within this audience that is watching this video now, that have the ability to look at some of these videos and help us have a better understanding of what exactly we're looking at.”
...
Nick Pope, who used to do a similar job to Elizondo for Britain’s Ministry of Defence told Sun Online: “The whole situation is bizarre. The idea seems to have been that when the Pentagon's imagery analysts drew a blank, they decided to put two or three videos into the public domain, to see if anyone else could solve the mystery.
...
"To me, it sound like the videos were released in order for members of the general public to look at and scrutinize them to help find answers in a citizen science or crowd-sourcing type project. However, getting more official information about the videos sounds difficult.
Baffled US intelligence officers leak UFO footage THEMSELVES to get help from unwitting public in IDing mystery objects, Pentagon 'X files project' chief claims

So what exactly are you expecting Elizondo could and would provide beyond what FOIAs should do?

Note also that TTSA has now become the sort of company that keeps information to themselves. Such as that CoC documentation, that Kean for example apparently still has according to that interview I linked above, so it's not classified, and it's available, and TTSA has marketed their videos with it all this time, yet they have kept it to themselves.
 
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Hollywood Tomfortas

Paranormal Adept
Uh-huh. So this is what you guys are citing as evidence now? Wooo...



Books by Leo Zagami:

"Confessions of an Illuminati, Volume I: The Whole Truth About the Illuminati and the New World Order"

"Confessions of an Illuminati, Volume II: The Time of Revelation and Tribulation Leading up to 2020"

"Confessions of an Illuminati, Volume III: Espionage, Templars and Satanism in the Shadows of the Vatican"

"The Invisible Master: Secret Chiefs, Unknown Superiors and the puppet masters who pull the strings of Occult Power from The Alien World"

Sure, that looks legit...lol.

So can people buy tin foil hats from you guys, or do they have to make their own to join your fanatical little conspiracy/hate club here? Inquiring minds want to know, haha.
Well, Brother @Thomas R Morrison , to keep your conspiracy-mongering re: Brothers @Realm and @S.R.L. from overheating too much, I would like to present you with this video. I’m sure that you would never consider Oprah Winfree to be an agentess of the Illuminati, so perhaps this interview that Oprah did with Lt. Col. Aquino and his wife, ca. 1988, will set your mind at ease.

 

Hollywood Tomfortas

Paranormal Adept
Well, Brother @Thomas R Morrison , to keep your conspiracy-mongering re: Brothers @Realm and @S.R.L. from overheating too much, I would like to present you with this video. I’m sure that you would never consider Oprah Winfree to be an agentess of the Illuminati, so perhaps this interview that Oprah did with Lt. Col. Aquino and his wife, ca. 1988, will set your mind at ease.

And our cousins at ATS had this AMA with Lt. Col. Aquino in 2013. He briefly handles a question about UFOs and their coverup by the govt.
My name is Michael Aquino, and I think it's kind of fun to do the impossible; Ask Me Anything., page 1
 

S.R.L.

Paranormal Adept
Well, Brother @Thomas R Morrison , to keep your conspiracy-mongering re: Brothers @Realm and @S.R.L. from overheating too much, I would like to present you with this video. I’m sure that you would never consider Oprah Winfree to be an agentess of the Illuminati, so perhaps this interview that Oprah did with Lt. Col. Aquino and his wife, ca. 1988, will set your mind at ease.

Once again, as playing the devil’s advocate …

Full text of "Michael Aquino (US Satanist) - From PSYOP to MindWar - The Psychology of Victory (1980).pdf (PDFy mirror)"

"An enemy population could be subdued by inflecting a state of physiological terror & feelings of eminent destruction. Additionally, he discusses the use of psychotronic weaponry, or, electromagnetic weapons that influence the mind. Capitulation could be induced without firing a shot by extremely low frequency signals piggybacked on broadcasts of radio, television, or, microwave communications in order to target the thoughts and feelings of the target population."

