"Let them fight", with everyone else out of it!

[cottonzway]

I see the recent events in Gaza and what they seem to be leading towards. That would be an expanded conflict between Israel and Arab states such as Iran and Syria. The consequences of this, regardless of your political views are grave. They have a serious potential to start WW III.

At this point the only way I see this to be avoided if for the US to back off from Israel support in this matter and at the same time for the counter balance in Russia and China to back off from their support of Iran and Syria.
The truth is this is tribal warfare and they WILL continue to fight. They will not be peaceful with each other. They are going to have a large-scale war that likely will involve nukes. If it is 2009 or 2029, it will happen. This is not something that can be stopped, only delayed and interfered with.

The only way for the WORLD to stay out of this is recognize it as tribal warfare that is indeed going to happen anyways and stay out of the situation as to not cause WW III. I understand that this is not going to happen, or at best is highly unlikely to happen. It’s just the only way I see the rest of the world not suffering from people who have been fighting for thousands of years and there is no need for another global war over this shit.

They are going to fight and have war, push genocide on each other. There is nothing the US can to so stop that and assisting it will lead to Russia and China assisting their proxies in Iran and Syria. Everyone loses in that scenario. What I hope for is a stalled agenda and for both sides to realize this. Back off and allow the war to take place, but save the rest of the world from what could result in nuclear war. There is no reason for the rest of the world to suffer because of localized tribal warfare in the Middle East.

The US won’t help Israel or stop Israel. Russia and China won’t help or stop Iran and Syria. I understand that this is not likely, but I see at as the best way to allow the war to take place and not ruin the earth. Let them fight and stay the hell out of it! http://www.jinsa.org/

 

[Kevin Daly]

To be honest, while both sides are up to their elbows in innocent blood, only one has the resources for genocide, if that's what they chose to do. But I think they'd prefer the death of a thousand cuts in any case (and the people they're really trying to kill would probably get off on it, sick bastards that they are)
The whole thing turns my stomach. All modern warfare is terrorism, period. Whether you are blown up by a nutter with a rocket launcher or something strapped around their waist, or another nutter who leaves the bomb in a car, a pub or a railway station, or you are blown up by someone with a nice neatly-pressed uniform who obliterates you from way up high in the sky, you are just as dead, or worse. Children's heads are blown off by home-made bombs just as well as by the munitions manufactured by states that make calculations about acceptable losses.

The situation there is appalling (both sides), but it's just more of business as usual.
We all have to stop telling ourselves that murder can be anything other than murder.

 

[AnnetteMarie]

Ya, they were talking about Afghanistan tonight, and how the women police force were a lot more timid than before the murder of their female chief of police... not Israel or the Gaza Strip, but same old, same old. Murder disguised as righteous war, because now they have the taste of it, they want to kill more...
so maybe I will amend my stray thought that maybe it is time for the Afghani women to kill all the men to maybe it is time to let the Middle East duke it out and keep our noses behind a wall...
Then the other part of me feels that is so wrong.

I don't have an easy answer, only a flip one, and that is more to lighten my mood after seeing this crap on tv whenever I watch the news. If sarcasm could solve the world's problems, then this forum would have the entire world as one big happy.

 

[Tommy Allison]

I'm of the mind that when it comes to Israel, they can take care of their own problems without the machinations and meddling of the United States, and the so called United Nations.

What people don't understand, is that American Tax Dollars bought the land that Israel sits on. That land was fucking paid for. The people who lived there, were more than compensated. In fact what were once dirt farmers, became wealthy overnight.

Israel at one time was an absolute shithole to live in. When the Jewish people emigrated to Israel again they were met by Jews that were already living there, and the land started to prosper. Then when the land started to flourish, that's when the people who weren't bought off wanted the land back, claiming that it had been stolen from them.

No, it was bought and paid for, and was bought from the people who owned the land. A lot of money was spent in the reformation of Israel.

The word Palestine, is a Roman bastardization of the word Philistine.

This conflict between Jews and Muslims comes from a religious belief, but... This whole terrorist nonsense comes from a MONETARY belief. That the Palestinian ne'erdowells didn't get their pay off.

When Israel was attacked they claimed even more land as a buffer zone to keep this kind of shit from happening. This is a conflict that has been going on forever, and will only stop when one group is either gone, or destroyed.

Let Israel wipe out its enemies. They can do just fine without anyone's help or permission.

 

[Mothra]

What people don't understand, is that American Tax Dollars bought the land that Israel sits on.

