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Consciousness and the Paranormal — Part 4


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@Constance et al - what do y'all make of this?
VersoBooks.com

toward the end he discusses continental/analytic split - but I'm interested in your opinion of the entire article.

it's apparently a particularly clearly written essay for Zizek.

continental vs analytic
gigantomachy
 
Hi Steve. We've had storms and internet connection problems as a result. I'll read that article and respond. I've been wanting to read something by Zizek.
 
I read the Zizek piece and don't think we can get very far on the basis of this statement alone in comprehending Zizek or his defense of himself against Chomsky's comments about him. Their problem with one another seems to be a case of misunderstanding (despite their roughly common sociopolitical goals) of how to rethink a path toward radical social change and how deeply the subject of potential change must be thought. Chomsky apparently rejects the complexity of Zizek's thinking and writing as it includes insights into the human subconscious by Lacan and the limitations of human language as defined by Derrida. I'm fairly sure that Chomsky had his own confrontations with Derrida in the 70s or 80s. Post-structuralist theory in general is immensely multifaceted, so to understand Zizek it's going to be necessary to comprehend his sources. One scholar you linked to in part 3 of this thread, Adrian Johnston, might be our best hope as an entrée into Zizek and the speculative realists as well. Here's an interview with Johnston that you linked in part 3, and then links to two books by him, one on Zizek's philosophy. Reading the opening pages at the second link might be clarifying.

the interview we looked at earlier:

Interview with Adrian Johnston on Transcendental Materialism | Society and space

The first volume of Johnston's planned trilogy on 'Transcendental Materialism':


Johnston's book on Zizek:

 
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^^^ Worth reading in addition: the amazon sample of the Preface and Introduction to Johnston's book on Zizek's ontology. If you have a kindle app to your computer (which I picked up free a few weeks ago from amazon) you can read a sizeable portion of the introduction. Most helpful.
 
Constance said:
Hi Steve. We've had storms and internet connection problems as a result. I'll read that article and respond. I've been wanting to read something by Zizek.
Click to expand...

we had storms last night and pea-sized hail, hope all is well!
 
Steve, I want to bring forward here one of your posts from the end of part 3 of this thread, at the link below. I've got to go out for several hours but will come back to that post. I also want to link now to the amazon samples of Alva Noe's recent book Varieties of Presence and ask our little company to comment on both links (and the Shapiro paper I linked toward the end of part 3.

Consciousness and the Paranormal — Part 3 | Page 87 | The Paracast Community Forums

Varieties of Presence: Alva Noë: 9780674062146: Amazon.com: Books
 
Constance said:
Steve, I want to bring forward here one of your posts from the end of part 3 of this thread, at the link below. I've got to go out for several hours but will come back to that post. I also want to link now to the amazon samples of Alva Noe's recent book Varieties of Presence and ask our little company to comment on both links (and the Shapiro paper I linked toward the end of part 3.

Consciousness and the Paranormal — Part 3 | Page 87 | The Paracast Community Forums

Varieties of Presence: Alva Noë: 9780674062146: Amazon.com: Books
Click to expand...

I'm still not sure what to make of it ... I think they are trying to do something new, part of this is more like Dadaism than other philosophical revolutions which have been largely one man efforts - and it's telling to me that it took philosophy 100 years to catch up with art in this respect

1. pre and post paradigm shift thinking - post Heideggereans need to parse Being and Time line for line like kids who've seen The Matrix will get a bang out of Plato's Cave ... Heidegger invented language for a one time purpose of conveying ideas and those ideas are now embodied in us (see also Dreyfus' critique of AI) ... this is not to say we don't read Heidegger but that reading Heidegger now needs to take this into account

2. SR, OOO are political and aesthetic movements, group efforts that take advantage of the internet and other media (see What is Philosphy and the role of diagrams, etc in philosophy) the art and literature and political ideas (to include feminism, ecology and queer theory) are integral to understanding the philosophy and its motivations ... just as Dadaism was trying to cope with massive changes in the world, I think these movements are trying to cope with a shift in our (human) place/relationship/privielege in the world ... we are "objects" too:
The ontological thesis asserts that "the real not only exists without us and apart from our conceptualizations of it

but is actually organized or articulated in some manner, in its own right, without any help from us" (68);

and the epistemological thesis claims that "it is in some way possible for us to point to, and speak about, this organized world-without-us without thereby reducing it yet again to our own conceptual schemes" (68)."
 