Synopsis: “Future War: Non-Lethal Weapons in Modern Warfare (1999)” by John Alexander of Skinwalker fame. In addition, the retired colonel’s wife takes an interest in the occult, although, to current knowledge, not in a dark & sinister fashion.

“The nature of warfare has changed! Like it or not, terrorism has established a firm foothold worldwide. Economics and environmental issues are inextricably entwined on a global basis and tied directly to national regional security. Although traditional threats remain, new, shadowy, and mercurial adversaries are emerging, and identifying and locating them is difficult. Future War, based on the hard-learned lessons of Bosnia, Haiti, Somalia, Panama, and many other trouble spots, provides part of the solution.

Non-lethal weapons are a pragmatic application of force, not a peace movement. Ranging from old rubber bullets and tear gas to exotic advanced systems that can paralyze a country, they are essential for the preservation of peace and stability. Future War explains exactly how non-lethal electromagnetic and pulsed-power weapons, the laser and tazer, chemical systems, computer viruses, ultrasound and infrasound, and even biological entities will be used to stop enemies. These are the weapons of the future.

9780312194161: Future War: Non-Lethal Weapons in Modern Warfare - AbeBooks - John B. Alexander: 0312194161
 
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Thomas R Morrison

Paranormal Adept
Once again, as playing the devil’s advocate …

Full text of "Michael Aquino (US Satanist) - From PSYOP to MindWar - The Psychology of Victory (1980).pdf (PDFy mirror)"

"An enemy population could be subdued by inflecting a state of physiological terror & feelings of eminent destruction. Additionally, he discusses the use of psychotronic weaponry, or, electromagnetic weapons that influence the mind. Capitulation could be induced without firing a shot by extremely low frequency signals piggybacked on broadcasts of radio, television, or, microwave communications in order to target the thoughts and feelings of the target population."

Synopsis: “Future War: Non-Lethal Weapons in Modern Warfare (1999)” by John Alexander of Skinwalker fame. In addition, the retired colonel’s wife takes an interest in the occult, although, to current knowledge, not in a dark & sinister fashion.

“The nature of warfare has changed! Like it or not, terrorism has established a firm foothold worldwide. Economics and environmental issues are inextricably entwined on a global basis and tied directly to national regional security. Although traditional threats remain, new, shadowy, and mercurial adversaries are emerging, and identifying and locating them is difficult. Future War, based on the hard-learned lessons of Bosnia, Haiti, Somalia, Panama, and many other trouble spots, provides part of the solution.

Non-lethal weapons are a pragmatic application of force, not a peace movement. Ranging from old rubber bullets and tear gas to exotic advanced systems that can paralyze a country, they are essential for the preservation of peace and stability. Future War explains exactly how non-lethal electromagnetic and pulsed-power weapons, the laser and tazer, chemical systems, computer viruses, ultrasound and infrasound, and even biological entities will be used to stop enemies. These are the weapons of the future.

9780312194161: Future War: Non-Lethal Weapons in Modern Warfare - AbeBooks - John B. Alexander: 0312194161
Why are you posting this here? This is totally off-topic.
 

S.R.L.

Paranormal Adept
Why are you posting this here? This is totally off-topic.
Yes, however, what thread ever does stay on topic? Anyway, as figured, we have all the time in the world, and finding similarities between Aquino’s opinion of non-lethal weaponry & that of John Alexander compelling. We shouldn’t forget that TTSA & research @ the ranch intersect on the road to disclosure.
 

Thomas R Morrison

Paranormal Adept
Yes, however, what thread ever does stay on topic? Anyway, as figured, we have all the time in the world, and finding similarities between Aquino’s opinion of non-lethal weaponry & that of John Alexander compelling. We shouldn’t forget that TTSA & research @ the ranch intersect on the road to disclosure.
This entire thread has become totally toxic and unreadable, between the endless fountain of vaguely amusing but nevertheless blithering nonsense of Hollywood_Tomfortas' posts, and Realm's interminable pointless nitpicking of meaningless tangential minutia - I think it's time to draw the line at irrelevant posts about a notorious Satanist and alleged pedophile.

