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Atlantis: truth or myth?

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ATLASAXN

Paranormal Novice
I want to introduce myself talking about ...
Plato refers to Atlantis in his dialogues. He says he got this information from the initiates of ancient Egypt. Plato was a serious writer, so this information must be true. It recalls the migration of the Arias that passed through ancient Egypt and went to Atlantis. In antiquity there were several catastrophes that originated legends like the flood. But, tectonic plates, erupting volcanoes (Vesuvius in Pompeii), tsunamis, etc. It happened. It was Atlantis, myth or truth? It was true. This island continent (like Australia) existed and was located in the Atlantic Ocean, as Plato said, after the Pillars of Hercules, that is, after the Strait of Gibraltar. Source: Thinking about
 
I want to introduce myself talking about ...
Plato refers to Atlantis in his dialogues. He says he got this information from the initiates of ancient Egypt. Plato was a serious writer, so this information must be true. It recalls the migration of the Arias that passed through ancient Egypt and went to Atlantis. In antiquity there were several catastrophes that originated legends like the flood. But, tectonic plates, erupting volcanoes (Vesuvius in Pompeii), tsunamis, etc. It happened. It was Atlantis, myth or truth? It was true. This island continent (like Australia) existed and was located in the Atlantic Ocean, as Plato said, after the Pillars of Hercules, that is, after the Strait of Gibraltar. Source: Thinking about

Welcome to the forum. Atlantis seems to be a work of docufiction intended to get people thinking about stuff Plato was into.
 
It may well have been a real place.
We've all seen documentary's that nominate some likely candidates for the actual physical location. Some of this research has been very very good. Matching data from plato's texts with real world locations and attributes.

The real question is was it the place of high technology described by the likes of Cayce , flying vehicles crystal power etc etc.

That aspect i am more skeptical about than its actual existence. But that's just me. Mileage will always vary.
 
It may well have been a real place.
We've all seen documentary's that nominate some likely candidates for the actual physical location. Some of this research has been very very good. Matching data from plato's texts with real world locations and attributes.

The real question is was it the place of high technology described by the likes of Cayce , flying vehicles crystal power etc etc.

That aspect i am more skeptical about than its actual existence. But that's just me. Mileage will always vary.

Mike,
A reference term for another location most likely Antarctica
 
It may well have been a real place.

It was, destroyed by a tidal wave caused by an asteroid strike in the Atlantic.

We've all seen documentary's that nominate some likely candidates for the actual physical location. Some of this research has been very very good. Matching data from plato's texts with real world locations and attributes.

More or less, from north of the coast of Portugal, a chain if large islands, ending on the western side of Cuba.

The real question is was it the place of high technology described by the likes of Cayce , flying vehicles crystal power etc etc.

Yes and the mistake that they made was to choose a path where technology became more important than the goals and highest joys of the individuals.
 
I have been to Atlantis several times, its great, but not at all like you imagine it is.

I have also been to Lilliput but that's another story ;)
 
I have been to Atlantis several times, its great, but not at all like you imagine it is.
The ET community states very clearly that Atlantis was plagued by warring factions and finally destroyed nearly 13,000 years ago by an asteroid. A completely different source discarnate Lucillus came through the independent direct voice medium Leslie Flint in an August 27, 1962, seance also explains how Atlantis was plagued by warring factions and finally destroyed by an asteroid nearly 13,000 years ago.

Leslie Flint Educational Trust
http://www.leslieflint.com/lucius-lucillus
As an aside, Flint is the most superlative physical medium in modern history, thew most scientifically investigated without a hint of fraud, using an ectoplasmic voice box to mediate spirit communications.

LF-ectoplasm.jpg


A scientific article by Steven M. Stanley, (University of Hawaii at Manoa, Honolulu, HI, July 26, 2007) confirms the impact. Steven M. Stanley communicated a very interesting scientific article Evidence for an Extraterrestrial Impact 12,900 Years Ago on a major catastrophic cosmic event that took place 12,900 years ago: I would have to say it was an extremely significant and globally catastrophic event causing the extinction of a vast number of animal species including many mammals and a large segment of the human population. What was considered the history of that ancient age was lost and forgotten. History had to "start" all over again. This catastrophic natural disaster may have been the cause of the flooding and sinking of the continent of Atlantis and the reason recorded history seems to only go back as far as 10,000 BC.

We now have three completely separate sources of information each giving the same period in time and location of the destruction of Atlantis. In other words the Et channeling community and Leslie Flint confirm each other while the July 26, 2007 science article also states the same time and place of the meteor impact supporting what both the ETs and Lucillus claimed had happened at that time.
 
Was the Trojan horse made of wood?

Was Noah's ark a "ship"?

Where is Prester John?

An Historian will say, I think 'something' and a psychic will say they know 'something'.

Historical fiction is fine until it is presented as fact.

