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The Brain Does NOT Create Consciousness

Christopher O'Brien

Back in the Saddle Aginn
Staff member
ARTICLE HERE:
By Debbie West

In a recent interview on Waking Times aired on The People’s Voice Network, Dr. Eben Alexander, Harvard Neurosurgeon presents compelling scientific research in the field of consciousness that examines the unfolding reality that the brain does NOT create consciousness. Misleading concepts that focus on reductive materialism have kept us in the dark about the true nature of the human soul and its integral part in our evolution as spiritual beings.

“The old paradigm of birth to death represents an outdated concept that is woefully inadequate in defining the unfolding reality of expanded awareness,” he stated in the interview with Waking Times. “Materialist science is at the end of its days as most scientists are changing their views. The old concepts are soon to be relegated to the same dust bin as ‘the earth is flat’ as we develop a more mature understanding and transcend old beliefs.”

Supported by worldwide research that is now delving into the concepts of string theory that involves a complete reworking of our outdated and limited views of space/time means that we are now entering a phase where science will greatly expand its boundaries. The foundation of the research begins with the clear understanding of the “Soul”, or conscious spirit, that exists outside of the body and is eternal. “Consciousness is at the core to unfolding all of reality”, states Alexander.

The brain operates the body based on input from the personality, but the higher intelligence, or subconscious, is the mechanism that controls the body, and that is the soul that we have yet to acknowledge or even begin to understand. That is the free will component that exists long after the body stops. Near-death, paranormal, mysticism, past life memories, and akashic records are now a common thread that drives home the conclusion that there exists a soul within the human body that transcends the human experience. As we acknowledge the essence of our soul, we let go of the limitations of the illusional earth-based mentality and reach out to the greater cosmos of life. Many additional realms exist beyond the earth and in other dimensions of time/space. As spiritual beings, we can easily access these places…

This time on earth will be one where we all transcend the false boundaries that convince us that we are separate entities and develop the understanding of the oneness that we all share, meaning that we don’t have to be either scientific or spiritual. Merging science and spirituality creates a new foundation for our peaceful coexistence in the greater cosmos. REST OF ARTICLE HERE:

References:
Does The Soul Exist? Evidence Says ‘Yes’ | Psychology Today
Did Science Just Prove Reincarnation? A Look At The Soul’s Journey After “Death” | Collective-Evolution
Scientists claim that Quantum Theory proves consciousness moves to another universe at death -- Science of the Spirit -- Sott.net
 

marduk

quelling chaos since 2352BC
OK, so what does?

We know if you jab a needle in the brain, consciousness either changes, or is degraded, or stops working altogether.

So if the brain doesn't create consciousness, what does? You have to replace it with something, you know.

Even a Harvard neurosurgean can't wave his hands and will a non-material dualistic universe into being. Hell, I believe consciousness can survive death, but that it's obviously highly coupled to the the few pounds of grey matter in your noodle.

And just take an evolutionary perspective: what does this lump of grey goo that takes 20% of your metabolic energy do if not that?

And this statement is just patently false:

"Materialist science is at the end of its days as most scientists are changing their views."

Speaking as a materialist, I say we're just getting cooking.
 

exo_doc

Foolish Earthling
Consciousness is a non local phenomena. Think of the brain as a remote sensor. Our higher selves are just plugged into the multi sensory receiver that is the brain.
Damage part of the brain, the connection to the higher self becomes degraded, and interaction with the environment is compromised.
I cant tell anyone what to think, or tell them something they must find out for themselves, but this is true reality that ive found for me personally.
 

manxman

Paranormal Adept
Consciousness is the quality or state of being aware of an external object or something within oneself.[1][2] It has been defined as: sentience, awareness, subjectivity, the ability to experience or to feel, wakefulness, having a sense of selfhood, and the executive control system of the mind.

sheesh this is a hard one, see humans are the only animal fully aware, i mean other animals 'feel', some mourn.
some are partially aware, the gorillas in the mist film was based on a true story, i read about her following the deposed razorback dominant male, to a waterfall, where he sat for 2 days just staring at the waterfall, until she realised he was actually pondering about his new circumstances.

this stuff is really starting to interest me, but what i dont get is, when does consciousness arrive.
if it leaves when we die, when does it enter us, if we are all apart of one consciousness.

if it doesnt enter us, are we born aware, and when we die, do we just keep adding to the one consciousness we are all apart of, does that just keep growing, does our consciousness ever die.


edit to add

i couldnt ponder those thoughts, if i was anything other than human, what makes US different.

we are all spiritual beings etc, he says.

its just words, most of it just bollocks, what's a spiritual being.
 
