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that disturbing shit video

celia

chupa chupa
from paracast tv that you posted looks like it is from a military tank or stryker..I didn't watch the whole thing because I am getting what what you thought was disturbing.

In Iraq, US and Iraqi soldiers riding in a military vehicle, especially a tank, humvee or stryker have the right a way, thus other vehicles need to move from its path. They need to get where they are going. I saw some cars moving and some cars not knowing they had to, it seems.

I wasn't sure if you knew that or not but it is a normal thing. My husband was in Iraq twice and that is who they operate. :D
 
True, it's done because they are most open to attack when they are standing still and a large percentage of ambushes come when they get bogged down in traffic at intersections.

I think however, what David might find disturbing is a few things, some that I took note of having seen this video many times before on youtube,

#1, the driver of that Humvee clearly exercised poor judgment with regards to some very close calls with young children and adults walking on the street.

#2, The only indicator of their presence is them apparently honking the horn the entire time they are driving. I have seen this same scene done right by private contractors performing travel in convoys where the vehicles were fitted with sirens, and people have no problem getting out of the way.

#3, Trust me that by now there is nobody in Iraq who doesn't know that they must move aside for military vehicles, however often teenage boys handed large trucks and told to drive and don't stop, get a little bit out of hand at times. The small passenger bus in the video is a perfect example, the driver of that bus had no rear view whatsoever, and frankly having been to Arab countries, I can say that honking horns are a constant presence. Pulling that Nascar style bump and run, give 'em the chrome horn bit, on a vehicle like that bus was premature and frankly just done for kicks from the looks of it, the driver needed time to see them and indeed find somewhere that the bus could actually be pulled aside. If you notice the streets are loaded with parked cars leaving only a single car width of roadway for driving.

There is something called common sense which many very young boys who are tossed into situations like that are greatly lacking. Codes of conduct don't go out the window just because you are in a battle zone, soldiers can and do get held to account for their actions. You might notice that none of the riders in that vehicle chose to show anything that might identify them? Command does look at what is being posted by combat troops on Youtube, they aren't idiots, they see this stuff. I can also say that the American military hands out tens of thousands of dollars a day to Iraqi people for damage done to property, houses, cars, livestock, and yes even people. They have claims offices set up where the Iraqi people can go, they submit their claim, it's quickly reviewed and they are handed cash money to compensate for their losses.

Smashing some shitty 20 year old vehicle with a Hummer may be just fun for some, but when that shit old vehicle is all you own in the world, and you make your living as a cab driver or a delivery guy, it's a big deal.

as always, just my not so humble opinion. :rolleyes:
 
What do you mean, the shoe is on the other foot every day in this country.

We have people that are shot by cops every day. We have people who are tazed to death every day, who hadn't done anything.

People should worry about what is going to happen here in a couple years.
 
Your right about moving aside for military vehicles, they should know by now.

Don't you know to pull aside when you see an ambulance coming behind you or a cop car??
 
This is sooo simple:

How would WE feel if the shoe were on the other foot?

Ponder this thought.

dB

If I were driving and saw a military vehicle behind me belonging to someone we were at war with, you bet your socks i would pull that sucker over lol
 
If I were driving and saw a military vehicle behind me belonging to someone we were at war with, you bet your socks i would pull that sucker over lol

I didn't relies we were at war with the Iraqi people, my mistake,but good to know.
 
I didn't relies we were at war with the Iraqi people, my mistake,but good to know.

I thought the same, but will hold my comments, wouldn't even know where to start commenting on that one, and don't want to offend the OP because she seems like a nice person. :)
 
Celia said:
"I wasn't sure if you knew that or not but it is a normal thing. My husband was in Iraq twice and that is who they operate."
Doesn't make it right. Perhaps they should read "How to Win Friends and Influence People". If you behave like this people will hate you.
"Don't you know to pull aside when you see an ambulance coming behind you or a cop car??"
Yeah because if you don't see it or hear it, it's going to ram you off the road. Makes perfect sense.
"I don't find that as disturbing as marines throwing puppies off cliffs"
That is disturbing but I wonder how disturbed you'd be if Iraqi children were being thrown off cliffs. It was a miracle that vehicle didn't kill someone and you can bet money on the fact that people were injured when it was ramming cars. Just a mild vehicular impact can cause serious injury.
"If I were driving and saw a military vehicle behind me belonging to someone we were at war with, you bet your socks i would pull that sucker over lol"
It's hilarious. It only becomes serious when there are American lives at risk. I can't imagine why so much of the world hates America.
 