Plato is telling a story, and whether the characters are real or not is of no importance at all.
They become real when you read the text.

It is also important to understand how stories were used, I don't think they discriminated against or worried about the minutia in the way that people do now. Telling a story is an art and you therefore have artistic licence to embellish or omit things. Basically a licence to lie.
A history is written by a person and people lie, all the time.

So am I saying Plato was a Liar? yes but not in a malicious way, it would be more accurate to say that he knowingly used, shall we say questionable sources.
In fact with Atlantis he even distances himself from it, by saying that his 'uncle Solon' had told him about it.

His dialogues are philosophical stories, their magic and power is not in the "factualness" of location, person or event described, but the concepts and ideas they discuss and invite us to investigate in our minds.

The same is true of the Iliad, it has survived because it is such a fantastic story not because it is 'true'.

I am wondering what people in 1500 years time will make of Gulliver's Travels? or twenty thousand leagues under the Sea?

Will they go looking for Lilliput? or try to find Nemo's Island?

I am sure they will, but the savvy ones will recognise the concept's and scenarios as familiar to their everyday lives, and know that the texts are both historical and fictional at the same time, and although the emotions the authour's wanted to elicit are 'real' they were not meant to be taken literally, in fact the authour would be most definitely disappointed: That the reader hadn't made the connection between his fictional version of for instance, Lilliput and Blefuscu and the very real tensions between England and France at the time Swift wrote it.

I just channeled Plato and asked him if Atlantis was a real place, and he said:

"Don't you lot get bored of asking the same questions? I wish someone would ask me something interesting, it's like this 24/7 and always the same question, The whole point of me writing it was to try and make people think.............
I mean if they were so advanced why didn't they invent a way of predicting the catastrophe that befell them?"



Sorry MR Plato it is me who is asking the questions, you tell me?


"Well maybe they had it and ignored it?"

You keep answering questions with questions!

"Well I am the famous Philosopher Plato am I not?"

this could go on for a while............
 
Plato was a serious writer, so this information must be true.
Lol, really?

He made stuff up all the time.

Atlantis is probably one of them.

There are in Plato identifiable traditional myths, such as the story of Gyges (Republic 359d–360b), the myth of Phaethon (Timaeus 22c7) or that of the Amazons (Laws 804e4). Sometimes he modifies them, to a greater or lesser extent, while other times he combines them—this is the case, for instance, of the Noble Lie (Republic 414b–415d), which is a combination of the Cadmeian myth of autochthony and the Hesiodic myth of ages. There are also in Plato myths that are his own, such as the myth of Er (Republic 621b8) or the myth of Atlantis (Timaeus 26e4). Many of the myths Plato invented feature characters and motifs taken from traditional mythology (such as the Isles of the Blessed or the judgment after death), and sometimes it is difficult to distinguish his own mythological motifs from the traditional ones. The majority of the myths he invents preface or follow a philosophical argument: the Gorgias myth (523a–527a), the myth of the androgyne (Symposium 189d–193d), the Phaedo myth (107c–115a), the myth of Er (Republic614a–621d), the myth of the winged soul (Phaedrus 246a–249d), the myth of Theuth (Phaedrus274c–275e), the cosmological myth of the Statesman (268–274e), the Atlantis myth (Timaeus21e–26d, Critias), the Laws myth (903b–905b).

Plato refers sometimes to the myths he uses, whether traditional or his own, as muthoi (for an overview of all the loci where the word muthos occurs in Plato see Brisson 1998 (141ff.)). However, muthos is not an exclusive label. For instance: the myth of Theuth in the Phaedrus(274c1) is called an akoē (a “thing heard”, “report”, “story”); the myth of Cronus is called a phēmē (“oracle”, “tradition”, “rumour”) in the Laws (713c2) and a muthos in the Statesman(272d5, 274e1, 275b1); and the myth of Boreas at the beginning of the Phaedrus is called both muthologēma (229c5) and logos (d2).

The myths Plato invents, as well as the traditional myths he uses, are narratives that are non-falsifiable, for they depict particular beings, deeds, places or events that are beyond our experience: the gods, the daemons, the heroes, the life of soul after death, the distant past, etc. Myths are also fantastical, but they are not inherently irrational and they are not targeted at the irrational parts of the soul.

The Cave, the narrative that occurs in the Republic (514a–517a), is a fantastical story, but it does not deal explicitly with the beyond (the distant past, life after death etc.), and is thus different from the traditional myths Plato uses and the myths he invents. Strictly speaking, the Cave is an analogy, not a myth. Also in the Republic, Socrates says that until philosophers take control of a city “the politeia whose story we are telling in words (muthologein) will not achieve its fulfillment in practice” (501e2–5; translated by Rowe (1999, 268)). The construction of the ideal city may be called a “myth” in the sense that it depicts an imaginary polis (cf. 420c2: “We imagine the happy state”). In the Phaedrus (237a9, 241e8) the word muthos is used to name “the rhetorical exercise which Socrates carries out” (Brisson 1998, 144), but this seems to be a loose usage of the word.