Not true. Palestine was a British territory. A jewish gang (I forget the name) who wanted a Jewish state started doing the same things that the terrorists of today do. Blowing up hotels, bridges, etc. There is a UN report from 1947 listing all of the terrorist acts from this group. The British in a hangover from the war no longer wanted to deal with this. These acts snowballed and started a movement for the state of Isreal. This is of course the 3 sentence or whatever version, and yes people got paid and beniffited at other peoples expense.

All of the UN contributed resources and monetary aid for the creation and protection of Isreal, not just the US.

Isreal is actually a very small strip of land that has hostile borders on all sides. They are constantly being attacked, so they react in kind. They can't win, nobody can.

These issues in that region won't be resolved, ever. Human Nature won't allow it.

 

[truthseeker]

I absolutely agree. Let them fight it out with everyone else staying out of it. Hamaz is a proxy entity of Iran that will never recognize Israel's right to exist. Israel has made concession after concession and all they're getting in return is rocket bombardments on their cities. I don't think that any sovereign country in their right mind would allow something like this going on. The fact of the matter is that Israelis are being extemely careful in only targeting those areas that are known to be launching pads for Hamaz rockets and facilities that store weapons. It's very typical of Hamaz (seeing how brave they all claim to be) to hide behind innocent civilians (especially women and children) and hence you have the casualties. It's unfortunate, but that's unavoidable. Hamaz is the only one to blame here and I'm happy to see that US is able to recognize this, unlike their imbecile U.N counterpart - a completely worthless organization in my opinion.

I'm hoping that Israel will deal a crushing blow to Hamaz and palestinians will finally be able to take hold of their future and join the civilized world. Israelis do not want this war and I'm sure that most palestinians want to live in peace and prosperity. Palestinians have to stop brainwashing their kids, grow up and start investing in basic infrastructure and better lives.

 

[ironlung]

It's not just the jews that they're after , the muslims want to kill all infidells (that's you and me ) it's the basic tennant of their faith .

The koran states there are three ways to deal with non believers,
1. convert them 2. enslave them 3. kill them

The koran also states it is permissable to cheat, steal from and lie to non believers

No one is safe as long as islam exists

 

[Tommy Allison]

The lion's share of the money was spent by the United States to put Israel on the map. Don't sanitize history. The United States has been the primary source of funds for the United Nations for about 64 years.

We pay the bills, with American Tax Dollars more than any country in the world.

 

[Ron Collins]

It's not just the jews that they're after , the muslims want to kill all infidells (that's you and me ) it's the basic tennant of their faith .

The koran states there are three ways to deal with non believers,
1. convert them 2. enslave them 3. kill them

The koran also states it is permissable to cheat, steal from and lie to non believers

No one is safe as long as islam exists

WOW! Pick that up from the Klan meeting did ya?

You ever read history? You might wanna look up something called "The Crusades". Extremists are the problem not the religion. Timothy McVeigh was Catholic. The Crusaders were Catholic. By your insane logic, we must conclude that the Pope is a war mongering sadist and the world will not be safe until that bastard is dead!

I hope that this was some half baked attempt at sarcasm. If not.... please, please do the world a favor and do not procreate.

 

[Mothra]

The lion's share of the money was spent by the United States to put Israel on the map. Don't sanitize history

Wait what? Sanitize history? I gave you facts Tommy, not your typical retoric.

We just fought a World War and were almost broke.

 

[Kevin Daly]

I see the recent events in Gaza and what they seem to be leading towards. That would be an expanded conflict between Israel and Arab states such as Iran and Syria.

Slight nitpick: Iran is not an Arab country, although it has an Arab minority. The majority culture is Persian, along with several closely related groups. Their language is actually distantly (about 5000 years) related to English, whereas Arabic is of course related to Hebrew.

Life is rich in irony.

Anyway, it's important to remember the Iranian/Arab distinction, or it can lead to the same sort of hilarious results as walking into a Glasgow pub and saying "You English nancies are all the same".

PS. Yes I know you might be perfectly well aware of this and just have been thinking Muslim and writing Arab. That sort of thing happens to all of us. Well, not to Iranians so much. But otherwise. You know.

 

[ironlung]

"WOW! Pick that up from the Klan meeting did ya?"

Ron,
I love the way you PC types start with the name calling , anytime you don't like the truth out comes the racist card.

Have you read the koran ? I have . I'll bet I have studied more history then you are even aware of.

Of course it's the extremists, it's always the extremists whether it's religious or political

The facts that I posted are the truth . Do you know what a Wahhabi school is ? Do you know how many of these schools are in Saudi Arabia and the rest of the middle east ? Do you have any idea what these places are teaching the young muslims ?

