The Clueless One is Annoying

[ondafritz]

How about global moderation? Why must we always endure extremes?

I agree Gene,
I believe that we are close, if not capable already, to almost totally renounce our need of fossil fuels. Nobody would be happier than me to tell OPEC and the oil companies to take the black gold and shove it!

And I am a conservative!

 

[Tommy Allison]

For starters, I don't drink the koolaid that Fox News offers. Second, there's nothing wrong with believing in a God. Thirdly, your pedestrian attempts to marginalize those who disagree with you are laughable.

My attitude, or my contempt for those who do nothing but parrot the talking points of the liberal elite isn't meant to insult you. The problem here is that every single person who touts the global warming myth, all cite the same articles, the same words, the same everything, because they believe in their heart of hearts it's always gotta be man's fault, but heaven forbid a kid picks up a hand gun, because then it's the gun's fault.

I'm willing to bet good money that you're probably in the same camp of people who want to ban gun ownership.

You can find fault with behavior you don't like. Riding bicycles is good. Owning guns is bad. Public transportation is good. Concealed Carry is bad. Conservation of animals and land is good. Hunting animals is bad. Biofuels are good. Owning the car you want is bad. Taxation is good. Industrialization is bad. Restrictions and laws are good. Freedom to travel, and buy or produce what you want is bad.

Every single person who falls into the camp of Global Warming Is The Fault Of Humans, is cut from the same cloth. They believe that only THEY can dictate how things in the world should be run, and believe that every single human being isn't fit or capable to think for themselves.

I for one do not need someone to tell me how to live my life from cradle to grave, which is exactly what the agenda of the global warming movement is. It's about behavioral modification that isn't about self reliance, it's about co-dependence. The Environmentalist movement is a front for a Communist agenda, nothing more.

If you don't respect me, or you think I'm being mean spirited, I'm sorry, but I won't apologize for the truth. I don't have to. The people who cry out they're somehow being victimized because I don't agree with their nonsense is just childish because they're losing their argument.

I spouted off because If the so called aliens are here for our benefit, then they certainly don't need to hide their goodness, or share with only "special" individuals. I take great offense at the people who continue to go on and on about the whole new age movement like it's a good thing. It's not. It's about losing one's independence, one's sovereignty, one's individuality, and surrendering to a collective mentality where the lowest common denominator rules.

If you can't see the truth for what it is, then that's your problem. We choose what offends us. I'm offended by ignorance.

 

[CapnG]

That's a bowl full of assumptions, Tommy, too bad almost none of them apply to me. Nice tarring with a broad brush though, extremely well thought out.

I'm willing to bet good money that you're probably in the same camp of people who want to ban gun ownership.

You'd lose that bet. I don't care for guns personally but that doesn't mean someone else can't have one if they wish.

You can find fault with behavior you don't like.

So can you (and clearly do). But what the hell does that have to do with anything? Pot? Kettle? Black?

Riding bicycles is certainly good for you but cars are better for getting around. Owning guns is a personal choice. Public transportation sucks. Conservation of animals and land IS good up to certain limits. Hunting animals is unecessary unless it's for population control issues (don't gimme that "right of manhood" BS). Biofuels are a nice idea but relatively untested in the open marketplace. Owning the car you want is fine, just don't gripe about the price you pay to fuel it. Taxation is necessary. Industrialization is inevitable and necessary. Restrictions and laws are necessary. Freedom to travel, and buy or produce what you want is great but doing so in a way that maximizes your profits while minimalizing environmental damage is better.

Every single person who falls into the camp of Global Warming Is The Fault Of Humans, is cut from the same cloth.

I did not say GW was entirely the fault of humans and I am not part of a "camp" or a "movement" or a "crusade" or any other BS political posturing. I'm my own person with my own ideas, not a liberal or a conservative, a centrist. Apparently that's new to you.

The Environmentalist movement is a front for a Communist agenda, nothing more.

The Communist agenda is an archaic American boogeyman and nothing more. Nobody's redder than China but that doesn't stop trillions in annual global trade does it? It's 2007 not 1957, McCarthy.

If you can't see the truth for what it is, then that's your problem. We choose what offends us. I'm offended by ignorance.

