marduk
quelling chaos since 2352BC
That's the one.
I actually corresponded with Whitley about it. It didn't go well.
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February 14, 2016 — Whitley Strieber
- Thread starter Gene Steinberg
- Start date
I actually corresponded with Whitley about it. It didn't go well.
George Wingfield
Paranormal Maven
Intriguing hypothesis George, but you seem to be making a whole lot of assumptions without any real evidence to support your claims. Question: How should the amorphous "we" proceed in an effort to get the your alleged hoaxers to give up irrefutable mea culpas? Anyone out there have a unequivocal leg up on who is behind the moniker "Anthony Bragalia"? Many inquiring minds would like to know, so step up and sing out!
Chris,
I do have a lot of evidence as I said in my last posting and I can assure you that Lundberg and Irving's fingerprints are all over the Roswell Slides Hoax. I offered to dig up the evidence which I wrote about this two years ago but I assumed you had already read that? Maybe this thread about Whitley Strieber isn't the right place to post it and it should go elsewhere?? Tell me where.
First let me ask you Chris whether you are a devout Roswell Believer? If yes, there's no point in going any further.
Then are "we" all agreed that the Roswell Slides affair was indeed a hoax? Yes? OK! Then proceed to the next question.
Do you believe that the man behind the hoax was the mysterious "Anthony Bragalia" billed as the World's Greatest UFO Researcher? If, like me, you say YES, then we can ask the next question. (Some foolish folk choose to blame it all on the ridiculous Adam Dew who supplied the cockamamie background story to the slides involving "Hilda Ray" and husband "Bernerd", President & Mamie Eisenhower, special privileged viewing of the alleged "alien corpse", the Kodachrome slides, etc. All completely fictitious, I suggest, though some people seemed to have swallowed this nonsense. I say Adam Dew and his silent friend were merely the front men for "Anthony Bragalia".)
The remaining question is the true identity of "Anthony Bragalia". I have little doubt that this was the pseudonym of John Lundberg and Rob Irving who have together perpetrated many such scams in the field of circlefaking, ufofaking and alienfaking previously. In particular they were the principal creators of Ray Santilli's "Alien Autopsy" in 1995 though they naturally deny it. They have been behind many such hoaxes and scams over the last 25 years. When John Lundberg was asked by several people including myself whether or not he was Bragalia he chose to reply in poetic and evasive terms which definitely seemed to imply he was involved in the matter but was unwilling to say so publicly. Years ago he told me that his policy on crop circles he was accused of making, UFO photos he'd produced, and other such hoaxes was neither to confirm nor deny.
If like me you watch 48 Hours on TV and the man who is accused of a murder refuses to appear on the stand to be questioned during his trial, you can probably be sure as hell that he's the one who's done it.
George
George Wingfield
Paranormal Maven
On a different subject, Chris mentions the Urandir Oliveira abduction hoax in Brazil in 2002. Oliveira apparently had the middle name Fernandez which enabled him to call himself Mr UFO. Linda Moulton Howe (no relation of LMD) flew to Brazil to meet Mr UFO and fully endorsed his abduction claims saying that his story was completely true. Soon afterwards respected Brazilian UFO researcher AJ Gevaerd wrote LMH an open letter on the Internet saying that everyone in Brazil knew Mr UFO was a fraudster and that she had done a great disservice to ufology. A furious row between Linda and AJ ensued.
Just two weeks ago LMH gave a presentation at the Ozark UFO Conference in Eureka Springs, AR, at which she claimed that many ranchers out west had seen cattle being beamed up into UFOs --that is Alien Spaceships-- and later their mutilated bodies being lowered back to earth by such light beams. This was an obvious improvement on the stories which she used to tell in the 1990s when she said some ranchers had seen lights in the sky --well, UFOs if you prefer-- over their pastures at night at times when cattle mutilations had occurred. Such claims remind one of contactees who often insist there were dozens of witnesses to some UFO event of theirs whereas no witnesses can ever be found.