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marduk

quelling chaos since 2352BC
Consciousness is a non local phenomena. Think of the brain as a remote sensor. Our higher selves are just plugged into the multi sensory receiver that is the brain.
Damage part of the brain, the connection to the higher self becomes degraded, and interaction with the environment is compromised.
I cant tell anyone what to think, or tell them something they must find out for themselves, but this is true reality that ive found for me personally.
Can you talk more about this and how you've found this to be true for you?
 

Burnt State

Paranormal Adept
this stuff is really starting to interest me, but what i dont get is, when does consciousness arrive.

if it leaves when we die, when does it enter us, if we are all apart of one consciousness.
i always encourage new parents to look closely in the eyes of the babe for that moment of self-awareness to start to sparkle there. up to about three months of age little human critters are all about eating sleeping and waste production. the eyes mostly glaze over blankly.

but then suddenly there is this moment where creature becomes an "I" and is now got some kind of self-consciousness that can be seen gleaming with an inner light not detectable before. of course this is purely an anecdotal notion and works completely against all those great reincarnation theories.
 

trainedobserver

Paranormally Disenchanted
"Eben Alexander III is an American neurosurgeon and the author of the best-selling Proof of Heaven: A Neurosurgeon's Journey into the Afterlife."

The whole NDE business is truly bizarre, but it is not proof of heaven or the afterlife.
 

marduk

quelling chaos since 2352BC
i always encourage new parents to look closely in the eyes of the babe for that moment of self-awareness to start to sparkle there. up to about three months of age little human critters are all about eating sleeping and waste production. the eyes mostly glaze over blankly.

but then suddenly there is this moment where creature becomes an "I" and is now got some kind of self-consciousness that can be seen gleaming with an inner light not detectable before. of course this is purely an anecdotal notion and works completely against all those great reincarnation theories.
Seeing this emerge in my kids,and working with chaos and complexity theory, is why I believe consciousness is an emergent property of systems.

Of course I can prove no such thing.
 

bbridges

Paranormal Maven
OK, so what does?

We know if you jab a needle in the brain, consciousness either changes, or is degraded, or stops working altogether.

So if the brain doesn't create consciousness, what does? You have to replace it with something, you know.

Even a Harvard neurosurgean can't wave his hands and will a non-material dualistic universe into being. Hell, I believe consciousness can survive death, but that it's obviously highly coupled to the the few pounds of grey matter in your noodle.

And just take an evolutionary perspective: what does this lump of grey goo that takes 20% of your metabolic energy do if not that?

And this statement is just patently false:

"Materialist science is at the end of its days as most scientists are changing their views."

Speaking as a materialist, I say we're just getting cooking.
This acknowledgement is evidence that you are in fact
'just getting cooking." Keep'cooking' and eventually you will get there, and we'll be waiting to greet you...
 

trainedobserver

Paranormally Disenchanted
And just take an evolutionary perspective: what does this lump of grey goo that takes 20% of your metabolic energy do if not that?
You have made a extremely good point and a key observation. The extremely thorough and ruthless evolutionary process eliminates everything that is inefficient or unneeded. While it could be argued that many people are walking around with empty skulls, most humans still possess the organ.

And this statement is just patently false:

"Materialist science is at the end of its days as most scientists are changing their views."