The truth is what you believe it is. As far as I'm concerned, an international conference of over 2000 scientists declaring global warming a real problem with a human root is not a source of ignorance. A relative handful of scientists in the backpocket of the oil industry declaring the opposite on the other hand, is not a reliable source of knowledge.

The human race's ability to pollute this planet in terms of chemicals in the water, garbage on land and toxins in the atmosphere is all extremely well documented and reliable, a matter of historical fact and yet when it comes to the global temperature, hell there's NO WAY we could effect that...

It's clear that you're like most other right-wingers; anyone left of you MUST be a tree-hugging, vegan, gun hating hippie. And you accuse me of ignorance... But whatever, I'm done hijacking this thread, there's already a global warming thread in the conspiracy forum.

 

[Tommy Allison]

Please... Could you be any more transparent?

If the Communist agenda is such a boogeyman, then how come our country adopted 9 of the 10 planks of communism after World War II? Oh, but you probably never bothered to read Karl Marx, and Engel's Communist Manifesto have you?

If I sound sarcastic, or mean spirited, it's because most people like yourself don't bother to take a hard look at the facts that have nothing to do with global warming, to see that it is yet another mote in a flawed plan to create a two class society, where there's a small elite ruling class, and the rest of us are just serfs.

 

[Brian Now]

Let's think on this for a moment.

I in no way advocate a dirty planet. What you fail to understand, as it is with people who cannot be convinced otherwise of their point of view, is that Man Made Global Warming is a hoax. Consider this for one moment.

In the 1600's , it was hotter than it is today. Yes, that's right moron, it was hotter than it is today.

We need some moderation in this forum when people can't discuss things without resorting to name calling.

 

[Gene Steinberg]

We need some moderation in this forum when people can't discuss things without resorting to name calling.

We don't want to be overly intrusive. You have the right to ignore posts that you don't like, and certainly, if someone is unduly offensive, beyond minor insults, we'll take care of it.

 

[wezzy]

You people who believe that humans are destroying the planet, need to take a good hard look at who's doing the most destroying. The United States has the most stringent laws on the Environment AS IT IS!!! When is China, India, Africa, Russia, and the EU going to be brought to heel?

if it isn't humans who are destroying the planet who is?

aren't we cutting forests down the size of countries every year (amazon etc)?
all the animals living in those cut down forests dying or being displaced?

aren't we fishing the sea empty and endangering many animal species to the point extinction?

remember this little guy?...yea i wonder what happened to him

aren't we polluting our seas and rivers
aren't we polluting our air with the gazillions of factory/cars spewing out decease inducing unhealthy smoke 24/7?

say what you will but humans have absolutely no positive effect on this planet
its kind of a no brainer that earth and all its creatures would be better of without us

so YES humans ARE destroying the world it doesn't matter which country has the best environmental laws this isn't about nationality its about mankind as a whole

 

[Tommy Allison]

How much math do you do any given day?

I remember being a kid in school, some 30 years ago, and they cried about how we were going to run out of trees, oil, and everything else.

We were supposedly cutting down a million acres of rainforest a year. Well, do the math. There isn't that much rainforest in the whole world, if you break it down over 30 years.

Just like oil seems to be a natural product of the earth, not dead dinosaur slop. That's why dry oil wells seem to magically refill themselves.

I get sick of people screaming about how humanity is sooooooo powerful, and so destructive. If the earth has a major quake, it can destroy us pretty easily. Humans are no different than the monkeys you see in the zoo. We just have different cages, and some more autonomy.

What's funny to me, is the people who keep crying about how humanity is responsible, but yet totally ignore the rise in temperature of the planets in our solar system. They forget that we've never had people or SUV's on Mars, and yet the temperature is rising. Kind of like how Jupiter spawned that second storm. Are you guys going to tell me that the earth is so hot that we're warming up the solar system? I would hope not.

We've seen a huge increase of solar radiation over the last decade. This year alone we've seen some of the most profound sunspot and solar flare activity, and that energy has to go somewhere.

In 10 years when the global temperature takes a dive, and it will, because weather again is cyclical, all you crazy people who think we humans are destroying the earth can pat yourselves on the back for doing absolutely nothing to change the temperature.