Which brings us to the photograph at the top which I believe comes from a new UFO book called "The UFO Sightings Desk Reference". It records no less than 121,036 UFO sightings in the US between 2001 and 2015. The photo is supposedly genuine and it shows Linda's UFO light beams coming out of it. I don't see any cows in the beam but doubtless some will think this confirms everything that Linda Moulton Howe has been telling us for the last 45 years !!!
Linda Moulton Doty
Skilled Investigator
On a different subject, Chris mentions the Urandir Oliveira abduction hoax in Brazil in 2002. Oliveira apparently had the middle name Fernandez which enabled him to call himself Mr UFO. Linda Moulton Howe (no relation of LMD) flew to Brazil to meet Mr UFO and fully endorsed his abduction claims saying that his story was completely true. Soon afterwards respected Brazilian UFO researcher AJ Gevaerd wrote LMH an open letter on the Internet saying that everyone in Brazil knew Mr UFO was a fraudster and that she had done a great disservice to ufology. A furious row between Linda and AJ ensued.
[..] I don't see any cows in the beam but doubtless some will think this confirms everything that Linda Moulton Howe has been telling us for the last 45 years !!!
I sometimes wonder if there's ever been a story that Linda Moulton Howe hasn't run with.
George Wingfield
Paranormal Maven
Dear Linda Moulton Doty,
I know you deny any relationship to LMH but your unusual moniker does imply some interest in Howe and Doty who were effectively co-creators of so much of the Roswell/UFO/alien/abduction/cattle mutilation myth that has tarnished US ufology for 30 years or more (I said earlier that we'd been listening to Linda for 45 years but that should really have been about 35).
The thought did occur to me that you might be yet another web persona used by John Lundberg --though I neither expect you to confirm or deny that. Can't tell too much from the fake picture but I rather doubt you live in Sunny Sudan. I see you joined us on about April Fools Day. That does seem appropriate! Rather belatedly, let me say 'Welcome to The Paracast'. ---GW
I know you deny any relationship to LMH but your unusual moniker does imply some interest in Howe and Doty who were effectively co-creators of so much of the Roswell/UFO/alien/abduction/cattle mutilation myth that has tarnished US ufology for 30 years or more (I said earlier that we'd been listening to Linda for 45 years but that should really have been about 35).
The thought did occur to me that you might be yet another web persona used by John Lundberg --though I neither expect you to confirm or deny that. Can't tell too much from the fake picture but I rather doubt you live in Sunny Sudan. I see you joined us on about April Fools Day. That does seem appropriate! Rather belatedly, let me say 'Welcome to The Paracast'. ---GW
Linda Moulton Doty
Skilled Investigator
Thanks for the welcome. In actual fact, I am Richard Doty's daughter. He never spoke to us about UFOs or the work he did in AFOSI, nor did he say anything about the 'Mirage Men' documentary. It was only after I stumbled upon it online and asked him about it that I finally learned after 37 years where my name 'Linda Moulton' came from...
No, in fact, none of the above is true. I signed in here under the name 'Linda Moulton Doty' because of the obvious joke behind it. LMH has for a long time looked to me to be a straight conduit into the UFO world from any kind of state-sponsored or state-affiliated misinfo/disinfo that might come up. I don't know whether she's a nice person or not, but she hasn't practiced responsible journalism in decades. If you look at her website, it's always Part 5 out of 7 of some 'whistleblower' who is feeding her some bad sci-fi scenario along with hand drawings of alien symbols, etc. At some point you have to call a spade a spade, and even though LMH did have training and experience as a 'legitimate' journalist, you have to say she's a kook. Has she broken any actual UFO-related stories? Has a single one of her whistleblowers given her anything that has traction in the mainstream world, anything that might not have separately appeared on the old Art Bell message boards? She's a kook.
It's a similar situation with Strieber. Without question he's a talented writer with some real intellectual sophistication. But at bottom just like everybody else he's full of sh*t. Now, with people like LMH and Strieber and others, does one have to come down on the side of saying they are brain-dead incompetents, or worse, psychotics? There's a tendency in this area of interest to do just that: issue black-and-white decrees with one choice or the other. The truth is always more complicated, if we want to see it.
As for the UFO picture you posted, it looks pretty clearly to be CGI to me. Cheers.
