New Jacques Vallee Interview:

[Ufocurious]

Constance
Thanks for caring and sharing your experience.
I will do Ayahuasca with a person I know from my workplace. He owns a piece of land near our town and does the Ayahuasca in a serious manner. Check his site: Céu da Fraterna União
In addition, even though he knows how to make it, he prefers to get from a safe source. We already talked about, and my gut feelings towards him were positive.

 

[SRL+]

Apparently free divers can be added to the list of UHI experiencers.

NARCOSE on Vimeo

Free diving to a depth of 125m. , or 410 ft. is incredible. You would think that the diver would pass out, descending to those types of depths. The recreated hallucinations experienced were produced well. Thank for posting this.

 

[Constance]

Constance
Thanks for caring and sharing your experience.
I will do Ayahuasca with a person I know from my workplace. He owns a piece of land near our town and does the Ayahuasca in a serious manner. Check his site: Céu da Fraterna União
In addition, even though he knows how to make it, he prefers to get from a safe source. We already talked about, and my gut feelings towards him were positive.

That all sounds good, curious. I hope you have a wonderful experience.

 

[Constance]

Here's the link I promised in that post and the paragraph it was attached to:


. . . I think the hyperdimensional geometry experienced with DMT, LSD, etc. might be another potentially veridical experience which suggests that somewhere in the collective unconscious we all carry knowledge of, or familiarity with, a dimension of existence beyond our own immediate embodied lives. The hyperdimensional geometry described above recalls a recent paper on quantum geometry, linked here.

link to come: Physicists Discover Geometry Underlying Particle Physics | Simons Foundation

 

[SRL+]

I thought the need to point this out….. What is the actual significance of the amplituhedron?

This opinion was presented by Phillip Gibbs, his blog, viXra log

“On its own the theory is very interesting but of limited use. The real excitement is in the idea that it extends in some way to theories which could be physical. Some progress has been made towards applying it in maximal supergravity theories, i.e. N=8 sugra in four dimensions. This is possible because of the observation that this theory is in some sense the square of the N=4 super Yang Mills theory. At one time (about 1980) N=8 SUGRA was considered a candidate theory of everything until it was noticed that its gauge group is too small and it does not have chiral fermions or room for symmetry breaking. Now it is just considered to be another toy model, albeit a very sophisticated one with gravity, gauge fields and matter in 4 dimensions. If it can be solved in terms of something like an amplituhedron it would be an even bigger breakthrough but it would still be unphysical.

The bigger hope then is that superstring theory also has enough supersymmetry for a similar idea to work. This would presumably require superstring theory to have the same dual superconformal symmetry as super Yang Mills, or some other even more elaborate infinite dimensional symmetry. Nothing like that is currently known.

Part of the story of the amplituhedron is the idea that space, time, locality and unitarity are emergent. This is exciting because people have always speculated that some of these things may be emergent in theories of quantum gravity. In my opinion it is too strong to call this emergence. Emergence of space-time implies that space and time are approximate and there are places such as a black hole singularity where they cease to be a smooth manifold. The amplituhedron does not give you this. I think it is more accurate to say that with the amplituhedron space-time is derived rather than emergent. It is possible that true emergence may be a feature in a wider generalisation of the theory especially if it can be applied to quantum gravity where emergence is expected to be a feature. Having space-time and unitarity as a derived concept may be a step towards emergence but it is not the same thing.

For what my opinion is worth I do think that this new way of looking at quantum field theories will turn out to something that generalises to something that is really part of nature. I have advocated the idea that string theory has very large symmetries in the form of necklace algebras so these ideas seem on the right track to me. However I do think that many more advances will be required to work up from super yang mills to sugra and then string theory. They will have to find a way to go beyond the planar limit, generalise to higher dimensions, include gravity and identify the relevant symmetries for string theory. Then there is just the little issue of relating the result to reality. It could be a long road.”

This right here tugs at a thread that is decades in length, as the late John Wheeler would have most certainly agreed.

Does the Universe Exist if We're Not Looking? | DiscoverMagazine.com

 

[DissectionStalker]

While many unique discoveries happen in the dreams and visions of scientists I find those experiences seem to be as internal as drug based hallucinations.

BUT, they are DEFINITELY gaining access to UNIQUE Information NEVER available to the waking conscious mind, imo. I have definitely worked on many problems in a dream state, and I've taken those dream ideas to solve technical problems I never would have thought of otherwise.