Speaking as a materialist, I say we're just getting cooking.
I think people get lost in the semantics and naive realism. Science has proven that we do not experience the world directly. Our sense of the solidity of matter, time, light, and ourselves as autonomous individuals are entirely products of the mind used to navigate the "real world" in which we move and have our being. The difference between "materialists" and "non-materialists" may not be that great. I consider myself a materialist. Yet, I understand that my brain's representation of "physical matter" is simply that, a representation and not the actual thing itself. I don't think the mystery of the true nature of reality can be found in superstitious notions and spiritualist ideas taken literally, yet like a finger pointing at the moon, they may be indicating something else.

Consciousness is the experience that your brain and central nervous system produces of the hundreds of thousands of thoughts and sensations that stream through the mind each day. At the base of this experience is a silent observer of these thoughts and sensations. This silent observer of all things appears to me to be a function of the physical brain between my ears. I have no reason to think otherwise.

If anyone is getting hung up on "What is consciousness? Is it animal, mineral, or vegetable?" kind of thing, think of this. Consciousness is made of the same substance your brain is made of, whatever the ultimate reality of that might be. You can view it as the stuff of the brain in operation. Atomic motion in a system.
 
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USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
ARTICLE HERE:
By Debbie West

In a recent interview on Waking Times aired on The People’s Voice Network, Dr. Eben Alexander, Harvard Neurosurgeon presents compelling scientific research in the field of consciousness that examines the unfolding reality that the brain does NOT create consciousness. Misleading concepts that focus on reductive materialism have kept us in the dark about the true nature of the human soul and its integral part in our evolution as spiritual beings ...
Looks like ( and sounds like ) more quantum woo to me. Biocentrism might be true with respect to our universe if our universe is a manufactured construct by some other objective living conscious being, however even if that theory is true, it still isn't the central tenet of Lanza's biocentrism. Lanza's biocentrism is essentially just subjective idealism injected with scientific buzz words to make it sound more believable to those who haven't examined the various claims that purveyors of quantum woo promote, e.g. that observing a particle changes its behavior ( it doesn't ).

It's the detection of the particles that change their behavior. In fact, a completely non-conscious detector is what is actually used to do the experiments Lanza alludes to in the lecture video associated with the link. His argument is also similar to the argument that believers in intelligent design promote, and which have been exposed as faulty logic time and time again. The simplest illustration of that faulty logic is to demonstrate that there is overwhelming scientific evidence that objective reality, the world beyond ourselves, has existed far longer than humans, and therefore no human mind can possibly be responsible for creating that reality ...

We were born into this universe, not the other way around, and any theory that suggests otherwise is pure nonsense ( sorry ). And sorry for saying "sorry" ( I'm Canadian ).
 

marduk

quelling chaos since 2352BC
You have made a extremely good point and a key observation. The extremely thorough and ruthless evolutionary process eliminates everything that is inefficient or unneeded. While it could be argued that many people are walking around with empty skulls, most humans still possess the organ.



I think people get lost in the semantics and naive realism. Science has proven that we do not experience the world directly. Our sense of the solidity of matter, time, light, and ourselves as autonomous individuals are entirely products of the mind used to navigate the "real world" in which we move and have our being. The difference between "materialists" and "non-materialists" may not be that great. I consider myself a materialist. Yet, I understand that my brain's representation of "physical matter" is simply that, a representation and not the actual thing itself. I don't think the mystery of the true nature of reality can be found in superstitious notions and spiritualist ideas taken literally, yet like a finger pointing at the moon, they may be indicating something else.

Consciousness is the experience that your brain and central nervous system produces of the hundreds of thousands of thoughts and sensations that stream through the mind each day. At the base of this experience is a silent observer of these thoughts and sensations. This silent observer of all things appears to me to be a function of the physical brain between my ears. I have no reason to think otherwise.

If anyone is getting hung up on "What is consciousness? Is it animal, mineral, or vegetable?" kind of thing, think of this. Consciousness is made of the same substance your brain is made of, whatever the ultimate reality of that might be. You can view it as the stuff of the brain in operation. Atomic motion in a system.
What I mean by materialism is that what exists, exists within the material world. If ghosts exist, we probably won't need to create a whole dualistic non-material science to explore it. Simply put, I would seek out a natural explanation for ghosts, the afterlife, and UFOs if you think they exist -- they are a part of the natural realm.