Celia said:
"I wasn't sure if you knew that or not but it is a normal thing. My husband was in Iraq twice and that is who they operate."
Doesn't make it right. Perhaps they should read "How to Win Friends and Influence People". If you behave like this people will hate you.
"Don't you know to pull aside when you see an ambulance coming behind you or a cop car??"
Yeah because if you don't see it or hear it, it's going to ram you off the road. Makes perfect sense.
"I don't find that as disturbing as marines throwing puppies off cliffs"
That is disturbing but I wonder how disturbed you'd be if Iraqi children were being thrown off cliffs. It was a miracle that vehicle didn't kill someone and you can bet money on the fact that people were injured when it was ramming cars. Just a mild vehicular impact can cause serious injury.
"If I were driving and saw a military vehicle behind me belonging to someone we were at war with, you bet your socks i would pull that sucker over lol"
It's hilarious. It only becomes serious when there are American lives at risk. I can't imagine why so much of the world hates America.

Yea it does make it right if you are on a mission and need to get to an objective, they do what they have to, simple as that. it is a war zone, you don't hand out icecream to everyone.

How can you not see a big military vehicle behind you blaring it's horn, you either have to be deaf, dumb or blind or hopefully those people weren't since they were driving a car ;D
 
I thought the same, but will hold my comments, wouldn't even know where to start commenting on that one, and don't want to offend the OP because she seems like a nice person. :)

It is a war, not a on the Iraqi people but a "war on terror" and my comment was example and not meant to spark further debate by reaching deep into what i did say to produce something else that i didn't.

This thread was not up for a debate but I was only stating that it does happen and it is a required action in a war zone. Iraqi vehicles do it too.
 
"Yea it does make it right if you are on a mission and need to get to an objective, they do what they have to, simple as that. it is a war zone, you don't hand out icecream to everyone."
So the ends justify the means. Just following orders. That was not acceptable in WWII and it sure as hell isn't acceptable now. Say you or a loved one were one of the people killed or injured as a result of this kind of behaviour.- would you find it acceptable? "Oh, well my son got killed but hey the American guys were on some kind of a mission so that's OK then." Do you have no empathy for other human beings at all? Do you only care about people if they are American?

Let me tell you something. The 20th century was the American century and now the empire is falling. We all know it's happening. Let's say in 20 years or 50 years or whenever, some other more powerful country invades America and behaves in exactly the same way. Will you (assuming you're still alive) be happy to be mistreated by the invading and occupying army because they're "on a mission and need to get to an objective". Would you find it acceptable if they killed your grandchildren because they had to get to an objective. Would you be satisfied with that kind of answer?
 
It is a war, not a on the Iraqi people but a "war on terror" and my comment was example and not meant to spark further debate by reaching deep into what i did say to produce something else that i didn't.
There were no terrorists in Iraq until the invasion. War on Terror - perhaps a war on stupidity would be more fruitful.

What have the Iraqi people done wrong? First they were terrorised by Saddam and now they are terrorised by occupying forces.
 
Let's put everything in perspective.

Celia, I don't know about your personal life, but if I guess that your husband was over in Iraq while you two were involved, you've already paid a heavy price for this "war". I don't think you deserve any bashing about your husband's role in the occupation. Members of the military are in a terrible position with this whole thing, they're trying to do their job and duty, and the fact that they were sent off to Iraq on false premises perpetuated by the true war criminals in this case - Bush, Rumsfeld, Cheney, Wolfowitz, Rice and all the others involved in this situation - that fact is not part of the soldier's reality. They're in a hellish situation, and they have my total sympathy, as do their family members. I know how I feel when I don't see my honey for more than a few days, but to think I would not see her for a year, while being involved with the ugliness that happens on a daily basis in Iraq, just makes me shiver.