Also, as we can see from some of these recent papers posted in this thread, many of these altered-states have a deeper impression of reality than when in a waking state. Terence & Dennis McKenna's lives were changed forever by these Mushroom experiences, and these are perfect examples of one person going somewhat "crazy" over their ideas (Terence) and the other not so.

I strongly suggest watching this video from Terence, as it will give a really good idea of what is encountered from first hand experience with the Mushrooms or DMT. (However, I do not agree with some of Terence's other videos that present "the crazy" ideas that are too far "out there".)

 

[Ufocurious]

Learning things in dreamy or altered states brings all back to Vallee's control system.

Could it be a sentient control system? For example, it is the spirit realm in which extraterrestrials dwell side by side with our ancestors.
Or is it the collective (un)conscious that we can tap into? The not well explained akashic records? If so, is there a gatekeeper or it is up for grabs to the ones that can expand their consciousness until get in sync with it?

These ideas fascinate me, and the paper (DMT entities) touches it when it states how hard is to research it just because we don't know if DMT is all between our ears or is a gate to other realm.

Even Dennis Mckenna after years of research and drug taking cannot answer that.

When I was young I used to get headaches thinking. How naive and dumb I was. Life is all about experience.

Back in 2010 when the sleep paralysis & OBE restarted after 25 years of remission I got in touch with a group that does OBEs. I never had the discipline to get into that because my priorities back then were my kids. But they gave me the best advice:

Don't try to rationalize too much the experiences you stumble upon. Feel them.Go with the flow. Do they feel real? So, they maybe are. Are they oniric? Oh well we will never be sure, but they feel real and they are learning experiences anyway.
​

BTW _ some of these people Brazilians into OBE say they actually work in the astral with deceased people who are not aware they died; help with the separation of the body/spirit after accidents, especially if they are large accidents; and other things in which there is a need of the "living"energy. The whole theme is fascinating, but it is one of those I would go into only after I can be conscious in altered states in order not to be fascinated about it and start imagining things.

BACK TO VALLEE:
Any thoughts on his control system?
Do you also feel he is hiding something?

 

[DissectionStalker]

These ideas fascinate me, and the paper (DMT entities) touches it when it states how hard is to research it just because we don't know if DMT is all between our ears or is a gate to other realm.

It is both -don't you know. Wink.

I mean, are we really separate from anything? Isn't that an illusion? At least at the molecular and smaller levels or grandiose Universe levels? Once inside the mind we can go down, down, down, to wherever that is and stretched up, up, up to an infinity. You're just isolating yourself to think you're somehow separate from anything!

We normally have two mind frequencies that we tune reality in most of the time that we can be conscious of -being awake and dream sleep. OBE's and Meditation are probably two more unique reality frequencies.

EVERYTHING is running on chemical reactions too, so altering the chemistry will "tune" the brain frequency to an alternative consciousness. I believe the Amazon Shamans and those with plant/spore mind tuners knew/know about these other worlds. I honestly believe these might be more real than what we know here, but it's just that we have such limited experience or no experience to understand any of it. Even time is altered in there too!

Youtube probably has a lot of accounts about this, and there is plenty to read about it too.

As long as you don't O.D., and are not fearful, and get good plants/spores, and have a good setting, and safe place, then these realms are worth exploring, imo.

I'm very excited you're exploring one of the realms very soon!!!

 

[Ufocurious]

It is both -don't you know. Wink.

See how I left the grinning smile on the quote? it is how I feel. LOL
I gotta go. It is 6:37 an the day ahead of me is looooong.Luckily I slept very early last night.
Have a nice day!

 

[Burnt State]

BACK TO VALLEE:
Any thoughts on his control system?
Do you also feel he is hiding something?

Vallée's writing always comes across as authentic, inventive, engaging and probing. He pushes the edges of the ufo phenomenon discussion based on first hand research, interviews and good data. There's never a sense that he's hiding anything. He's just one more fish, a very capable fish mind you, hooked on the UFO curiosity and it took him a long time swimming in the deep to produce what he has: an impressive set of unique, changing and challenging thoughts on the mystery.