Han
piscator ψ
Hello George I managed to find what I believe is the original version of the image you posted.
I used something called "tineye" reverse image search.*
I believe** the original image was uploaded to a photographic "stock" library in 2015 by an "artist" called "Gremlin":
Ufo Landing In The Forest Meadow stock photo 482887350 | iStock
I have looked through some of their other work, and UFO's are quite a common theme, from other images I believe that they are based in Russia, or another country that uses the Cyrillic alphabet.
A lot of their work is computer enhanced, and in some pieces CGI is used (like the image you posted).
Why is any of this important? well if LMH used it in her book, it must have been purchased because otherwise she would be using an artists work without the correct "permissions" (copyright etc).
which is illegal.
*TinEye Reverse Image Search
**because it is the earliest instance that tineye found.
I used something called "tineye" reverse image search.*
I believe** the original image was uploaded to a photographic "stock" library in 2015 by an "artist" called "Gremlin":
Ufo Landing In The Forest Meadow stock photo 482887350 | iStock
I have looked through some of their other work, and UFO's are quite a common theme, from other images I believe that they are based in Russia, or another country that uses the Cyrillic alphabet.
A lot of their work is computer enhanced, and in some pieces CGI is used (like the image you posted).
Why is any of this important? well if LMH used it in her book, it must have been purchased because otherwise she would be using an artists work without the correct "permissions" (copyright etc).
which is illegal.
*TinEye Reverse Image Search
**because it is the earliest instance that tineye found.
SheaOlmsford
Paranormal Adept
I thought you meant that I could get into legal trouble. I have retitled the document and reissued it.
BREAKING NEWS! READ ALL ABOUT IT. SHOCKING INFORMATION ON WHITLEY STRIEBER.
Analysis of Whitley Strieber ARTICLES.pdf
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ChrisJohnsen
Paranormal Adept
BIRKELAND, IVAR W., SR., Bellevue. Died in March 1985, aged 87. Graduate of Kongelige Frederiks Universitet Medisinke Fak- ultet, Oslo, 1924. Licensed in Washington in 1926. Dr Birkeland was a retired member of the King County Medical Society. Inducted into the Northwest Ski Hall of Fame posthumously in 2006. Buried at Sunset Hill Memorial Park in Bellevue, WA next to his wife, Marguerite, who passed away in 1969. His son, Dr. Ivar "Buzz" Birkeland Jr. passed away in 2012 at age 80.
Cursory Google search turned up this information but not much else.
SheaOlmsford
Paranormal Adept
BREAKING NEWS!
LM Doty is actually my neighbor, Mrs. Mabel Schmedlap. She is 92 years old and spends her days talking to her 36 cats and watching YOUTUBE videos of playful kittens. I suggested that she join the Paracast forum to get her mind off the recent death of Blunderpuss, her 19 year old Persian. Mabel developed an immediate fascination with everything in ufology. Initially, she developed a huge crush on Whitley Strieber, referring to him as a "hot young man"! But Whitley rebuked her advances, claming that Ann had advised him to hold out for someone with more money. As a spurned woman, Mabel has turned against Whitley and now surfs the UFO websites, seeking revenge on Whitley and hoping to meet George Noory (who Mabel considers a major stud). I apologize for leading Mabel into the ufo field. Be forewarned! Mabel is going to Contact in the Desert loaded with $20 bills. She hopes to tempt George to do a shirtless erotic dance so she can slip $20 bills into his pants.
Note: The above paragraph is just as likely to be true as all the conspiracy nonsense about secret identities and the like.
SheaOlmsford
Paranormal Adept
So far, she hasn't picked up and run with this breaking news item.
Nice catch! I should track down the grandson, Bob Birkeland who was a soccer teammate for almost 10 years...
SheaOlmsford
Paranormal Adept
Oh come on. This photo is so obviously CGI. Photos no longer have any validity with the advent of cost effective photoshop technology. I am coming to the conclusion that the only evidence that would be unrefutable would be from DNA samples or metalurgy. Photos and films are no longer "evidence" since any junior highschool student can produce vivid pictures like the one you consider genuine.