Simply because nothing else would require such a dualistic approach.

I think the most likely bet for consciousness is Hofstadter's "Strange Loop" approach of self-referential complex systems, that consciousness is a series of parallel processes executed within your brain. Not software necessarily, except that it can write itself. But a process or meta-process being executed within your noggin.
 

nameless

Paranormal Adept
Consciousness is the quality or state of being aware of an external object or something within oneself.[1][2] It has been defined as: sentience, awareness, subjectivity, the ability to experience or to feel, wakefulness, having a sense of selfhood, and the executive control system of the mind.

sheesh this is a hard one, see humans are the only animal fully aware, i mean other animals 'feel', some mourn.
some are partially aware, the gorillas in the mist film was based on a true story, i read about her following the deposed razorback dominant male, to a waterfall, where he sat for 2 days just staring at the waterfall, until she realised he was actually pondering about his new circumstances.

this stuff is really starting to interest me, but what i dont get is, when does consciousness arrive.
if it leaves when we die, when does it enter us, if we are all apart of one consciousness.

if it doesnt enter us, are we born aware, and when we die, do we just keep adding to the one consciousness we are all apart of, does that just keep growing, does our consciousness ever die.


edit to add

i couldnt ponder those thoughts, if i was anything other than human, what makes US different.

we are all spiritual beings etc, he says.

its just words, most of it just bollocks, what's a spiritual being.
If u like this then you will love the idea of "blindsight" , look it up . Also blind people who use canes feel the cane as an extension of their self, conciousness for them is the sense of feeling in the tip of their cane .
 

USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
Consciousness is a non local phenomena. Think of the brain as a remote sensor. Our higher selves are just plugged into the multi sensory receiver that is the brain.
Damage part of the brain, the connection to the higher self becomes degraded, and interaction with the environment is compromised.
I cant tell anyone what to think, or tell them something they must find out for themselves, but this is true reality that ive found for me personally.
Based on evidence and logic, I don't think you have it quite right. Consciousness may not be material, but there's little reason to presume it's not physical, and virtually all the evidence suggests that it is an emergent property of brain function.
 

Burnt State

Paranormal Adept
I think people get lost in the semantics and naive realism. Science has proven that we do not experience the world directly. Our sense of the solidity of matter, time, light, and ourselves as autonomous individuals are entirely products of the mind used to navigate the "real world" in which we move and have our being. The difference between "materialists" and "non-materialists" may not be that great. I consider myself a materialist. Yet, I understand that my brain's representation of "physical matter" is simply that, a representation and not the actual thing itself. I don't think the mystery of the true nature of reality can be found in superstitious notions and spiritualist ideas taken literally, yet like a finger pointing at the moon, they may be indicating something else.

Consciousness is the experience that your brain and central nervous system produces of the hundreds of thousands of thoughts and sensations that stream through the mind each day. At the base of this experience is a silent observer of these thoughts and sensations. This silent observer of all things appears to me to be a function of the physical brain between my ears. I have no reason to think otherwise.

If anyone is getting hung up on "What is consciousness? Is it animal, mineral, or vegetable?" kind of thing, think of this. Consciousness is made of the same substance your brain is made of, whatever the ultimate reality of that might be. You can view it as the stuff of the brain in operation. Atomic motion in a system.
This is an excellent summation of how consciousness works and how we experience reality - should be a sticky post. i think when we forget or perhaps missed that moment of emergence in the infant child, it becomes a lot easier to debate and question just how this whole darn thing works and invent some pretty wild possibilties. it's clarity like this that makes me want to give up on all my reincarnation speculation. damn.

i want to capitalize on nameless' post as it reminded me of a movie i saw of a man who developed his echolocation skills on such a high level that though blind, he could ride a bike. an impressive development. so what other skills have we not yet developed or forgotten?