Regarding the control system theory - it's one that does challenge our thinking about our own place, purpose and function on the planet. We may be mice in the maze or Pavlov's dog, but there does seem to be the sense that we are sometimes subject and sometimes object. Personally I feel the phenomenon is here to make us think and to change us. Unfortunately, we have allowed ourselves to be changed on mundane and superficial levels (cults, contactees & belief systems) instead of thinking much more about the conundrum.

 

[DissectionStalker]

Do you also feel he is hiding something?

When Vallee says "on air" that you have to read his fiction books to understand what he can't write otherwise, then I think he is telling you where he is "hiding" at least many of his secrets.

He signs an NDA with Bigelow, so 'that' is hidden.

He keeps most of his ET-UFO cases he is personally working on private, so 'that' is hidden.

He has demonstrated he was very concerned about "the spooks" connected to the Pentacle memo, so he hid it behind a picture and framed it for Hynek.

Vallee knows A LOT MORE than we know, because he does not share all information. He is extremely careful to not implicate some suspects that I think he knows have done some dangerous and/or immoral PSYOPS and/or experiments that are Covert and Classified relating to ET-UFO's.

Any thoughts on his control system?

Yes, there are many, and I want to understand. Maybe "they" will send me a UFO ride in the Sky. I think my mind is a control system, and "they" can hack into it too! Wink.

 

[Constance]

Dissection Stalker, in response to your first five points concerning Vallee:

Yes,
yes,
yes,
yes,
&
yes.


Edit to add: It's a safe assumption that had he been of age during WWII he would not have been a member of the Resistance.

 

[Burnt State]

Dissection Stalker, in response to your first five points concerning Vallee:

Yes,
yes,
yes,
yes,
&
yes.


Edit to add: It's a safe assumption that had he been of age during WWII he would not have been a member of the Resistance.

I'm not sure what you are implying here, that he would have done nothing during WWII in France or handed over his Jewish neighbours? His moral, socio-political leanings & positive spirit of revolution are found throughout his work. So i'm nor sure what this roasting of Vallée is about. If anything he has expressed a very deep critique of how the UFO phenomenon has been used at the deepest of levels by the PTB. His critiques, unlike the one of him up above, are not conspiratorial & grossly insulting, but in fact challenges how power manipulates the belief systems of the masses. His unwavering disdain for cultists and militarists who create such events is quite eviden throughout his writings. In Revelations he openly talks about psychological operations as a likely reality in abduction cases.

He does not keep cases to himself - he prefers to investigate cases not already trampled on, but those that come to him privately and then he writes about them publicly. He has supplied us with the best criticism and evolving, possible ways of thinking through the UFO phenomenon to date of any ufologist. He has exposed how ufo cover ups, plots and deception work. He is liberal with his critiques of many agencies, not in cahoots with them. His promotion of a free and open database of historical cases as evident in his last book along with the many unique ones he has investigated personally deserve more than veiled suggestions he would be a Nazi collaborator when his writing suggests otherwise.

"My friend, French Résistance leader Jacques Bergier, who was tortured multiple times by the Gestapo, made the ludicrous "confession" that his network planned to invade Corsica. In reality they were looking for heavy water and for Werner von Braun's rocket base.

As a child of World War Two who remembers its limitless horrors, my revulsion at the practices of Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib was so great that it took me a while to realize the more positive implications: if our henchmen used waterboarding, a practice so primitive it placed us in the same hateful historical imagery as the caves of the Inquisition and the cellars of the Nazi, this can only mean that all the fancy interrogation drugs developed in classified labs in the 60s and 70s have failed: there is no truth serum. We should be relieved about that."

From Jaques Vallée's article critiquing the American gov't directly: Jacques Vallee: Waterboarding's curious corollaries - Boing Boing

I don't know where you two are coming from but it's way off track.

 

[Ufocurious]

I don't know where you two are coming from but it's way off track

I instigated it. I am the kind of person that has to look all around any issue in order to make a decision. However I usually express my gut feelings too early. As much as I love his ideas and respect his work, I found a little mistake in one of his books.* As a researcher in architecture I was surprised. That little mistake could not be there. My gut feeling told me heavy editing may have let that happen. My "antennas" rose right up. What is happening here? Then there is this NDA with Bigelow, who is kinda shady. The antennas started to move around really quickly.Finally, I looked (control f only in pdfs, very shallow of me) for the name General Uchoa in his writings and found only one entry, and it was about as him having no clout in some conference in Brasilia. It is not important. The thing is: General Uchoa was one of the most famous ufologists in Brazil. But he was also openly a spiritual man, universalist but with a lot of respect for theosophy. And he was also a contactee. The fact that Vallee comes to Brazil and do not mention Uchoa rose my antennas even more. Maybe Vallee's deception with ET cultists made him have a bias to it all, mixing up the good and the bad. I don't know. I have not had the time to investigate it further.