This is a fascinating developing story - I'm sick of wading through the cesspool that you guys have turned it into, just to get updates about it.
 

DROBNJAK

Paranormal Adept
This entire thread has become totally toxic and unreadable, between the endless fountain of vaguely amusing but nevertheless blithering nonsense of Hollywood_Tomfortas' posts, and Realm's interminable pointless nitpicking of meaningless tangential minutia - I think it's time to draw the line at irrelevant posts about a notorious Satanist and alleged pedophile.
I am saddened to hear that it took you so much time to work that one out. I left it 3 weeks ago. Just imagine how much constructive knowledge and information you could had acquired in that time, instead trying to fight off every baseless slander that some people keep throwing out.
 

Hollywood Tomfortas

Paranormal Adept
This entire thread has become totally toxic and unreadable, between the endless fountain of vaguely amusing but nevertheless blithering nonsense of Hollywood_Tomfortas' posts, and Realm's interminable pointless nitpicking of meaningless tangential minutia - I think it's time to draw the line at irrelevant posts about a notorious Satanist and alleged pedophile.

This is a fascinating developing story - I'm sick of wading through the cesspool that you guys have turned it into, just to get updates about it.
Au contraire, mon frère @Thomas R Morrison! You seem to be laboring under a misconception of what constitutes a sub-topic that is a viable subset of the “mother set” of this New York Times article of December 16, 2017. You see, Brother Morrison, what constitutes the totality of “On-Topicness” in this particular thread is the totality of the contents of the NY Times article itself.

Now you and a few others have chosen to pursue the sub-topic of the UAP videos and the statements of Luis Elizondo, a sub-topic that is a viable subset of the total topic set of this thread. However, may I quote you from the article, the foundation of what constitutes the equally viable subset of Ontopicness that I and a few other Paracast denizens are pursuing. To wit:

On CBS’s “60 Minutes” in May, Mr. Bigelow said he was “absolutely convinced” that aliens exist and that U.F.O.s have visited Earth.

Mr. Reid said his interest in U.F.O.s came from Mr. Bigelow. In 2007, Mr. Reid said in the interview, Mr. Bigelow told him that an official with the Defense Intelligence Agency had approached him wanting to visit Mr. Bigelow’s ranch in Utah, where he conducted research.

Mr. Reid said he met with agency officials shortly after his meeting with Mr. Bigelow and learned that they wanted to start a research program on U.F.O.s.


So you see, Brother Morrison, that it is quite permissible to pursue a sub-topic involving Mr. Bigelow and the research at his Skinwalker Ranch on this very same thread that accommodates the equally viable subtopic of Luis Elizondo and the Nimitz videos and your particular focus on spacetime metric engineering.

(Might I pause here to ask a graphically-gifted Paracaster to draw up a Venn Diagram of Ontopicality for these sets and subsets I am delineating. Thank you!)

Now, as it turns out, Brother Morrison, I happen to know many things about the “provenance” or history of TTSA and AATIP which I intend to share and continue to share on this very thread. You see, TTSA/AATIP did not arise fully formed out of a vacuum. It has a long history, and the immediate precursor of TTSA/AATIP is Robert Bigelow and his NIDS program which in turn arose out of the military’s Stargate program led by Col. John Alexander who overlaps with Lt. Col. Michael Aquino in matters of applying principles of Mind Control, including Remote Viewing, for waging psychological warfare (PsyOps.)

Now, if in tracing that provenance, the matter of child molestation arises, then so be it! Because when such a phenomenon arises, it is always in connection with SRA= Satanic Ritual Abuse, and, with the mention of Satan, we come to . . . Well, rather than have me explain it, allow me to quote the words of your hero Luis Elizondo from the transcript compiled by this diligent Redditor who transcribed Luis’ interview but George Knapp on Coast to Coast radio a few days ago.