Much like every other pseudo science, and it is exactly that, Global Warming is a myth to get people to live a different way that will drastically change people's lives and not necessarily for the better. In fact, the only way to truly live in the paradigm set by the people who are crying the loudest about global warming, is to reduce the Earth's population by about 90 percent.

Let's just hope that none of us free thinking types survive the great purge.

I'm done talking about this stuff. Sorry I called someone a moron, it wasn't meant to be as spiteful as it came off. I also wasn't calling that person a "name". I label people who don't think in those terms. You don't have a right to go through life unoffended.

 

[Tommy Allison]

P.S. The Clueless One has a very retarded article in UFO Magazine this month, where he interviews himself.

Yeah, like I said, it's retarded.

 

[scott]

Expressing hatred for people who care about other people or the planet is at the core of what's wrong with our political discourse over the last several years. There are plenty of models for this behavior: Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Hannity, Savage, Coulter, etc. They defend their argument by attacking, labeling, minimalizing. Because so many of us have been wanting our troops out of Iraq, we're called Cut-and-Runners, Cowards, even Traitors. Like it or not, we are all in this thing together. Being a vibrant part of the whole is a far cry from being a serf, a communist or a moron.

But back to Mr. Vaeni: He's part of a growing movement that seems to jibe with Tracie Austin-Peters and Steven Greer. I think their accounts don't smell true. What do you make of it? Their perspective is radically different than the most credible abductee account on record, that of Betty and Barney Hill:
The Betty and Barney Hill Abduction, Part 1-UFO Casebook Files

Nancy Talbott (see Dec 3, Paracast), a scientist and someone who sounds rational and credible to me, says she feels very benevolent sensations around the crop circles she investigates. What's that about? Her own sighting of a UFO as a child echoes David Biedny's in Caracas. They didn't encounter aliens, but the UFOs appear as shocking, cold, threatening. And Jeff Ritzman's stories will make your hair stand on end.

 

[Brian Now]

But back to Mr. Vaeni: He's part of a growing movement that seems to jibe with Tracie Austin-Peters and Steven Greer. I think their accounts don't smell true. What do you make of it? Their perspective is radically different than the most credible abductee account on record, that of Betty and Barney Hill:
The Betty and Barney Hill Abduction, Part 1-UFO Casebook Files

Good idea Scott, back to the matter at hand. Once on a TV show I heard the taped "hypnotic regression" of Barney Hill I think it was. I am pretty sure it was him, but whoever it was it was damn bone-chilling to listen to him relive the moment the aliens turn and look at him. But I am still skeptical about the whole event.
Dr Seth Shostak of SETI has a podcast you can find easily on Itunes if you just put in SETI. The October 6, 2006 episode has an interview with Susan Clancy with Harvard about her book "Abducted". She clearly believes the abduction experience is all in the head of the experiencer. Some will criticize her for using as her interviewees people who responded to an ad with something like "have you been abducted by aliens?" But who can say for sure that people who would respond to a newspaper ad are any less credible than someone anywhere else?

 

[DBTrek]

Left vs. Right.

"99% of Scientists agree it's man made!"

"No you're communists and morons, it's the sun!"

"You're a shill for big oil, it's man made!"

"You're part of the illumanati conspiracy driving us to one world government, it's the sun!"

Maybe it's people type-casting eachother and being political tools that's doing it. All that hot air being blown between left and right has to be having some effect on the temperature.

-DBTrek

 

[Mogwa]

Cannibal galaxies and global warming?
Scientists Now Know: We're From Sagittarius Dwarf Galaxy!
The Krakatoa and Santorini eruptions spewed more deadly toxins and particulate pollution into the atmosphere than humanity has in its entire history. And those were only two relatively minor natural events that our murderously savage Mother Nature has blessed us with. Compared to the Green Ignoramuses sacred Gaia, humanity is strictly amateur class when it comes to destroying the planet's life supporting environment.
I fully agree with Stephen Hawking's contention that we have to get off this planet if our species is to survive. It's a death trap. Those of us who actually bother to research the facts are perfectly willing to surrender control of this world to the gibbering Mud Worshippers, but please, just give us a chance to leave before you start sacrificing infants to your vengeful pantheon.