What I mean by heavy editing: suppress info that does not make a difference to the outcome. However, that can hide a desire to steer the attention somewhere else by an author. In this case he could just have named the city without mistakenly calling it a suburb. If he did this in one innocuous thing, could he have done it in other parts as well? It just bothered me so much!

* name and status of a town. Niteroi is the former capital of the state of Rio de Janeiro. In his book he calls it a suburb of Rio.

 

[Constance]

I'm not sure what you are implying here, that he would have done nothing during WWII in France or handed over his Jewish neighbours?

Nothing so immoral as turning over Jewish neighbors or collaborating with the Nazis. But I suspect he would not have put himself at risk as a fighter or spy in the French Resistance based on his leaving the US and the ufo research project here as soon as he read the Pentacle memorandum and sensed a possible personal risk in staying. I also wonder why he kept Pentacle's identity a secret for so many years afterward. Both he and Hynek should have stood together and learned what they could of the secret controllers -- and, by the evidence of the memo, manipulators -- of the major ufo data, and when they knew enough, disclosed or at least leaked the information to other researchers and the public. He seems to be a man who plays it safe and likes to keep himself above the fray, unreachable and untouchable. Hynek was no better in the courage department. Sorry if my opinion of Vallee's character offends you, Burnt.

 

[Constance]

Curious, I don't think you should feel that you instigated this small outbreak of criticisms of St. Jacques.

 

[DissectionStalker]

So i'm nor sure what this roasting of Vallée is about. If anything he has expressed a very deep critique of how the UFO phenomenon has been used at the deepest of levels by the PTB. His critiques, unlike the one of him up above, are not conspiratorial & grossly insulting, but in fact challenges how power manipulates the belief systems of the masses. His unwavering disdain for cultists and militarists who create such events is quite evident throughout his writings. In Revelations he openly talks about psychological operations as a likely reality in abduction cases.

Ok, for some reason are you suggesting I'm "conspiratorial and grossly insulting" ???

I want to be clear I am NOT attempting to be grossly insulting towards Vallee, but I think he is "an insider" that gets "whispered" a lot of secret and privileged information that might still be technically classified in some instances. I don't know of any conspiracy he is involved with, nor do I suggest that, but Vallee says himself that he can not publicly reveal information he knows! He says you must read "between the lines" in his books that are FICTION to understand what he is getting at.

I do NOT think he is afraid of law suits, when he is saying this. The fear is much deeper than that for sure. Imo.

He does not keep cases to himself - he prefers to investigate cases not already trampled on, but those that come to him privately and then he writes about them publicly.

Vallee definitely keeps many of his "personal interest" cases completely private and never says anything publicly about some of these. I've heard him discuss this myself.

He has supplied us with the best criticism and evolving, possible ways of thinking through the UFO phenomenon to date of any ufologist. He has exposed how ufo cover ups, plots and deception work. He is liberal with his critiques of many agencies, not in cahoots with them. His promotion of a free and open database of historical cases as evident in his last book along with the many unique ones he has investigated personally deserve more than veiled suggestions he would be a Nazi collaborator when his writing suggests otherwise.

Wholly crap, what's with the Nazi collaborator suggestions??? Now, you're being conspiratorial???

He worked on Bigelow's database that is NDA, and it's not available to the public.

As a child of World War Two who remembers its limitless horrors, my revulsion at the practices of Guantanamo and Abu Ghraib was so great that it took me a while to realize the more positive implications: if our henchmen used waterboarding, a practice so primitive it placed us in the same hateful historical imagery as the caves of the Inquisition and the cellars of the Nazi, this can only mean that all the fancy interrogation drugs developed in classified labs in the 60s and 70s have failed: there is no truth serum. We should be relieved about that."