Lots of Interesting New Info From C2C Luis Elizondo Interview (Live Updates) • r/UFOs

LUIS ELIZONDO speaking on C2C :

Paranormal just means anything below our level of understanding. Paranormal is just that until it's normal. If you want to make this more concrete, most Americans have belief in something. I think it's interesting that so many place belief in a god or gods (I am spiritual myself, I'm just pointing it out) while on the other hand people look at things that are 'paranormal' and people raise their eyebrows."

On why AATIP’s funding was disputed within the DOD: Yes, funding was moved partially because people, although they believed it, thought they were dealing with demonic forces.”

So there you have Luis himself mentioning “demonic forces” as a phenomenon within the purview of AATIP itself, not to mention its young progeny, TTSA. That phenomenon is known as the DH = Demon Hypothesis, a subset of the IDH=Inter-Dimensional Hypothesis, which vies with the ETH = Extra-Terrestrial Hypothesis.

Furthermore, the very definition of the Demon Hypothesis was made by no less a Paracast luminary than @ Mike and he did so on this very thread!!! So, how’s that for being “On Topic” eh, Brother Morrison?

May I now direct your attention to Message #178 on this very thread, dated December 22, 2017
From The NY Times: The Pentagon's Secret UFO Program

So, what is it that engenders such fear and loathing in you about my own particular interest in and commentary on the NY Times article? Why, I might even say that you are driven to demonize me because of my interest in the Demon Hypothesis of UFOlogy. Now that’s what I call ironic! And I hope that someday, Brother Morrison, you might learn to become cognizant of that irony, and perhaps begin a long convalescent life process of learning how to laugh at yourself and your own viable pretentiousness for such “folly of irony.”

Therefore, I remain at your paranormal service,

Hollywood Tomfortas,
Hierophant to the Stars
(And occasional asteroid.)

With a Hey Nonny Nonny and a Nyuk! Nyuk! Nyuk!
 

Realm

Paranormal Adept
“Paranormal just means anything below our level of understanding. Paranormal is just that until it's normal. If you want to make this more concrete, most Americans have belief in something. I think it's interesting that so many place belief in a god or gods (I am spiritual myself, I'm just pointing it out) while on the other hand people look at things that are 'paranormal' and people raise their eyebrows."
I just listened that C2C interview in full, and there wasn't much new (surprise!) but some interesting things anyway, some of which made Elizondo sound pretty silly. Frankly I was disappointed to hear those.

The context of his definition of paranormal, as quoted above, was in his defense of the stuff that was going on in the Skinwalker Ranch! As usual, according to him, the people there were once again "the best of the best" doing scientific investigation etc. He again repeated his weird comparison how "parachute" and "paramedic" are good things, but "paranormal" for some reason results in negative reactions, as if playing with words like that makes any sense. Then he explained paranormal like this:
So paranormal is nothing more than by definition something that is below the threshold of our understanding at this point, so by definition as a scientist, everything, technically everything is paranormal until it becomes normal. The phone I'm talking to you on right now, fifty years ago this was paranormal.
No, that's just stupid. I guess he is trying to use some short one-liner definitions that really miss the crux of the matter and what is actually contained within that term. Wikipedia contains a pretty good description what it actually is:
The paranormal can best be thought of as a subset of pseudoscience. What sets the paranormal apart from other pseudosciences is a reliance on explanations for alleged phenomena that are well outside the bounds of established science. Thus, paranormal phenomena include extrasensory perception (ESP), telekinesis, ghosts, poltergeists, life after death, reincarnation, faith healing, human auras, and so forth. The explanations for these allied phenomena are phrased in vague terms of "psychic forces", "human energy fields", and so on. This is in contrast to many pseudoscientific explanations for other nonparanormal phenomena, which, although very bad science, are still couched in acceptable scientific terms.
Paranormal - Wikipedia

So while he earlier tried to give an impression how scientific he is, now he seems to be marketing pseudoscientific ideas.

On why AATIP’s funding was disputed within the DOD: Yes, funding was moved partially because people, although they believed it, thought they were dealing with demonic forces.”