Most (2012) argues that there are eight main features of the Platonic myth. (a) Myths are a monologue, which those listening do not interrupt; (b) they are told by an older speaker to younger listeners; (c) they “go back to older, explicitly indicated or implied, real or fictional oral sources” (17); (d) they cannot be empirically verified; (e) their authority derive from tradition, and “for this reason they are not subject to rational examination by the audience” (18); (f) they have a psychologic effect:pleasure, or a motivating impulse to perform an action “capable of surpassing any form of rational persuasion” (18); (g) they are descriptive or narrative; (h) they precede or follow a dialectical exposition. Most acknowledges that these eight features are not completely uncontroversial, and that there are occasional exceptions; but applied flexibly, they allow us to establish a corpus of at least fourteen Platonic myths in the Phaedo, Gorgias,Protagoras, Meno, Phaedrus, Symposium, Republic X, Statesman, Timaeus, Critias and Laws IV. The first seven features “are thoroughly typical of the traditional myths which were found in the oral culture of ancient Greece and which Plato himself often describes and indeed vigorously criticizes” (19).

Dorion (2012) argues that the Oracle story in Plato’s Apology has all these eight features of the Platonic myth discussed by Most (2012). Dorion concludes that the Oracle story is not only a Platonic fiction, but also a Platonic myth, more specifically: a myth of origin. Who invented the examination of the opinions of others by the means of elenchus? Aristotle (see Sophistical Refutations 172a30–35 and Rhetoric 1354a3–7) thought that the practice of refutation is, as Dorion puts it, “lost in the mists of time and that it is hence vain to seek an exact origin of it” (433). Plato, however, attempts to convince us that the dialectical elenchus “were a form of argumentation that Socrates began to practice spontaneously as soon as he learned of the Oracle” (433); thus, Plato confers to it a divine origin; in the Charmides he does the same when he makes Socrates say that he learned an incantation (a metaphor for the elenchus) from Zalmoxis; see also the Philebus 16c.
Plato's Myths (Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy)
 
New audience members should take Wallers "facts" with a grain of salt.

What they should do is to research the subjects of spirit and ET communication with an open-minded approach. They should believe nothing that I say, nor anything you purport, until they can fully claim that they have come to their own truth on the matter. Regardless of what conclusions they come to.

Personally, unlike you 'mike', its not my business to tell people who they should doubt, who they should believe, what they should place stake. I offer my opinion because it is what I enjoy doing and whether they approve the messenger is inconsequential to the message...and inconsequential to me.
 
And as Gene said in the thread i referenced You are entitled to your POV, but not your facts.

You didn't present your data as an opinion you presented it as a fact.

The ET community states very clearly that Atlantis was plagued by warring factions and finally destroyed nearly 13,000 years ago by an asteroid. A completely different source discarnate Lucillus came through the independent direct voice medium Leslie Flint in an August 27, 1962, seance also explains how Atlantis was plagued by warring factions and finally destroyed by an asteroid nearly 13,000 years ago.

You cannot write history via channeled ETs and seances, that's absurd.

So my warning to the readers stands as valid. Be wary of Wallers "Facts" .
 
And as Gene said in the thread i referenced You are entitled to your POV, but not your facts. You didn't present your data as an opinion you presented it as a fact.
I was very clear so let me repeat. Regardless of his or your opinion, I regard them as facts and so in my POV they shall remain.

You cannot write history via channeled ETs and seances, that's absurd.

Only to you; to many, many others, including me, it is nearly unfathomable that anyone in this year of 2017 hasn't come to the realization that we are being given an instruction manual on Life which has its origins otherwordly and is presently communicated to us by dozens of sources (spirit, ET). Including 'the history of humankind' which, btw, only exists as information from parallel realities (existences) we 'data-pull' into our physical irreality to enahnce our experience of it and continuity within it. There is no past, there is no future, everything exists NOW.

So my warning to the readers stands as valid. Be wary of Wallers "Facts" .

Again, I would suggest that one listen to themselves, not to take as fact, your 'warnings' or my ramblings, and make their own decisions taking into account all POVs regardless how others may choose to influence that process.

But I do have a question. See my signature. Those who see value, who resonate with what I have to say, will be attracted to it and do with that information what they desire. Those who don't, won't. Fair enough, neither you nor I can convince anyone of anything if they are not in step with the information delivered.

So why all the consternation and attempts to invalidate my POV? I don't yours.
 
Funny, I had engaged in a conversation regarding Atlantis before I left the forums in 2010. I think the Egyptians gave Plato the story of the Minoans, who had traded extensively in the area including transactions with Egypt 1300 years prior. Plato probably embellished the original story. Now before you poo-poo the Minoans. They were well known engineers and architects. They even had indoor plumbing.
 
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