 

Constance

Paranormal Adept
Based on evidence and logic, I don't think you have it quite right. Consciousness may not be material, but there's little reason to presume it's not physical, and virtually all the evidence suggests that it is an emergent property of brain function.
A frequent claim disputed over several decades now in the field of consciousness studies (made up of a wide range of scientists and philosophers). Can you link us to a list of all this evidence that consciousness is an emergent property of 'brain function' or else provide one yourself? Thanks.

re 'logical proof' for your claim, note that what we consider to be logical has been constructed on what we've known about the world, or thought we knew about it (which keeps changing).
 

Constance

Paranormal Adept
. . . Science has proven that we do not experience the world directly. Our sense of the solidity of matter, time, light, and ourselves as autonomous individuals are entirely products of the mind used to navigate the "real world" in which we move and have our being. The difference between "materialists" and "non-materialists" may not be that great. I consider myself a materialist. Yet, I understand that my brain's representation of "physical matter" is simply that, a representation and not the actual thing itself. I don't think the mystery of the true nature of reality can be found in superstitious notions and spiritualist ideas taken literally, yet like a finger pointing at the moon, they may be indicating something else.

Consciousness is the experience that your brain and central nervous system produces of the hundreds of thousands of thoughts and sensations that stream through the mind each day. At the base of this experience is a silent observer of these thoughts and sensations. This silent observer of all things appears to me to be a function of the physical brain between my ears. I have no reason to think otherwise.
The paper at the link (a chapter in The Cambridge Companion to Merleau-Ponty) might provide you with some reasons to think otherwise. I hope you'll find it worthwhile to consider the author's arguments against what he calls the "mediational epistemology" that has assumed a gap between the mind and the world since Descartes. The paper's author, Charles Taylor, explains at the outset that what he means by 'mediational epistemology' is "an understanding of the place of mind in a world such that our only knowledge of reality comes through the representations we have formed of it within ourselves." The title of the paper as it appears in the Cambridge Companion is "Merleau-Ponty and the Epistemological Picture."

http://ist-socrates.berkeley.edu/~hdreyfus/188_s05/pdf/Charles_Taylor_Background.pdf
 

USI Calgary

J. Randall Murphy
Staff member
A frequent claim disputed over several decades now in the field of consciousness studies (made up of a wide range of scientists and philosophers). Can you link us to a list of all this evidence that consciousness is an emergent property of 'brain function' or else provide one yourself? Thanks.

re 'logical proof' for your claim, note that what we consider to be logical has been constructed on what we've known about the world, or thought we knew about it (which keeps changing).
Requiring specific examples and citations to show that consciousness is an emergent property of a functioning brain is ludicrous because it's blatantly self-evident. Every single day thousands of people are examined by doctors and deemed to possess consciousness, and every single one of those patients obviously has a functioning brain. Many of them have even undergone brain scans that conclusively demonstrate that their brain is working and intimately associated with their conscious mind ( consciousness ). Do you seriously expect a dossier on every one them? Don't be absurd.

The same principle applies to every dead person. In fact every single accurate pronouncement of death never accompanies any signs of a consciousness being present in the patient. And BTW memories recalled after the fact don't count because consciousness is a real-time phenomenon, not some alleged memory of possessing consciousness while presumed dead in the past ( as in virtually every NDE ). But again, if you think I'm wrong, show me just one verifiable case. In the meantime ...

Michael S. Gazzaniga
leading researcher in cognitive neuroscience,
the study of the neural basis of mind.



 

manxman

Paranormal Adept
Based on evidence and logic, I don't think you have it quite right. Consciousness may not be material, but there's little reason to presume it's not physical, and virtually all the evidence suggests that it is an emergent property of brain function.
i like that randal, it set me thinking at some point in time,on this planet.
there was an ape, singular, JUST one ape.
that recognised/realised that it was 'him', looking back at 'him', in the reflection of the water he was drinking, and that he was different to the others.
 

Stagger Lee

Paranormal Adept
I once, for less than an hours time, had all this figured out. Of course the small puddle of liquid I consumed brought this realization upon me- then, as is always the case, it just slipped away. A pen and paper would have done little good at the time, for the next day I wouldn't recognize my own thoughts, or at least be able to make sense of it.
 


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