So there you have Luis himself mentioning “demonic forces” as a phenomenon within the purview of AATIP itself, not to mention its young progeny, TTSA.
I know I shouldn't underestimate the irrationality of religious people, but it sounds pretty weird to think unidentified craft being "demonic forces" or that demons would be traveling with them or so. That may be what they are thinking, but to me it would sound more logical that such people were aware of the Bigelow and Skinwalker connections, and stuff like this could very well look like a list of demons for the fundies:
SKINWALKER RANCH .

So to me it seems plausible that the background story we have tried to follow might be highly relevant to the reasons their funding ended.
 

Realm

Paranormal Adept
My vote for the craziest part of that new C2C interview would go for the continuation of that party balloon epic. What, you say, can't we just forget that stupid mistake already? Apparently they can't, and it just got worse, way worse.

First a quick recap for those who haven't followed this in detail. When TTSA was announced on October 11, Chris Mellon made an ass of himself and the TTSA at large by presenting a twisted version of the Nimitz story, featuring several incorrect details and that prominently displayed party balloon image. The video and link to the transcript can be found here:
Watch Tom DeLonge’s To the Stars Academy UFO Press Conference Here | Openminds.tv

He was referring to the story as it was told in this article back in March 2015:
https://fightersweep.com/1460/x-files-edition/

Note that:
- His version deviates from that article
- That party balloon image is the first illustration image of that article, without a caption, and the article doesn't claim that or any of the other images are connected to the event.
- Mellon's presentation doesn't use any other pictures from that article, but contains a number of their own images of boats and planes and such.
- Mellon doesn't show that web page, doesn't mention the source or the publication by name, neither the full title of that article, but gives some keywords with which people can google that article. It's already pretty weird he didn't give proper credit for the source.
- That party balloon was shown near the end of the presentation, after all those other images, and in the context when he was describing the object (calling it a secret machine at least once) and how the pilots failed to identify it.

It was exposed as an unrelated balloon pic 3 days after the announcement event:
Explained: Photo of "UFO" Used in Connection with Nimitz Incident [Balloon]

To which the TTSA didn't react in any way for more than 2 months, and they and the Nimitz case took serious hits on credibility as various outlets continued to report their blunder with headings like these (from January 18-19):
Bizarre story of the leaked Pentagon UFO pic that inspired a generation to believe in aliens… but turned out to be a hot air balloon in Manchester
The shock truth about UFO image that made world think aliens may exist

Then finally on January 23 they gave a rather lame response on their FB page:
On October 11, 2017, during a broadcast announcing the formation of To The Stars Academy of Arts & Science, our creative team utilized a slide that was intended to be illustrative of the Nimitz case discussed in the presentation. We recognize that the use of this slide without proper clarification created confusion and, most importantly, did not meet our standard of accuracy. TTS Academy is committed to being a trusted leader in the exploration of exotic science and technologies, and we regret this oversight. It is important to note that the evidence presented by the speaker regarding the Nimitz case is derived from the testimony of multiple US military personnel and multiple sensors aboard multiple ships and aircraft operating in conditions of excellent visibility. Furthermore, the US Department of Defense has not denied the account provided by TTS Academy or the retired US military personnel involved in the incidents of November 14, 2004.
To The Stars Academy of Arts and Science

So that took them more than 2 months, and they didn't even seem to admit their mistake properly, and the wording is strangely defensive that despite that there's still the other evidence and DoD hasn't denied it and so on. That's a pretty weird response as it would have been enough to just state that using the image was a mistake and it didn't have anything to do with the Nimitz event.