Which brings us to the photograph at the top which I believe comes from a new UFO book called "The UFO Sightings Desk Reference". It records no less than 121,036 UFO sightings in the US between 2001 and 2015. The photo is supposedly genuine and it shows Linda's UFO light beams coming out of it. I don't see any cows in the beam but doubtless some will think this confirms everything that Linda Moulton Howe has been telling us for the last 45 years !!!
SheaOlmsford
Paranormal Adept
My memory may be faulty, but I listened to a DREAMLAND where Whitley Strieber and LM Howe intensely DEFENDED the Roswell slides after the rest of ufology had set them aside as fakes. Their rational was quite convoluted and bizarre. I seem to recall one point where they suggested that government officials had switched out the placard to claim it was an Indian mummy. This episode of DREAMLAND was so transparently absurd that any possible "benefits of a doubt" I may have had about Whitley were smashed. Both of them will seemingly say anything to remain relevant. I can enjoy such people for the pure entertainment value, but Whitley is no longer even viable to me as pure entertainment. Now he is merely tedious and sad.
marduk
quelling chaos since 2352BC
That's the moment I gave up on Dreamland and Strieber once and for all.
George Wingfield
Paranormal Maven
Hi, again, LMD
Yes, indeed, I never for a moment thought that the UFO photo I posted was anything other than CGI. It has become impossible to trust any supposed UFO photo that one finds on the Internet these days --not that any alleged UFO photos from the last 60 years was any better. I had thought the photo was from this new UFO book which I mentioned but it could have just been just a stock UFO picture that was used by the press in an article they ran about the book which I've not see yet.
I think we are on the same page about both Linda Moulton Howe and Whitley Strieber. They both have something of a cult following on their radio shows and their websites and they are both performance artists delivering their version of the UFO & ET Alien fantasy world that has been developed as "US ufology" reality in recent decades. Linda in particular delivers highly emotional presentations as she tells us about the alien threat and how human life on earth is really an experiment that has always been controlled by these extraterrestrials.
I don't mind what monikers people use on the Internet but often one cannot engage in serious discussion of a subject because some blog sites get overrun by trolls, fraudsters and aggressive individuals with some bizarre agenda or some axe to grind. Luckily The Paracast is comparatively free of this but there's plenty of it out there --especially on conspiracy websites. Life's too short to get drawn into that sort of online argument. I'm thinking in particular of the websites which present 9/11 and other terrorist massacres as "false flag" operations carried out by the CIA, the NSA and other sinister departments of the US government. Needless to say Linda subscribes to many such conspiracies and some involving secret underground UFO bases and fiendish alliances between the US military and the aliens.
ChrisJohnsen
Paranormal Adept
I've heard one of the authors of the UFO Sightings Desk Reference on a couple of podcasts and my take-away was that it was compiled using data-only, no visuals claiming to be actual photos of craft. So that obvious UFO graphic you posted was not from the contents of the book itself.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
George Wingfield
Paranormal Maven
Thanks, Harry. I must have a look at this TinEye. I didn't mean that Linda used that photo in any of her books --as far as I know. There are of course many UFO photos on the Internet that are claimed to be alien craft but there's nothing at all convincing. Again one might suppose that if Linda and Whitley's aliens really did exist we'd at least have some photos of them --but sadly the best they can do is fake aliens like those in the Roswell Slides or Santilli's "Alien Autopsy".
Sigh! Why do we even bother with all this any more?
kanakaris
Paranormal Adept
This was an epic episode.Great fun listening to this...
Linda Moulton Doty
Skilled Investigator
In that paper at strieberthekey.com, you see Strieber double-down on all sorts of stuff like this. There's a great section on how Strieber saw the 'drones' half a year after they were pretty much debunked. Of course, he also heard the mysterious booms from the sky, saw a black-eyed kid, knew the WTC buildings were going to collapse as soon as the first plane hit, saw his first cattle mutilation twice - once as a kid and once near his NY cabin 30 years later, had an uncle involved in Roswell. And, oh, his dad knew about the Kennedy assassination before it happened.