 

[Tommy Allison]

Expressing hatred for people who care about other people or the planet is at the core of what's wrong with our political discourse over the last several years. There are plenty of models for this behavior: Limbaugh, O'Reilly, Hannity, Savage, Coulter, etc. They defend their argument by attacking, labeling, minimalizing. Because so many of us have been wanting our troops out of Iraq, we're called Cut-and-Runners, Cowards, even Traitors. Like it or not, we are all in this thing together. Being a vibrant part of the whole is a far cry from being a serf, a communist or a moron.

But of course, the liberals couldn't possibly be guilty of the same things. Give me a break. Hatred is a very harsh term for a guy who's only guilty of calling someone a moron. Then again, it's not about truth with people who desperately want to marginalize someone who's telling the truth. You should read this paper called the Delphi method, if you haven't already.

Global warming is laughable. When the temps come back down, as a result of the sun, and not adding 10 million new laws governing cow farts, or how much air you breathe, all the wackos who believe the sky is falling and that humans are destroying the planet will be able to pat themselves on the back. That is if the deathcamps that they run have any people left in them. Remember who brought us the notion of the deathcamp, liberal socialists. What do you think Nazi stands for? National Workers (Arbeite) Sozialist Party!!!

But I digress.

 

[DBTrek]

Uh-oh . . . now that nazi's are in on it. If you believe global warming is man made you're also advocate for creating death camps.

Are you liberals gonna take that?

Mwahahah

-DBTrek

 

[scott]

Take a deep breath, Tommy. Read history. It's easy to find this out. The Nazis murdered all the communists and socialists--as we define "socialists" today. Of all the posts, you're the only one raving. And raving doesn't make what you say sound any more plausible.

The word "conservative" comes from conservation, as in preserving what we have, especially the environment. Until recently most conservatives have been avid environmentalists. Let's get back to a rational place. The very few times you've done that, you've made some interesting points.

 

[valiens]

It's me. The annoying one. Biedney asked me to come respond to this. I said no, I'm tired and defending myself is boring. But it's actually a decent thread so fine. I'll respond. (Thanks for the invite, Mr. B.)

First, I'm not part of any movement.

Second, I'm not a New Age freak.

Third some New Age freakishness IS happening to me. Therefore I must conclude that some of that stuff (the stuff I'm experiencing) is real in spite of the maddening idiots who talk about it.

Fourth, I recognize that there's no getting away from it: because I'm talking about "energy" in me and abductions, I am necessarily lumped in with the people I find to be charlatans/delusional--whether that long list actually includes me or not.

Fifth, due to budget cuts, there is no "fifth."

Sixth, see what I did there?

Seventh...and there?

Eighth, 5-7 are jokes. I like to joke around. That doesn't mean I'm pulling one over on the public by nature of being jovial or too giggly or nervous or whatever. Here's the problem: I'm a total hypocrite. Would this were not happening to me, I'd either be making fun of abductions, et al. or ignoring the subjects entirely. That is the truth. I said that in a skeptics' forum and the general response was that that must be my catch: I'm the jokey, breezy "everyman" type. See, folks? I'm just like you. That's what I'm selling. So if I'm a New Age fruit, I'm selling mush and if I'm not, I'm selling normalcy. Can't really win there, can I?

Ninth, because the energy thing is real and palpable, I figure it's got to be detectable by scientific means. Measurable. In UFO Magazine and in radio interviews I've said "Study me." I've said we can do it on the down-low. It doesn't have to be a publicity stunt; I don't have to write about it. Just, if there's a serious consciousness/brain study out there, I want to partake because this is real and therefore important. I have no idea why I take heat for this (not in here, yet, but elsewhere). Why would I say that if I didn't believe it? If someone took me up on that offer and I were a charlatan, they'd figure it out in about 3 seconds, I'd be exposed, end of book/DVD sales.

Incidentally, I hooked up to an EEG a few weeks ago and got some startling results. Within ten minutes of "activating" this energy, both hemispheres of my brain go to an altered state, and I go Delta-wave dominant, which implies I'm in stages 3-4 of deep sleep. And yet there I am prancing around like a fat white idiot doing martial arts, eyes wide open, and cognizant. For those who know what this means (I keep forgetting), there is "incoherence." I appear to be using 10% more of my brain than normal, within 20 minutes. So that proves if only to myself that I'm not lying, not delusional and, surprisingly, not meditating. What am I doing? I don't know. Again, this requires serious study.