In any case, one would expect they would like to forget that shameful episode already, but no, Elizondo just continued that saga and made it even worse! Now around a month later (February 25) on that C2C interview, Elizondo tried to make the point that it wasn't a mistake! Here's my quick transcript of that part:
It wasn't a mistake no, it was deliberate because we were encouraging people to go online, we were quoting information from the web, and it would be disingenuous of us if we were to put any picture other than what was on the web. We knew inherently that picture, we weren't telling people that was the actual Tic Tac, we were simply saying look this is a photo that came along that was part of that article. We knew what the Tic Tac video was but we hadn't done the proper analysis yet to provide that and I think it's important that the audience understands, in order to keep preserve the information that we were trying to relay on that stage we wanted to basically keep to what was already available in the open press. We weren't telling people, hey this is a Tic Tac, what we were trying to do, and maybe we fell short a little bit of what we were trying to accomplish, but we were trying to encourage people to get online and read this story for themselves so they can start asking the hard questions themselves. This is a fundamental challenge that we continue to have and that I continue to have, people say, well, why should we believe you Lou. I don't want you to believe me, I want you to ask for the data so you can look at the data yourself and you then can formulate your own beliefs. I don't want people to say oh we should all believe what Lou Elizondo has to say. No, what I want you to do is go out, ask your leadership in office to request the information from the sources, provide that information whatever as they can at the unclassified level and let people make their decisions and the purpose of the Nimitz incident, that was the only story that was really out there and in the unclassified realm that we could have a collective discussion about and that could get people starting the conversation once and for all and I think we hit the mark with that. Unfortunately I think we got a little bit lost in translation when we drew up that picture. I think people probably thought that we were tying to say this is the actual Tic Tac when in fact we knew it wasn't.
Just wow! I don't know where to even begin. That's just plain stupid. Even if they honestly did something so stupid on purpose, that would show incredibly bad judgment. Secondly, as I mentioned above, they showed a number of other pictures that weren't in that article, and didn't show the rest that were there. And if they "were simply saying look this is a photo that came along that was part of that article", why didn't they actually say that then? Or even say what the article actually was, or even show it? How's that "preserving the information"? And why didn't they even tell the story correctly, if they so hoped people would go and see the article and notice it doesn't actually agree with what they said? None of that makes any sense.

And once again, if they want people to look at the data instead of believing their words, why aren't they providing even all the data they seem to already have? And what use is the TTSA anyway, if it is now our task to try to demand the data from the government?
 

Hollywood Tomfortas

Paranormal Adept
I am saddened to hear that it took you so much time to work that one out. I left it 3 weeks ago. Just imagine how much constructive knowledge and information you could had acquired in that time, instead trying to fight off every baseless slander that some people keep throwing out.
Dear Brothers @Thomas R Morrison and @DROBNJAK. I am quite baffled that you have such a pressing need to control the narrative on this thread when, Thomas, you have already created your own unique thread to discuss spacetime metric engineering for propulsion systems where you and your buddy could both geek out mightily to your respective Aspergian hearts’ content.

But OK, as long as you are here, mewling and whining like a pair of overgrown and aging toddlers, then how about a fun outing for you both, a kind of class project or field trip that would appeal to your metric engineering interests?

I suggest that both of you make a pilgrimage to the Skinwalker Ranch where you could endeavor to communicate with this particular creature/entity at the ranch which might provide you hands on real life experience with spacetime metric engineering with what seems to be a conscious even living wormhole called “The Portal.” I link you to the Skinwalker Ranch website and copy the description for you. (I know you only have a 2% chance of seeing this entity, but perhaps that may afford you time to do some necessary preliminary work before repeating your trials.)

SKINWALKER RANCH .

The Portal"

DESCRIPTION:
I have never seen this first hand but i have possibly seen radiation from it. Made the entire night scenery appear like daytime for 10 seconds. Very bright flash of light which illuminated both the sky and the ground.

FUNCTION/INTERACTION:
Has been described as like a window to another world/dimension. The bright light may have been the result of daylight in this other dimension/location shinning through this window into our own time/space. Rumor has it the orange portals emit living creatures, and the blue portals allow vehicles to pass. Seen to the west of the ranch 500-1000 feet in sky. Likely the source where strange non-native animals/intelligent entities may be entering ranch property.

TYPE: Manipulation of time/space or unique energies to create a doorway to an unknown location or reality.
DURATION: 10 seconds.
FREQUENCY: 2% chance of seeing.
 