On the other hand, Celia, realize that we are not in Iraq because of terrorism, that notion is so deeply problematic that it's essentially the equivalent of a deep insult to those of us who are looking at the bigger picture. There was no good reason for us to go into Iraq. To call that occupation a "war" is an abomination, IMO. It's totally dishonest, thrust upon an American populace with little understanding of global history and current events. The behavior in the video I posted is deeply disturbing, and it tells you a LOT about how our country is now perceived in the world outside of the big, ugly bubble we've created for ourselves. We're out of control, we're thrusting our military might into places we DO NOT BELONG, and for all the wrong reasons. Any sympathy anyone else had towards us after 9.11 has been completely trashed, to the extent that when the next Islamic Fundamentalist action takes place, much of the world will proclaim that we deserve it. I'm not saying that we do, but imagine how you'd feel if you were Iraqi, and your family members were tortured inside of an American-controlled detention facility. Our actions in Iraq have created an intensely anti-American sentiment that will last for a lot longer than we want to imagine. We are NOT safer for having invaded a country which posed ZERO military threat against us directly, we've created a monster that wants your blood, my blood, we've ALL got the blood of Iraqi civilians and children on our hands. Make no mistake - this immoral, illegal "war" will be seen by future historians as the sign of the true beginning of the end of the American empire.

dB
 
Well said David, I feel we in the UK are also at a much higher threat of reprisals because of our involvment in Iraq. Everytime something like this happens a new generation of terrorists is created. The only way to solve these sorts of problems is to reduce people's grievances, instead all our governments and military do is increase them.
 
Indeed, well put David. As a Canadian I can say that we feel it greatly as well, I ask myself everyday why Canadian men and women are dying in Afghan combat because we have had to take over the combat role in Helmand province because all of the US troops are in Iraq. It's not our war, nor should it be.

Yet I can remember our own Lt. General Romeo Dallaire, a man with brass balls the size of grapefruit, who was in command of the UN mission in Rwanda during the genocide, and he begged for help to stop the carnage, and the US was the one country who could have changed it with a single word at the UN in New York, yet everyone stood by and watched as hundreds of thousands died and General Dallaire stood in the way with fewer then 100 men, no equipment and no ammunition, and said

"No, I will not let this happen on my watch"

...and in Dallaire's own words, with tears in his eyes "and nobody came to Rwanda"


Why? Because there is no oil in Rwanda.


The old days of WWII when the American people were seen as heroes and the greatest country in the world are long over. We all know what it's about and terrorism isn't on the list. As a country with one tenth of your population, our military resources are completely overwhelmed with the task of combat missions to control the Taliban forces. Unlike in your country where the media are prevented from accessing air bases, our news channels are there on the tarmac when the flag covered coffins are carried off of the transport planes, we see it on the evening news when they make the long journey down the highway from the airbase to Ottawa where they undergo their autopsy and prep for their funerals. The highway has even been officially renamed "The Highway of Heroes"

We all know the truth about the neo-con objectives and how they steer what happens with military action in the Middle East, hell I contract for one of the largest oil companies in the world Exxon Mobil, I'm not kidding myself about where my paychecks are coming from, they come off the backs of poor people in Middle Eastern countries, we know why we are over there and Usamah Bin Ladin has nothing to do with it.

Indeed the US has lost any respect it might have once had amongst it's allied countries. This is why NATO is dying and has lost most of it's support from it's member states. I know that when our commitment ends in Afghanistan in the next couple years, the Canadian people will be lynching our politicians in the streets if they don't bring our troops home. Fact is we were never a target before, but thanks to our conservative politicians and their support of the neo-cons in the Bush administration, we are now considered a target by extremist Muslim factions and that IS scary.
 
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