Catching up on the readings you posted above ... and reading this:

Realist Magic: Objects, Ontology, Causality

It covers the ideas of OOO and causality as an aesthetic phenomenon with interesting examples ... and the opening paragraphs talk about his brother's "descent" into schizophrenia
 
Constance said:
I read the Zizek piece and don't think we can get very far on the basis of this statement alone in comprehending Zizek or his defense of himself against Chomsky's comments about him. Their problem with one another seems to be a case of misunderstanding (despite their roughly common sociopolitical goals) of how to rethink a path toward radical social change and how deeply the subject of potential change must be thought. Chomsky apparently rejects the complexity of Zizek's thinking and writing as it includes insights into the human subconscious by Lacan and the limitations of human language as defined by Derrida. I'm fairly sure that Chomsky had his own confrontations with Derrida in the 70s or 80s. Post-structuralist theory in general is immensely multifaceted, so to understand Zizek it's going to be necessary to comprehend his sources. One scholar you linked to in part 3 of this thread, Adrian Johnston, might be our best hope as an entrée into Zizek and the speculative realists as well. Here's an interview with Johnston that you linked in part 3, and then links to two books by him, one on Zizek's philosophy. Reading the opening pages at the second link might be clarifying.

the interview we looked at earlier:

Interview with Adrian Johnston on Transcendental Materialism | Society and space

The first volume of Johnston's planned trilogy on 'Transcendental Materialism':


I like the quote by Dostoyevsky on free will at the front of this book.

Johnston's book on Zizek:

Click to expand...
 
smcder said:
Catching up on the readings you posted above ... and reading this:

Realist Magic: Objects, Ontology, Causality

It covers the ideas of OOO and causality as an aesthetic phenomenon with interesting examples ... and the opening paragraphs talk about his brother's "descent" into schizophrenia
Click to expand...

Loving this chapter; must get the book. So far I find Morton to be the clearest and most broadly educated writer on OOO and speculative materialism, and he writes beautifully, is a joy to read. I came to this essay after reading this one, a difference of night and day.

http://static1.1.sqspcdn.com/static...cts_v2.pdf?token=cU/BI0HXuUR2D4Igos/SpWJOkjk=
 
Constance said:
Loving this chapter; must get the book. So far I find Morton to be the clearest and most broadly educated writer on OOO and speculative materialism, and he writes beautifully, is a joy to read. I came to this essay after reading this one, a difference of night and day.

http://static1.1.sqspcdn.com/static...cts_v2.pdf?token=cU/BI0HXuUR2D4Igos/SpWJOkjk=
Click to expand...

I'm really glad you like it! I'm enjoying it very much ... he's a pretty good lecturer too, I'm listening to a series he has on OOO
 
Realist Magic: Objects, Ontology, Causality

from the conclusion

Heidegger descended to this ontological depth without much protective gear. He thought he had hit some kind of authentic bedrock, and in a bitterly ironic way, he had. But voyaging at these depths requires some kind of cognitive protection—this is territory that Buddhist mystics swim in, as Heidegger himself intuited. The depth could drive you crazy. Why? Because there are no guarantees. The protection that a Buddhist has at this depth is the protection of emptiness: not a hard suit of armor or tough diving gear, but a light-touch sense of the openness and illusoriness of things, without cynicism.
 
Constance said:
Thanks!!! I was just about to order it from amazon. :)
Click to expand...

You're welcome - I guess that's a smart way to market books ... we charge 10 cents a copy to print at the library from a computer, so it would add up for a book ... and thats one sided print.
 
Constance said:
I read the Zizek piece and don't think we can get very far on the basis of this statement alone in comprehending Zizek or his defense of himself against Chomsky's comments about him. Their problem with one another seems to be a case of misunderstanding (despite their roughly common sociopolitical goals) of how to rethink a path toward radical social change and how deeply the subject of potential change must be thought. Chomsky apparently rejects the complexity of Zizek's thinking and writing as it includes insights into the human subconscious by Lacan and the limitations of human language as defined by Derrida. I'm fairly sure that Chomsky had his own confrontations with Derrida in the 70s or 80s. Post-structuralist theory in general is immensely multifaceted, so to understand Zizek it's going to be necessary to comprehend his sources. One scholar you linked to in part 3 of this thread, Adrian Johnston, might be our best hope as an entrée into Zizek and the speculative realists as well. Here's an interview with Johnston that you linked in part 3, and then links to two books by him, one on Zizek's philosophy. Reading the opening pages at the second link might be clarifying.

the interview we looked at earlier:

Interview with Adrian Johnston on Transcendental Materialism | Society and space

The first volume of Johnston's planned trilogy on 'Transcendental Materialism':


Johnston's book on Zizek:

Click to expand...

He's an interesting figure, Zizek - in the exchange with Chomsky - it was noted how clearly he wrote his essay, that was notable to the reviewer ... and one of Chomsky's complaints was about understanding, about comprehending continental philosophy - the left hemisphere as McGilchrist would argue Chomsky would have that reaction, that it was nonsense because of the way the left hemisphere processes language ... and similarly you can imagine that Zizek got Chomsky and saw he (Chomsky) misunderstood him (Zizek) he interpreted both sides - which is the role of "The Master" the right hemisphere ... so its interesting to see how people lose half their minds or never develop them and how that plays into ones "choice" of philosophy ... and maybe how the world is more and more run with half a brain so to speak ... so it would predict that continental philosophy would be very conflicted and struggle ever for a broader picture while analytical philosophy whittles things down to something manageable ... there is a kind of phobia too as was discussed of Heidegger in the lst chapter of Morton's book ... and we've seen it in spades here on this thread ... just very interesting themes to me right now.
 
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