Hollywood Tomfortas

Paranormal Adept
******** URGENT APPEAL TO BROTHER REALM ******

Brother @Realm !!!! Please heed this urgent warning and do not, under any circumstances, visit the Bigelow Big Top in Las Vegas and handle any of those meta-materials. You may be allergic to them and suffer severe discomfort, though not death or insanity. You many not become mentally ill, but you will definitely become, well, meta-ly ill! With a hey nonny nonny and a Nyuk! Nyuk! Nyuk!

UFO Explorations | Is Some UFO Debris Dangerous To Touch?

IS SOME UFO DEBRIS DANGEROUS TO TOUCH?
CONTACT WITH ET METALS MAY CAUSE

BIZARRE PHYSICAL EFFECTS


THE PENTAGON, UFO METAL AND “PHYSICAL EFFECTS”

The New York Times recently exposed the “Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program” as a secret, multimillion dollar Pentagon UFO program which ran from 2009-2012. Included in the New York Times investigation was a very interesting claim: that the program had studied people who said they had experienced “physical effects” from their encounters with UFO material. The newspaper also stated that contracts were let by the US Government to private contractor Bigelow Aerospace to “specially modify” facilities to store UFO alloys recovered by US forces. “Physical effects” is a very interesting term to describe what some of the UFO material is doing to individuals. It means to affect a change in the functioning of the body. Frequently such effects can mean symptoms of nausea and disorientation, rash or eruptions, vision problems, or sleep and mood disorders.


Such debris are “out of place artifacts” that are not yet meant to be. They are things that are not from our past or present nor are they from our planet. Exposure to these items represents the premature arrival of the future and could be disorienting to some people. Can some of these metals make you “metally” ill?

The newspaper reported that Bigelow Aerospace was awarded a contract to “specially modify” facilities in Las Vegas to house UFO debris or crash material. One of the possible reasons for the government contracting Bigelow to “modify” the buildings is to help to shield those who may be sensitive to interaction with such material while working with it.



 

LiquidCoax

Skilled Investigator
So can you define and describe the 5% that is on topic so we of the “unwashed 95%” may see the error of our ways and get back on track, er, on topic?
Well, seeing as how the title of this thread is:
From The NY Times: The Pentagon's Secret UFO Program

I'd venture to say anything having little to do with that premise, would seem to be out of place. Without steady moderation, the discussion tends to drift too far out to sea, and loses focus.

Just an observation.
 

Realm

Paranormal Adept
At this point thats 95% of whats being posted in this thread...
Isn't that about the right ratio for the off-topic topic of UFOs in general? If we look at e.g. the talks in that UFO Congress, most of it doesn't/shouldn't have much to do with unidentified flying objects. Same for most of what the entertainment/spaceship business of TTSA is trying to market. And so on. That sort of ratio seems to be an accepted norm.

I'd venture to say anything having little to do with that premise, would seem to be out of place. Without steady moderation, the discussion tends to drift too far out to sea, and loses focus.

Just an observation.
Here's another observation: have you noticed how those who actively complain here about off-topic content are unable to respond to the on-topic issues that have been raised?

Much of the discussion here has been about tracking the history of AATIP and TTSA and where their various pseudo-scientific ideas originate, and at least for me that has resulted a much better overall picture how the recent developments are a continuation of those in the past, and how this all seems to rotate around a smallish number of highly influential people. Basically we have been doing the same for the AATIP and TTSA that they have claimed to have been doing for UFOs: try to figure out what they are, how they work, and where they come from.

As I mentioned above, I think it's for example plausible that what happened in the Skinwalker Ranch might be a significant reason why some religious folks have linked AATIP to demons, which in turn may have played a role on why their funding ended (according to Elizondo). So understanding such history may actually explain quite a lot.

And as for NYT and actual new on-topic information, there hasn't been much actual news to talk about lately...

It would be also pretty difficult for us to have the sort of discussion that Elizondo says we should have, that is, looking at the data instead of trusting his words. Where's the data for those funny materials for example? If we are not supposed to just trust him, why has he even talked about that stuff without giving any actual data to process? It's just questionable marketing without actual data, isn't it?
 


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