Tenth, book & DVD sales suck. Why? Because it's nearly impossible to make money in this field unless you're a hugely famous person like Whitley Strieber or Stan Friedman. I think the reason is that we've all "been there; done that" with abduction accounts and so mine is just another unresolved drop in the bucket. Who cares, right? Besides, you can get all this info and more for free on the net. No, this is NOT about money. It can't be. It doesn't work that way anymore.

Eleventh, and so on and so forth. You get the point.

If I annoy you, that's fine. I annoy me. I think I have an aweful voice. Whatcha gonna do? And yes, when doing radio or addressing an audience, one's voice tends to take on the aire of showmanship. However, I'm not lying. Whatever you think of the presentation, the contents are as real and honest as can be. When I say "another Ice Age," I'm not relating to you scientific knowledge as I'm not a scientist. I'm not relating some New Age prophesy even if it sounds exactly like that to you. I'm simply explaining what I've been shown and told by these "people" from wherever. If it sounds like I and other abductees are hopping on the bandwagon of a certain new trend in science re: global warming, I caution you to remember: No, actually we were talking about this LONG before it was up for public debate. Public debate & mainstream scientific discourse have caught up with what we've been saying for decades (some of us.) And if that is a fact then what's the next fact? Could it be...gulp...that it's unfolding before our eyes just like it was told to us?

All right I've wasted enough of your eyesight. Hope that clears some things up. Just one more note: The reason these beings don't go to the governments or just stop the carnage before it happens is as I said: "Enlightenment" isn't the Kumbaya BS of the New Age or the "Can't we all just get along" of Rodney King. It's not about veganism and recycling and taking your dog to a pet psychologist to find out why lil' Fido doesn't wanna catch the frisbee.

It's waking up to an entirely new point of view, which is, if you'll pardon the religious tone here, God-self awareness (or oneness.) Not our own egoic sense of self but the real deal shining through these here bodies and informing matter. This requires ego suicide--the death of self while the body lives. Who wants that? I don't want that and I'm the one saying it.

But who knows. Maybe I'll cave and let this energy take over for good and see what happens.

In the end, you're right not to trust me or anyone spewing this stuff. (Again, if it weren't happening to me I would not buy one word of my story.)

Find out for yourself. I submit to you that the moment the brain fully gets, deep down, consciously and unconsciously, that it can never know this other state because the other state is to be lived as, not thought about, pondered, or solved...the moment the brain really gets that, it will shut up if only for a moment. In that moment, the self--which is born of the brain--dies. This energy unfolds and speaks its own language, as it were. Then the fun begins. This is what happened to me and is in me always.

Am I enlightened or a clown?

I don't know. I don't care. You shouldn't either. Make it about you, not me. If me, then I become the object of argument, which is another fine way of putting this transformation off. If that's what you want, fine. And so it goes. If not...then just shut up. On all levels, shut up. It's so simple, it's nearly impossible.

But not impossible.

 

[Brian Now]

Hi Jeremy,

Glad to see you responded to this thread. I have written elsewhere how your description of your experience is what others would call a kundalini awakening. Though there are as many versions of kundalini experiences as there are people who have them, there are common characteristics to all of them. Your experiences (as I have heard from your interview) have these characteristics. Add this to your message of unity and the whole thing sounds really "eastern". I'm not trying to say the East has a monopoly on this sort of thing though.

So do you read or have you ever been interested in/a student of Eastern philosophy (Buddhism, Hinuism, Daoism) ?

 

[valiens]

Hi, Brian:

I've read bits and pieces about kundalini. I try not to read too much in the way of Eastern lit. because I don't want it to color the experience. I'll leaf through books on kundalini and the like now and then in the store just if I'm looking for a correlate to a particular experience I've had, but I try not to too much. I think I'm in a unique position of being a white American with no background in this. To have it come alive in me, what does it mean that I've adopted, in a functional way, a subset of mythology belonging to Eastern--and particularly Buddhist--culture? A subset of mystical arts not born in the Western mind? Now add on the alien abductee part. WTF does it all mean, if anything?