This is a HUGE MISTAKE for Vallee to suggest this. He is mistaken. Why? The USA has sent many captured "battlefield" [and "taken"] prisoners to foreign lands where these people have been tortured "off the books" with UNKNOWN techniques that will have definitely included drugging IMO. I do not think for one second that many drug choices would have definitely been used vs water-boarding, AND this proves, in my mind, just how naive Vallee may be to write this nonsense. He has NO IDEA what all was used, when and where, etc., but I strongly suggest he made a GROSS ERROR to suggest these drugs have failed. No way! The water boarding is known TO FAIL, so his logic is a failure in this matter, imo. No, I don't think this is a conspiracy or cover-up with Vallee's thinking, but he made a big mistake to write that.

Vallee is fallible like all of us.

 

[Ufocurious]

We have to learn to disagree openly in order to keep a healthy discussion.
I do not play games or launch baits. I truthfully expose my points of view, but sometimes I jump ahead without analysing it properly. I do have to learn to cover all bases and write everything with an evidence behind.
I think Carrion said something like this, "I might be wrong, but it has to be proven."
I, Ufocurious, do like to be proven wrong. It works as a building block in solid thinking.

 

[DissectionStalker]

I, Ufocurious, do like to be proven wrong. It works as a building block in solid thinking.

I agree with this 100% despite what others may think I'm attempting to do.

Let me be clear what I attempt to do: I think of every way it may be possible Humans are doing any incident relating to ET or UFO's. There is too much jumping to conclusions that ET or a UFO did it, when it is at least just as likely there is a Human cause. Period. This is my purpose to consider the Human causes FIRST, THEN ALSO consider ET's or UFO's that is NOT Human caused.

I believe there could be at least two causes for each event, so I just assign probabilities to each cause. But I KNOW how dangerous Humans are, so I make no assumptions to take Humans out of the equation.

Vallee is at the very top on my list of Ufologists. I think he has presented a lot of Human causes for ET's and UFO's that I believe he is very close to the truth. I hope he continues to do serious ET-UFO research, and that he can present his findings publicly too! I really do hope he remains active in this field, and I hope his health remains excellent to continue for many years to come. He has offered the best alternative theories that I think make the most sense, though I don't think he has found "the truth". He is much closer to the truth, imo.

 

[Soupie]

The Zimbabwe Ariel school encounter was compelling. Want to know what’s going on with that in today’s terms?

And I thought that it had been all but forgotten.

Ariel Phenomenon: Encounter in Ruwa – The Ariel School UFO Sighting Documentary | John E. Mack Institute

Carter has no doubt the children were telling the truth. “When they were interviewed by Mack with all his professional skills it was clear they were telling the truth — their voice tone, their body language. They were so consistent, they told their stories with such conviction. And they spoke about it in their own language. One child recalled being told by the alien that we should not be so ‘techknowledged’ — why make up something like that?”

This fascinates me endlessly.

Let's take it as legit for a second: why would a presumably technologically advanced species warn human children to not be so "technologized."

Is this like an adult alcoholic warning a child not to drink beer? Been there, done that? Isn't it a tad hypocritical of the alien - who just exited a shiny metal craft - to warn against technology use?

Regarding the control system theory - it's one that does challenge our thinking about our own place, purpose and function on the planet. We may be mice in the maze or Pavlov's dog, but there does seem to be the sense that we are sometimes subject and sometimes object. Personally I feel the phenomenon is here to make us think and to change us. Unfortunately, we have allowed ourselves to be changed on mundane and superficial levels (cults, contactees & belief systems) instead of thinking much more about the conundrum.

I've had discussions with fundamentalist Christians who argue that God is very real and directly involved in our lives. They take the story of original sin and salvation literally.

My question has always been: If this is indeed the case, why not be more direct in sharing this very important information with us?

And it's the same in the occult as well; the belief that UHIs are guiding us to become our "higher selves." And again, it's the same with DMT/Ayahausca: the spirit of the vine guides people (sometimes) toward inner growth.

Burnt, you seem to suggest the same with this Vallee-esque UAP/UHI control system. Is it the same control system (stimulus) just wrapped up in a different guise?

Again, we have these schools of thought suggesting that the human race is being subtly guided/controlled by some UHI.

Let's take the above scenario as being factual for a moment: there is an unidentified, higher than human intelligence which has subtly been interacting with humans physically and mentally since the dawn of mankind.

1) What is the identity of the higher intelligence(s)?

2) What is the motive(s) for controlling/guiding humans, and

3) Why is the interaction so subtle?