I laugh at your feeble insults and I am showing you the middle finger of my right hand.

 

[Tommy Allison]

Wait what? Sanitize history? I gave you facts Tommy, not your typical retoric.

We just fought a World War and were almost broke.

And you don't think that the Federal Reserve wouldn't loan us more money?

They ran the presses day and night so we could throw money at all kinds of countries that needed rebuilding. When you get a chance, do some REAL research into how our government spent money from 1945 on.

 

[Tommy Allison]

Slight nitpick: Iran is not an Arab country, although it has an Arab minority. The majority culture is Persian, along with several closely related groups. Their language is actually distantly (about 5000 years) related to English, whereas Arabic is of course related to Hebrew.

Life is rich in irony.

Anyway, it's important to remember the Iranian/Arab distinction, or it can lead to the same sort of hilarious results as walking into a Glasgow pub and saying "You English nancies are all the same".

PS. Yes I know you might be perfectly well aware of this and just have been thinking Muslim and writing Arab. That sort of thing happens to all of us. Well, not to Iranians so much. But otherwise. You know.

Most people have no idea what the Ottoman Empire was, and how its division after the first world war has affected us to this very day.

 

[CapnG]

Fascinating. Not to step on your toes Ron but I want to jump in here.

Ironlung, you say:

Of course it's the extremists, it's always the extremists whether it's religious or political

Yet you also say:

No one is safe as long as islam exists

Which is itself an extremist viewpoint and completely debasing to the hundreds of millions of muslims who wish only to live in peace and not hurt anyone.

You bring up the Koran and it's many low points without ever mentioning any of it's higher ideals. You also failed to provide any comparitive critique of the Bible (and thus, the Torah) which has many equally horrific passages regarding the treatment of others (like say, Leviticus). Additionally, you've broadly implied that Muslims are simply brainwashed robots, educated in hate and unable to think for themselves.

In short, you're demonstrably a bigot and a hypocrite. And that has nothing to with being "PC", it's simply observation.

 

[cottonzway]

It's not just the jews that they're after , the muslims want to kill all infidells (that's you and me ) it's the basic tennant of their faith .

The koran states there are three ways to deal with non believers,
1. convert them 2. enslave them 3. kill them

The koran also states it is permissable to cheat, steal from and lie to non believers

No one is safe as long as islam exists

Glass parking lot! Kill em' all and let Jesus settle it all. You sound like you are a member of JINSA or a right-wing lunatic. Sorry.

 

[cottonzway]

Slight nitpick: Iran is not an Arab country, although it has an Arab minority. The majority culture is Persian, along with several closely related groups. Their language is actually distantly (about 5000 years) related to English, whereas Arabic is of course related to Hebrew.

Life is rich in irony.

Anyway, it's important to remember the Iranian/Arab distinction, or it can lead to the same sort of hilarious results as walking into a Glasgow pub and saying "You English nancies are all the same".

PS. Yes I know you might be perfectly well aware of this and just have been thinking Muslim and writing Arab. That sort of thing happens to all of us. Well, not to Iranians so much. But otherwise. You know.

It was not "nitpicking" to be honest, but a correct observation on something I said wrong. I know better, but typed otherwise. I am glad you made the correction though so others could see that.

I pride myself on being informed and well-read on these topics and when I post something incorrect, I like to know it.

 

[kova81]

No one is safe as long as <STRIKE>islam</STRIKE> exists

No one is safe as long as Religion exists

 

[ironlung]

Once again , calling me names doesn't change the facts. You don't see christian preachers calling for the annihilation of their neighbors . You don't see buddists putting bomb vests on their children . But you did see hamas slaughter fatah last year in gaza and you did see a young sunni woman blow herself up at a shiite shrine yesterday taking about forty innocents with her.
This is what they do to each other !
A religion that teaches even a small number of it's adherents this kind of violence is wrong and you'll never convince me otherwise . The vast majority of good and peaceful muslims need to change islam and stop spreading the message of hate. Until then like I said, no one is safe .

 

[cottonzway]

Question for you, Ironlung. Why are these people so fucked up? Have you ever considered that? Here is a little FACT for you.

In 1952 the CIA overhtrew their western schooled, democratic president Mohammad Mossadegh because he would not give the oil fields up to British and US interests. After they got him out off office, based on LIES, they put in the "Shah" who caused the decline of the area.

Who created the Mujahadin? CIA. Who trained them? Zbigniew Brezniski, as a means to fight Russia in the late 1970's.

Maybe, just maybe the US has some of the blame here? Maybe? Think long and hard about that before you declare genocide on people.