I kinda think it's more important to keep my living this out as pure as possible by not reading up on it so that the unfolding discoveries are real, not colored by someone else's interpretation.

Before this happened, I'd read a lot of Ken Wilber books, which led me to Jiddu Krishnamurti and now I'm finally getting around to UG Krishnamurti. Since the experiences began, I've read one book by Thit Nat Han, one by the Dalai Lama, and 2 by Adi Da who, oddly enough, is a fat white guy from Long Island who evolved into a spiritual guru and eventually a cult leader. His books are especially hard to get through because the kernel of truth is buried in all this cult speak.

So that's it for me. I should add that I find it hard to read most Eastern guru type books because A.) I know from experience where they're wrong and if they're wrong, what false thing am I going to "learn" about the experiences I've not yet had? and B.) most of it comes across to me like I come across to a lot of you: inauthentic.

I began reading the Wilber books and then Krishnamurti before this energy thing started. In fact it was just finally understanding what Jiddu meant that brought on this new other will. I think in that moment of understanding, the "I" persona disolved and this thing welled up like a geiser. Somehow, I'm still here and it's still here and I've not yet suffered any of the ill effects some people report.

A bunch of abductees & I held a festival/conference thingy last weekend. Can't believe I'm awake now. Anyway, Stephen Bassett and a gal pal slept over last night. We had an interesting chat about all this. On saturday I played MC to an entire day/night of speakers and movies. At one point I told about an experience I had involving this energy making my hands rub the back of my neck where the "reptilian brain" is located. It's a long story with an unsatisfying conclusion, but the point is, Bassett's friend, whose name elludes me at the moment, said that she's heard of what I described from a couple of channelers she believes are the real deal. She said she's only ever met two that she believed were what they claimed to be and they both say that their chanelling began with a similar situation and so probably some ethereal being is prepping me to be a channeler.

If that happens, Dave, please shoot me. As much as it embarasses me to be this guy, I really don't want to be that guy.

***

Reading this back now I wonder if the reason it sounds whacked out is partly because it sounds like the language of metaphor but it's literally true. It's literally true that when the "you" steps aside this other thing flowers in its wake. The primary reference point we have for people who talk literally using metaphors are fundie zealots who don't get that the bible is not being literal most of the time. (And, of course, the aforementioned New Agers who read some stuff and then say it aloud until it "becomes true for them," which is completely useless.)

Sucks to share the same language but I don't see a choice.

 

[scott]

Hi Jeremy,

It's so great you have the courage and goodwill to respond to a thread that quickly took on such a vile tone. I never intended for it to degrade into the Bill O'Reilly garbage, but I guess I shouldn't have started the thread with words like "annoying" and "nebbish," and so forth. Cruel on my part, but I was just being honest about how I heard the show.

As you say, the feeling of Oneness is a feeling, not a thought, and erases the individual ego. You may well be the most sincere person having genuine spiritually awakening encounters, but I couldn't figure out why when I listened to you on the Paracast--and I listened several times--it sounded to me like you were steeped in ego, like you were much more concerned with how you came off, and not the message. But of course, I could be wrong. That's why I started the thread, to find out if your rhetoric or "vibe" ressonated with other listeners or annoyed them.

If the aliens see us as living in a dire environmental emergency, I still don't understand why they don't wake up the people in power who could change things the fastest and influence a mass raising of consciousness? Don't you think Martin Luther King raised the consciousness of millions? Ghandi? Mandela? Is that Kumbaya New Age BS? When these people were at their best, they shed their egos and spoke truths that were undeniable--and lifted everyone. They didn't lift egos, they lifted hearts. Is that sappy?

Unless, the aliens don't see us in any sort of emergency and just want to expose a few random people to their sense of non-ego oneness. But you see, that's a huge contradiction. And forgive me, but your sort-of frivolous way of describing humanity dying on the vine doesn't jibe with the feeling of Oneness, which is a feeling of profound connectedness to everything.

Though I accept the underlying message, I don't sense the validity of your story. I would love to be wrong. Perhaps these things are really happening to you, but do they have to be aliens? Couldn't these events be symbolic psychic episodes? Spirits? Given the reports from Jeff Ritzman and so many others, does it sound plausible that behind the scenes, aliens are showing up in bedrooms across the world, teaching people Yoga?